13 replies to this topic

[Epistolary Exander]

tAfter reading the ulitmate DIY chapter creation thread & the IA: Legio, the current article seems to have some flaws with it. Im not terribly great at fluff, but do know what the basic taboos are, its for reason why Im was wondering if everyone here on the B&C would like to help create new/edit the IA: Legio.

My main problem is the role inquisition & the organisation on the current Legio. The inquisition wouldnt hide the Legio after they found ut about, they woul have to report it to the High Lords. The High Lords would formalise the chapter existiance, but have it so closely attached to the inquistion upsets the political power within the High Lords. The High Lords would probably have these ties weakened to that the chapter often works with Ordos Hereticus in actions agaisnt questionable chapters.

Also the Legio seem to be filling in the role of the Ordos Hereticus & their chapter militants, in regards to policing the Astartes. This rather at odds with the majority of the Astartes who do not meddle with the greater Imperium. The policing of astartes is done by the Inquisition, which polices everyone else, the Astartes are not above them.

I can see why the Codex wuould be used to form basis of the Chapter, as it allows the inducted brethren to work together quickly & efficiently. Why would change from after the schism? The vast bulk of the Legio's brethren come from Guilliman's & Dorn's geneseed stock. These are the stocsk which are known to regidly follow the codex, to extreme in some cases. Why would brother want to go against the word of their Primarch.

Also the current system is more remicent of the legion's with the 3 huge companies, the Imperium moved away from this model to limit the damage done by rebelion. Why would a chapter that aims to hold the Astartes together go this way. Also you've effectively raised the fighting strength of the Legio by 50% with this organisation change, which would need the appropriate rise in weapons, armour & ships. Aswel as more marines from the allaince. Why woud the Mechanicus provide the increase of provisions & ships to a chaper, which has known traitors, especially at a time of inreasing invasions on Forge Worlds & loss production ability. The creation of marine equipment require's vat resources.

Also the inquistion would at the least not allow the Legio to alter its organisation in in an attempt to avoif furthur betrayals. At the msot the Inquisition would have the Legio destroyed to not allow the rot to grow.

Im sure there are other areas that could be tweaked, its for reason why Im asking for help to amend these discrepancies. I dont intend to write an IA:Legio I dont think I can do it justice, im just providing the platform to produce a high quality IA, from which everyone on the forum can be happy with.

All input would be appreciated, Exander.

[HellChyld]

the Legio is the Legio. its not a chapter like normal marine and will never be formalized like one. so the liber article you referer to doesn't work with what the Legio is. A updated version of the IA is being worked on I think but having it fit to the Liber article will never happen.

[Epistolary Exander]

Its seems slightly double standards to have that assumption, no chapter is above the laws of the Imperium. Look at the Steel Confessors, the Mechanicus founded them secretely & when the High Lords found out they made the chaper comply like every other chaper. It just seem arrogant, to have 1 chapter exempt from normal fluff taboos. If I posted an IA like on that on Liber it would rightly get slated.

[Epistolary Exander]

Rant over, I hear some moderati are working on the IA Legio. This is an example to iron any kinks with the IA & make it a product of the forum.

[HellChyld]

The Legio is in form like the deathwatch. you dont see the High lords making them Comply? also the Legio is as older then this Variant of the forum. I doubt it will change due to an article thats younger then it is.

[CDR Grendelwulf]

"Give us your strong, your pure, your fighting masses yearning to be at War!"
--- proposed motto for The Legio!

Nephren-ka Posted Today, 09:23 AM
the Legio is the Legio. its not a chapter like normal marine and will never be formalized like one.

It is what it is and that's all that there is?
Oh, I'd like to think of the B&C, and by association its' Legio, is much more than that. There has to be enough creative energy in our members to devise a method of reflecting this somehow. It could be interesting to hear some members' interpretations on it....even if the greater powers that reside herein are working on an update of their own. Until then, why not throw some mental logs on the fire.

Epistolary Exander Posted Today, 08:03 AM
After reading the ulitmate DIY chapter creation thread & the IA: Legio, the current article seems to have some flaws with it. Im not terribly great at fluff, but do know what the basic taboos are...

Well, we transcend the taboo here in the B&C...just as much as we honour all that GW has established in the 40k universe. It is a veritable Forge mixing new and old ideas, inspirations, etc that we all draw from in some fashion or other.

Nephren-ka Posted Today, 06:39 PM
The Legio is in form like the deathwatch. you dont see the High lords making them Comply? also the Legio is as older then this Variant of the forum. I doubt it will change due to an article thats younger then it is.

The Deathwatch is GW's answer for an all-encompassing chapter. This is the B&C! (trumpets sounding!)

What is the purpose of the B&C? How could this translate to Liber-terms?
Moderati as Company Commanders? Chaplains?
Traditional, yet experimental... but always giving homage to the creative & the tactical elements of its brethren.

Let us have at it then! What's the worst we could do?

Ciao,
CDR Grendelwulf

Edited by CDR Grendelwulf, 25 January 2008 - 12:14 AM.

[Epistolary Exander]

The deathwatch & grey knights are exempt from the rules governing the rest of the astartes because they chamber militants of the 2 Ordos of the inquisition. The inquistion are allowed to have the chamber militants how they see fit, the High Lords do this because of the shadow wars fought by the inquisition. The inquisition cannot extend those liberties to the Legio, as they are not chamber militant. The inquisition would be hard pressed to make them 1 as it would upset the balance of power within the imperium.

[Luku]

An extra 1500 marines governed by all three ordos fairly would not tip the balance of power....

[StratoKhan]

The Legio is a chance for every member's Chapter to be part of the same fighting organisation. It's a way to establish an extra community link between the forum members.

It might not be wholly consistent with established background.

Fair enough.

But the Legio should be understood more as a vehicle for interaction, than an attempt to create a canonical DIY Chapter. And incidentally, it still manages to be quite a 'cool' organisation, and its scheme and insignia are very nice indeed.

Were it a normal Chapter, the opportunities mentioned above would not be possible. No Frater would have a link to the Legio, as he does now.

[Epistolary Exander]

If the Legio is only a platform for which members can interact through, then I can see why it exsists outside the canonical framework. But I still have issues. The inquisition, nor the brethren from codex chapters (which from the vast bulk of the chapter) allow the organisational change that has been implemented.

[Sigismund Himself]

Why? It's just like the Deathwatch. I don't seem to see any marines objecting to it's structure. If they don't like it, they don't have to send anybody.

[Brother Tyler]

The Index Astartes: Legio article has long been under revision. There's pretty much nothing new in the issues that Exander brought up - we've known since before the article was written that there were certain inconsistencies with the Legio's fluff and GW canon, but we also understand that this is a homegrown Chapter for a website mascot Chapter. This isn't a Chapter that is likely to ever make its way into GW canon. So we're willing to sacrifice some elements of meshing with canon in the interest of attaining our goals of having a Chapter that is representative of our site and members. We're doing our best to mesh with canon fluff everywhere possible, but even our revision will include elements that don't sit well with fluff based on our goals for the Legio (and the fact that we have some solidly established history for the Legio with a number of Arena of Death storylines).

Interesting side note: the Legio color scheme is quite similar to the now-defunct "Field Police" that were presented in the Rogue Trader era. I'm not sure if this means anything, but it's something the mod staff noticed recently during some recent research.

[CDR Grendelwulf]

Brother Tyler
Interesting side note: the Legio color scheme is quite similar to the now-defunct "Field Police" that were presented in the Rogue Trader era. I'm not sure if this means anything, but it's something the mod staff noticed recently during some recent research.

Wow, I never noticed that before. Nor has it ever stood out that 'Field Police' was a separate designation from Trooper, Vet Sgt, Capt, etc... . Presumably, every Chapter could have its own Black-Guard contingent or squad. An interesting idea. Thanks for the illumination, Brother Tyler.

Ciao,
CDR Grendelwulf

[Epistolary Exander]

The inquisition are aware of the Legio but the High Lords do not. The council of inquisitors includes members of ordos, that measn that it would have at some point included members of inquisitor faction. At some point in the Legios past an inquisitor would have informed the High Lords about this as it their duty to. When the High Lords find out that the Fabricator General & Inquisitor Lord Terran had hid the Legio from them, the resulting upheaval would require a great sacrifice. The other High Lords would not allow the mechanicus to control 2 chapters & the inquistion has its own have their chamber miliants for batlte needs, why would another be needed. At best the Legio would be stripped of inquistorial connections & forced to sire new chapters due its shared geneseed. At worst the Fabricator General & Inquiistor Lord Terran betray the Legio to over High Lords, by giving them the needed to attack the rogue chapter.

For me the Legio would be alot more characterful if they were totally independent from all over institutions. As in the Legio is equipped completely from the Astartes. They would be like guardian angels hidding in the shadows away from imperial authorities, they only do this because they know the chapter would be destroyeed if inquisition or High Lords found out. The legio would strike out at the general enemies of the Imperium avoiding major combat warzone & the inquisition found there. The chapters of the alliance would obliged to provide ships, men, materials everything for the chapter, to ensure that the Legio cna effectively police the astartes. This would be easy for the Astartes as they are separate from over imperial bodies, you can manipulate the corruption of the system to get the needed equipment. In this way Legio would be the unsung heroes of the Imperium fighting the long hidden war & to an extent policing the Astartes. This idea if properly developed would provide alot evocative setting for the Legio, than what is the current pretence for the chapter.

Edited by Epistolary Exander, 27 January 2008 - 06:36 PM.