14 replies to this topic

[Brother Tyler]

These are my initial ideas for an Apocalypse datafax for a Codex Chapter Eighth Company. I haven’t given much thought to cost or special rules yet:

FORMATION:

1 Captain (must be equipped with a jump pack)
0-1 Chaplain (must be equipped with a jump pack)
10 ten-man Assault Squads

SPECIAL RULES:
For the Chapter!: (as a Battle Company)

Something else might be in order to reflect the ability of loads of Assault Squads to maneuver around the battlefield.

[Brother Shrike]

i just don't think that a chapter would actually deploy its eighth company(same goes for other reserve companies). aren't they used to replace casualties in the battle companies?

[Brother Tyler]

Under normal circumstances, yes. But there have been occasions when Chapters have deployed various of the Reserve Companies as whole units.

[Brother Shrike]

ah. then continue. *starts waving a chainsword around and developing jump packs*

[bannus]

Here is a possible idea for the Eighth Company.

FORMATION:

1 Captain*
0-1 Chaplain*
1 Command Squad*
10 ten-man Assault Squads

SPECIAL RULES:
Victory or Death!:

• * All must be equipped with jump packs. Command Squad may not take any heavy weapons.
• Hold At All Costs
• Blind Barrage

Edited by bannus, 07 February 2008 - 04:29 PM.

[Cale]

I think something like Flank March would be more appropriate than Blind Barrage.

Perhaps: 200-250 points, the units from the Formation can use the Flank March asset, and gain the Furious Assault veteran skill.

[bannus]

I think something like Flank March would be more appropriate than Blind Barrage.

Perhaps: 200-250 points, the units from the Formation can use the Flank March asset, and gain the Furious Assault veteran skill.

I gave Flank March to the Seventh Company since Insignium Astartes specifically mentions this tactic being quite common for that Company.

Flank March is not really that valuable to all jump-pack equipped unit anyway as all of them can Deep Strike.

The biggest issue I found with this formation is the lack of ranged weapons and vulnerability while closing with the enemy - where a smoke screen can really help.

EIGHTH COMPANY

FORMATION:

1 Captain*
0-1 Chaplain*
1 Command Squad*
10 ten-man Assault Squads

SPECIAL RULES:
Victory or Death!:

• * All must be equipped with jump packs. Command Squad may not take any heavy weapons.
• Hold At All Costs
• Careful Planning
• Blind Barrage

A formation of this type will be quite vulnerable as it attempts to close with the enemy, a smoke screen has been selected as their unique asset.

Edited by Brother Tyler, 10 February 2008 - 12:10 AM.
Added bannus' recommendation for the Eighth Company from the closed consolidated thread. -Brother Tyler

[Cale]

I agree that the smoke screen would help, I'm just not sure how appropriate it really is.

Also, Flank March is awesome for Assault Marines. Deep Strike? Pfft. Deep Striking anywhere useful--especially on a crowded board--is a huge risk, and they can't assault after doing it. Assault Marines might as well not be able to Deep Strike for all the good it does them--I've seen it hurt them more than I've seen it help them.

With Flank March, you get assaults as soon as they come in against anything within 18" of the board. That's a huge area to threaten. Flank March is fantastic for Assault Marines. Deep Strike doesn't cut it at all.

That being said, if you've already given Flank March to the seventh (and I agree that's appropriate) the Eighth will need something else...

Maybe Furious Assault and the ability to re-roll the scatter dice when Deep Striking? I still think Flank March would be better, but at least they would stand a decent chance of ending up on the table, close to where you want them, and alive after using their gimmick.

And, on the other hand, Blind Barrage really would be very good for them...

I guess I'm conflicted on this. The only part I'm not conflicted on is the notion that Deep Strike is somehow even vaguely comparable to Flank March in terms of awesomeness. It just aint.

[Brother Tyler]

With regard to the formation, I agree with bannus' suggestion for the Command Squads and independent characters taking jump packs.

I'm leaving special rules/strategic assets alone for now until we get the formation finalized.

[Brother Jim]

How about giving them Strategic Redeployment? They fire up their jump packs and relocate en masse...

[Gillyfish]

I agree with the proposed formation content. Now, this may complicate things, but would an option be for the formation to deploy with jump packs OR from drop pods Or from Rhinos? It does fit the background.

I've been looking at old second edition Epic company cards and that has the captain and squad in a Rhino whilst everyone else has jump packs. Not necessarily practical, but it does mena that gamers don't have to model up a jump-pack command squad that they can't use in normal games.

Just a few thoughts to throw into the mix - I'm happy for disagreement!

[Brother Jim]

I've been looking at old second edition Epic company cards and that has the captain and squad in a Rhino whilst everyone else has jump packs. Not necessarily practical, but it does mena that gamers don't have to model up a jump-pack command squad that they can't use in normal games.

Well, one can always magnetize the Marine's body, normal back pack, and jump packs and swap them out as needed. Doesn't matter to me though, as Blood Angels honor guard (command squads) can take jump packs. My vote would be for the captain and command squad to be equipped with jump packs.

[Brother Tyler]

At this point, I think it's safe to say that the formation bannus proposed has been agreed upon.

Personally, I think that the formation itself should focus on the most generic version of the Eighth Company - all jump packs. While the fluff allows for Rhinos and Drop Pods, both of those change the nature of the company considerably, making applicaton of strategic assets difficult to assign/justify. Assault Squads are primarily identified with their jump packs, so the easiest solution would be focus the datafax around the jump pack equipped Eighth Company.

Personally, I don't like the concept of the smoke screen. The company is what it is, and that's a company of Assault Squads. There are weaknesses in this, but I think that the datafax strategic assets should focus around the synergy of using Assault Squads, weaknesses and all. The company is noted for its mobility, so I would focus around that.

[bannus]

Personally, I think that the formation itself should focus on the most generic version of the Eighth Company - all jump packs. While the fluff allows for Rhinos and Drop Pods, both of those change the nature of the company considerably, making applicaton of strategic assets difficult to assign/justify. Assault Squads are primarily identified with their jump packs, so the easiest solution would be focus the datafax around the jump pack equipped Eighth Company.

None of the Datasheets restrict the options available to specified units in any way. I don't think this one should be any different. If a player wishes to deploy some or all of his Assault Squads in Rhinos or Drop Pods (assuming the army is allowed to do this in normal games of 40K), then it should not be prohibited.

The price of the units remain fixed and (with the squad size being fixed too), the Rhinos and Drop Pods will not be bargains anyway.

[utilityzero]

see, if you go with the model of the DA and BA codexes, an assault squad can exchange its jump packs for a transport for free anyway, so it's already part of their rules and you use that for your guys here, although i do agree that requiring them to be fielded as assault marines fits, since you're talking about a company that is normally fielded in bits and pieces anyway, this represents them getting that rare chance to do what they do best.

as for assets, the strategic redeployment sounds ok, but can jump packs really do that? i mean, you could argue that they jump to get picked up by a low flying thunderhawk or something and that sits alright with me, but if JP could just bound you to the other side of a board, they'd be able to do that already, right? i like vital objective actually, i mean, why else would you be sending in 10 squads of CQB specific troops if not to take and hold an important location? careful planning also looks nice for obvious reasons.

you could add a rule that allows the other assault squads to home in on the command squad if they deep strike. or, in lieu of careful planning, what about something that allows the entire formation to deep strike at once like lysander.

Edited by utilityzero, 24 April 2008 - 06:11 PM.