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[Lotaurus]

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[Captain Lucas Raziel]

Belief

It is said that during the founding of the Grail Wardens, the first Chapter Master Lotaurus Vind himself, received a black chalice on behalf of the Emperor. This grail is kept deep within the fortress monastery and only the Chapter Master is allowed to carry it into battle. The purpose of the chalice is unknown to the average marine, but rumors say it was made to be filled with the blood of Abaddon the Despoiler. This rumor is strengthened given that every Grail Warden has to take an oath to fight every sign of Chaos activities wherever they are shown. The chapter is also part of the Imperial Cult.

 

Woah Woah. Chalice carrying the blood of possible the most Chaos tainted being in the galaxy. Although i like the idea, very very unlikely. firstly, that someone would have to be a pretty damn good warrior to make The Despoiler bleed into a cup.

and second the grail itself. why was it given to him? and i very much doubt the God-Emperor would have given it to them, possibly the High Council would have. but, it would be a potent artifact, why your chapter master other others? why not Calgar, Dante etc?

 

Also, who is your Gene father? Sanguinus i'm guessing? you need to explain a lot more, but a good start :cuss

[Lotaurus]

Good point. Well, of course Abaddon would have to be killed and then the cup would be filled with his blood.

And the chalice was given to them in the name of the emperor not from him personally.

Why him? To be honest: I don't know. I really need to come up with a reason behind that.

 

About the geneseed I'm not sure. I know the chalice thing and the color scheme seem to be very Blood Angel-ish but I would go with Ultramarines I think. But I have to think about it.

[Tutteman]

Good point. Well, of course Abaddon would have to be killed and then the cup would be filled with his blood.

And the chalice was given to them in the name of the emperor not from him personally.

Why him? To be honest: I don't know. I really need to come up with a reason behind that.

 

About the geneseed I'm not sure. I know the chalice thing and the color scheme seem to be very Blood Angel-ish but I would go with Ultramarines I think. But I have to think about it.

 

But Abaddon is alive and kicking...or is this just a rumour? By this I mean in the style that medevial churches would all have relics that were the same body part of the same saint etc? They think they have it...but they don't?

 

He led the 13th Black Crusade which was about 999 M41. So his blood proper is surely out.

[Shinzaren]

No no, I see what he is getting at I think. The Chalice is designed to be filled Abaddon's blood, posthumously. As in, the Grail Wardens are gonna be around when he is finally slain, they'll collect the blood, and offer it to the Emperor. Is that what you are getting at? The Grail is like a mission statement almost. "Take the Grail, find Abaddon, Kill Abaddon, fill the Grail with his blood. Come back. Take a nap for your hard work."

[SonofTerra]

That is how i read it as well. And if that is indeed the intended purpose of the chalice then i think it is quite a good idea. My only question is why abaddon? is the chapter made to find and destroy him from their creation, or is this something that happens later in their history?

[Lotaurus]

"Take the Grail, find Abaddon, Kill Abaddon, fill the Grail with his blood. Come back. Take a nap for your hard work."

That is how i read it as well. And if that is indeed the intended purpose of the chalice then i think it is quite a good idea.

You both are correct. I should rewrite the sentence.

 

My only question is why abaddon? is the chapter made to find and destroy him from their creation, or is this something that happens later in their history?

Because he is a constant threat and maybe one of the biggest enemies of the Imperium. And yes, something like that. That's why they are almost exclusively fight against the Chaos hordes. They hope to find and kill him. I don't know but I think the Black Crusades are not the only offensives he attends so they got a homeworld near a bigger warp storm, where the Chaos emerges and are willingly fighting the traitors everywhere.

Maybe I should make them fleet based, which would make a bit more sense due to their purpose, but with an intact homeworld.

[Tutteman]

Ah fair enough, my bad on the reading :confused:

 

Looks good on that count.

[Lotaurus]

I'm currently thinking about the geneseed thing and I'm not sure if I should take Blood Angel- or Ultramarine-seed.

I had an idea upon the red thirst/black wrath thing in which the chapter stays clean from that but, they gotta mutation that goes a little more far.

After the implants and so on it is possible for the recruit to get mad from the wrath and is overwhelmed by the thirst so he would turn into something like a ghoulish being (not optical, but from the behaviour (maybe their face wreathing in pain, madness and hate)) and would start to consume itself.

Too high-fantasy? Nonsense? Not cool? I do not know. What do you think?

[Captain Juan Juarez]

On the Grail thing;

 

If the idea is "Kill X, fill Grail with blood and return" (concise version) then it sounds very similar to the Master of the Hunt of the White Scars - though blood rather than a head in this case.

[Lotaurus]

Well, I agree. A bit.

I think it's something different to bring heads of your enemies every 25 years or something.

Or if it is your duty (and the duty of the whole chapter) to fill a cup with the blood of one of the most despised enemies known to man. Once and for all.

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Well, I agree. A bit.

I think it's something different to bring heads of your enemies every 25 years or something.

Or if it is your duty (and the duty of the whole chapter) to fill a cup with the blood of one of the most despised enemies known to man. Once and for all.

 

I was pointing out something that struck me, I had wondered if you'd drawn your inspiration from there or if it was a happy coincidence!

[Lotaurus]

No, was more coincidental.

I own the Space Marine Codex, but I don't like the White Scars that much, therefore I skip reading them, I had to look it up myself a few minutes ago.

[Shinzaren]

If you make your chapter a BA successor, they have to have the Red Thirst and Black Rage. There is no possible way your chapter solved a riddle the BA have been attempting to solve for nearly 10,000 years. However, Ultramarines seed can be used for anything, and mutation there would be much acceptable than curing the Flaw.

[Captain Lucas Raziel]

has anyone considered good old Dorn's geneseed? the whole knights aspect is linked to him really, with the Black Templars. also, maybe with the grail, maybe to pass initiation, they have to fill a grail with blood?

[Lotaurus]

Well, the black chalice will be only for the written purpose. May addtitional other grails, could be interesting if every marine has his own, but the black one stands above them all.

[Bjorn Firewalker]

Looks okay so far. Please include fluff explaining WHY each Chapter Master adopts another person's name, instead of trying to make a name for himself. It can be as simple as "Your most hated foe, who you thought dead by your hands? You failed to kill him. He now comes to kill you!" mindf***ing demonstrated with Mkvenner on Gereon (see Gaunt's Ghosts).

[Lotaurus]

Ha, ok. I had to read your post twice to know what you meant, but ok I'm getting it now. :P

I'm currently thinking about making him a bit like a Dreadnought but in a normal SM armor. Maybe with hidden bionics instead of obvious ones.

Maybe he alread lost both legs and arms without the knowledge of anyone but the Adeptus Mechanicus, or something like that.

But it will be included in a future update.

[Captain Lucas Raziel]

Lotaurus Vind was the first Chapter Master of the Grail Wardens and that till 333.M41 where he died in an explosion. The chapter's techmarines salvaged his armor from the battlefield and brought him back to the Fortress-Monastery. In a complicated procedure a human was re-created to look like the High Chaplain and fed with Vind's identity and memory. After he was fully operational, he was given 'his' armor and was able to 'return' to his battle brothers. The Adeptus Mechanicus made the clone more resilient than a normal human and therefore Space Marine. Until today, they keep several other clones in a stasis to replace the old one. Only to hold up high the illusion of an undying leader who survives every catastrophe

 

Dude, you've made The Emperor without the throne. its a good idea, a undying leader, just needs better execution i think. maybe, instead of implanting armor with the brain, actually implant marines. what i'm saying, is Lotauris dies in explosion like you said. they manage to retain his body, but its too badly damaged to intergrate into a Dread. so, they take the guys brain, preserve it in a statis field or something. then, when new chapter masters are selected, they go into this room, which is offlimits to all but a select few, and effectively "upload" the stuff in Lotauris brain, effectively making him Lotauris. obviously, inside that armor, you can never tell the difference.

 

just my opinion :(

[Lotaurus]

Well, the armor is implanted with a human clone, so there's not only the brain.

But I should fluff it out more, but that's pretty much what I wanted to do.

I missed to explain where the memories come from. So there's room for that I think.

[Bjorn Firewalker]

The Imperium has difficulty making functional clones of people, as noted here:

The Art of Replicae

The art of replicae is a means of creating Space Marine warriors without using a recruit as a base for gene-seed transformation. Instead gene-seed is used to create clones of previous battle brothers which can be amalgamations or singular individuals. The Astartes gene-seed is used to artificially produce a fully upgraded mature warrior which possess all the implants and modifications of all astartes, e.g. a secondary heart. Note that excessive use of replicae will result in gene-seed quality deterioration, an example of the results is the Raven Guard chapter.

 

Side Effects

Being one of the many technologies developed in the Dark Age of Technology, a great deal of the processes and techniques to create successful and functioning clones was lost. These include the purification of the blood to be used in the cloning proceedure and the elimination of gene-flaws. Due to the loss of these techniques, mutations and other deformities will occur. These include extra limbs, e.g. tentacles, other growths such as claws and fangs and also mental and psychological changes, including fury and predatory bloodlust. The replicae process can also magnify and accentuate already present gene-flaws. In many cases deformities present in the gene-stock can take disturbing and horrific shapes in the replicae. One example of this is the gene-flaws black rage and red thirst in the Blood Angels chapter, which cause replicae to mutate with the red thirst into vampire like organisms.

It's probably easier to say, "All Chapter Masters adopt the name 'Lotaurus Vind' upon their ascension, to honor the First Chapter Master, and to propogate the legend of the Emperor's Immortal Champion- a legend that strikes terror in the hearts of traitors and foes who thought themselves safe with Vind's death."

[Captain Lucas Raziel]

The Art of Replicae

The art of replicae is a means of creating Space Marine warriors without using a recruit as a base for gene-seed transformation. Instead gene-seed is used to create clones of previous battle brothers which can be amalgamations or singular individuals. The Astartes gene-seed is used to artificially produce a fully upgraded mature warrior which possess all the implants and modifications of all astartes, e.g. a secondary heart. Note that excessive use of replicae will result in gene-seed quality deterioration, an example of the results is the Raven Guard chapter.

 

this is why i pointed to just implanting memories. after all, youre not making a whole marine, just placing memories in.

[Lotaurus]

Ok, I see. Thanks for clearing that up.

I'll reconsider it then upon the next update.

[Tutteman]

Perhaps you could be slightly sick and have the next Chapter Master eat the old one or drink blood or something and adopt the name as suggested above? After all then he'll get the memories?

 

It is a really nice concept, be great to see the finished version :rolleyes:

[Captain Lucas Raziel]

Perhaps you could be slightly sick and have the next Chapter Master eat the old one

 

imagine the poor blokes face :rolleyes:

"So, congrats on becoming chapter master, just one last thing to do..."

"Whats that?"

"Oh, just eat the last chapter master. and by the way, he's a bit crispy. he got hit be a rocket"

 

Nah, i'd say the blood idea is good