Jump to content

Welcome to The Bolter and Chainsword
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

Whirlwind Cleansing Unit.


  • Please log in to reply
11 replies to this topic

#1
Morticon

Morticon

    ++ FILIUS VINDICOR ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 13,070 posts
  • Location:Beijing, China
Whirlwind Cleansing Unit
+50pts plus models

FORMATION:

3-5 Whirlwinds.
1 Whirlwind must be chosen as the command vehicle.

SPECIAL RULES:


Combined Fire: Much like the vindicator line breaker squad, 3 or more Whirlwinds can combine fire for a more devastating effect.

The combined fire of 3 or more Whirlwinds use the Apocalyptic Barrage blast marker when firing, rolling as many times on the template as there are Whirlwinds in the formation.

Shell Shock: In addition, any Whirlwinds after the third add cumulative -1 penalties for the incoming ordnance pinning checks. (ie: to a maximum of -3)

Command Deplyoment: All whirlwinds must deploy within 18" of the command vehicle.

NOTE:

* The whirlwinds fire at regular range and may not be combined with the Suppression Force.
* All whirlwinds in the formation must use the same type of ammunition.

Edited by Morticon, 12 November 2007 - 12:10 AM.

Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#2
refuse

refuse

    ++ IMPERATOR PUERILIS ++

  • ++ MODERATI CEDO ++
  • 12,414 posts
  • Location:USA, MA.
  • Faction: Aquila Peurelis
I think the cost (initial + units) needs to be upped.

Is that the same cost for vindicators? I think it is cheaper for vindies as they have a shorter range.

#3
Tokunator

Tokunator

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 600 posts
  • Location:Luxembourg, Europe
Yes, but Vindicators can level buildings and are S10 AP2, whereas the Whirlwinds only shoot S5 AP4 shells and can't destroy buildings. So the price seems alright, especially as the Barrage rule only facilitates firing the battery (only one scatter...)
Remember the real fun starts after your baal has lost his weaponry. There are few things more awesome then ramming your baals 18" into another tank.(oooh it sounds dirty )
No, only if it is ramming the other tank in the rear armor is it dirty. Otherwise it is just odd.

'If they are the best warriors of the Ork race, why are they called NOOBS?' (last words of an annoying WoW kid.)

Kirk: 'This is a very dangerous mission. It is very likely that one of us is not coming back. The away-team will consist of me, Mr. Spock. Dr. McCoy .... and Ensign Ricky' Ensign Ricky: 'Oh crap.'

#4
refuse

refuse

    ++ IMPERATOR PUERILIS ++

  • ++ MODERATI CEDO ++
  • 12,414 posts
  • Location:USA, MA.
  • Faction: Aquila Peurelis

Yes, but Vindicators can level buildings and are S10 AP2, whereas the Whirlwinds only shoot S5 AP4 shells and can't destroy buildings. So the price seems alright, especially as the Barrage rule only facilitates firing the battery (only one scatter...)

But it makes them use the bigger Apoc template instead of one smaller template, so brutal for hordes when you consider the cost (50 pts)

So not just S5 AP4 (Brutal against hordes), but it also makes the template bigger.

#5
Cale

Cale

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 2,078 posts
  • Location:Indiana
Er, Refuse, using the Apocalyptic Barrage template doesn't make each individual shot bigger. It has some advantages, namely that the "scatter" is much more predictable and what would be partials are automatically hit (instead of rolled for) but it's not actually a bigger template, as it were. Each shot still only hits a 5" diameter circle's worth of guys.
Crusading against people who think they can just ignore the portions of the rules they don't like since before I even read R.O.V's signature!

#6
Tokunator

Tokunator

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 600 posts
  • Location:Luxembourg, Europe
Right, as Cale said, the Apocalyptic Barrage template is the one I like to call the 'Flower of Death'.

So you simply hit the area with a couple of grenades scattering once and then resolving all of the hits by rolling one dice per tank, whereas regular fire would force one scatter per tank. And wasting time is a killer in Apocalypse.
Remember the real fun starts after your baal has lost his weaponry. There are few things more awesome then ramming your baals 18" into another tank.(oooh it sounds dirty )
No, only if it is ramming the other tank in the rear armor is it dirty. Otherwise it is just odd.

'If they are the best warriors of the Ork race, why are they called NOOBS?' (last words of an annoying WoW kid.)

Kirk: 'This is a very dangerous mission. It is very likely that one of us is not coming back. The away-team will consist of me, Mr. Spock. Dr. McCoy .... and Ensign Ricky' Ensign Ricky: 'Oh crap.'

#7
refuse

refuse

    ++ IMPERATOR PUERILIS ++

  • ++ MODERATI CEDO ++
  • 12,414 posts
  • Location:USA, MA.
  • Faction: Aquila Peurelis

Er, Refuse, using the Apocalyptic Barrage template doesn't make each individual shot bigger. It has some advantages, namely that the "scatter" is much more predictable and what would be partials are automatically hit (instead of rolled for) but it's not actually a bigger template, as it were. Each shot still only hits a 5" diameter circle's worth of guys.

So if you have 3 whirlwinds, is the apocalypse template bigger?

Posted Image
(I assume this is the one in the upper right).


FORMATION:

3-5 Whirlwinds.
1 Whirlwind must be chosen as the command vehicle.

So if I have 3 whirlwinds, I get better then 1 better. If I have 4 I get the middle (center) of the template bigger.

I know it doesn't make each bigger, but for a number < 3, it increases the area under the template.

#8
Cale

Cale

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 2,078 posts
  • Location:Indiana
Yes it is the one in the upper right.

The apocalyptic barrage template works like this:

It is constructed of five overlapping 5" templates. These are each denoted separately, and marked with numerals one through six.

The four around the outside are marked one, two, three, and four, while the one in the center is marked five and six.

When you fire a weapon using the Apocalyptic Barrage template, you simply place the template, oriented however you want it to be oriented, over a model in the target unit (that model has to be in range of the gun). The template doesn't scatter, in the traditional sense. Roll one die for each 'shot' the weapon takes. In most weapons the number of dice you roll is denoted by a numeral in parentheses after the phrase "Apocalyptic Barrage."

Anyway, you roll the dice, and each die produces a hit against every model touched by the corresponding circle on the template--you don't roll for partials, you just hit them.

What is being suggested is that the Whirlwinds combine their fire into an Apocalyptic Barrage (x) where x is the number of Whirlwinds combining their fire. It doesn't make each individual shot bigger--they're still each five inches--it just makes their 'scatter', as I said, more predictable, and allows them to automatically turn partials into hits.

In point of fact, it doesn't increase the area of models affected by nearly the amount that the Vindicator Linebreaker Squadron does. It doesn't actually increase the area at all, only makes the area on the circumference of each shot better (by turning partials into fulls) whereas the Linebreaker squadron increases its area affected from 58.88 square inches (from three five inch templates) to 78.5 square inches (approximately) from one ten inch template.

Edited by Cale, 19 November 2007 - 10:45 PM.

Crusading against people who think they can just ignore the portions of the rules they don't like since before I even read R.O.V's signature!

#9
Morticon

Morticon

    ++ FILIUS VINDICOR ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 13,070 posts
  • Location:Beijing, China
Yo !

Yup yup. Thats exactly it.

Basically, I didnt want just a regular Vindy style thing of simply making the template bigger. Even though that would be cool - I felt the way the Apocalyptic Barrage template worked would be more in theme of a salvo of missiles coming down.

That and I felt my opponents would be more than welcome to use that datafax since its not too over-powered but still makes use of fun Apoc rules/templates.

The only benefit this has over just using 3-5 regular templates is that the scatter (after the 1st dice) is substantially reduced.

The -1 Ld modifier may be worth a few more points -but i wouldnt say more than 75 for this ability.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#10
refuse

refuse

    ++ IMPERATOR PUERILIS ++

  • ++ MODERATI CEDO ++
  • 12,414 posts
  • Location:USA, MA.
  • Faction: Aquila Peurelis

What is being suggested is that the Whirlwinds combine their fire into an Apocalyptic Barrage (x) where x is the number of Whirlwinds combining their fire. It doesn't make each individual shot bigger--they're still each five inches--it just makes their 'scatter', as I said, more predictable, and allows them to automatically turn partials into hits.

Ok.
Thanks. Didn't know that.

Ok, then fine. I thought 3 -> 5. Guess I have to read that book. :)

#11
Onisuzume

Onisuzume

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 4,415 posts
  • Location:Europe.
  • Faction: Angels of Destruction.
Still; its pretty brutal against hordes.
Especially for the DA/BA whirlwinds. (Incendiary Castellan Missiles)

Also, maybe allow the command tank to be upgraded to a Land Raider Helios?
Legio Angelis Tenebrae ex Vastatio: The Angels of Destruction
The heretic shall reap as he has sown - the bitter harvest of vengeance and death!
My Warhammer 40,000 oldschool game music playlist.

#12
Cale

Cale

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 2,078 posts
  • Location:Indiana
No problem, Refuse. Glad to help :tu:.

And yes, you probably should read the Apocalypse book at some point. It's actually a pretty good suppliment.


Onisuzume:
Yes, it is going to be good against hordes--it's just not going to be that much better than however many Whirlwinds acting independantly. Remember that you're paying for the Whirlwinds independantly--the cost being discussed here is the cost for the formation upgrade, which should only include the value of the special abilities being given to the Whirlwinds in the formation.

It kills lots of infantry, but three Whirlwinds does that anyway--the question is how much more effective the Whirlwinds will be as part of the formation than they would be on their own. The answer is, "some, but not a lot." I think 50 or 75 points is appropriate.

Remember, it's only 50 points to give any number of Land Raiders the ability to ignore Crew Shaken results. Combine that with Extra Armour, and they're ignoring Crew Shaken results and Crew Stunned results (since Crew Stunned is reduced to Crew Shaken, and Crew Shaken is ignored). That seems better, really.

Edited by Cale, 20 November 2007 - 02:08 PM.

Crusading against people who think they can just ignore the portions of the rules they don't like since before I even read R.O.V's signature!




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users