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Chaos 2250 (suggestions and comments requested)


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9 replies to this topic

#1
Psyan 2

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DP - Wings, MoS, Lash
DP - Wings, MoK
Greater Daemon

Dreadnought - ML, DCCW, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor
Dreadnought - ML, DDCW, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor

10 CSM w/ PF Champ, x2 Meltas, IoCG, Rhino
10 CSM w/ Champ, x2 Plasma, IoCG, Rhino w/ Extra Armor, Combi-Melta
8 Berserkers w/PF Champ, Rhino w/ Extra Armor
5 Plague Marines w/ PF Champ, x2 Plasma

6 Raptors w/ LC Champ, x2 Meltas, IoCG

Defiler w/ extra DCCW, TL Heavy Flamer
6 Havocs w/ x3 AutoCannons, IoCG
2 Obliterators

2248 pts

I'm considering replacing the Havocs and the Oblits with an equally priced pair of Predators:
Predator w/ TL LC turret, x2 LC sponsons, extra armor
Predator w/ AC, x2 HB Sponsons, Havoc Launcher, extra armor

It seems that I might get more dakka and resilience out of the Preds and that they'll go with my list a little better.

What does everyone think about this and the list in general? The idea is that I'll be putting a fair number of things on the table that require AT fire and that my opponent will have trouble dealing with them all before they reach his lines.

#2
minigun762

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DP - Wings, MoS, Lash
DP - Wings, MoK
Greater Daemon

I've said it before, I don't like Greater Daemons. They require you to use Raptors with a naked Champion to get them within range and that means that they're costing you atleast 135 points. The two DPs are fine, I like Khornish DPs personally, cheap and effective.

Dreadnought - ML, DCCW, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor
Dreadnought - ML, DDCW, Heavy Flamer, Extra Armor

Dreadnoughts are already kinda funky, so if you're going to use them I think keeping them dirt cheap is the key. In that light I'd drop the Extra Armor and either the Missile Launcher or Heavy Flamer.

10 CSM w/ PF Champ, x2 Meltas, IoCG, Rhino
10 CSM w/ Champ, x2 Plasma, IoCG, Rhino w/ Extra Armor, Combi-Melta
8 Berserkers w/PF Champ, Rhino w/ Extra Armor
5 Plague Marines w/ PF Champ, x2 Plasma

I like the CSM squds, other then the Extra Armor on the Rhinos, Berserkers look good too. I think the Plague Marines could use some extra bodies and if you drop Extra Armor you should be able to afford more. Less than 40 guys seems small for a 2250 game however. I'd consider adding in a 5th Troop squad.


6 Raptors w/ LC Champ, x2 Meltas, IoCG

Good squad but to me, its too small for the Champion and the wargear seems off. I'd go with Claws/Flamers for infantry killing or Melta/Power Fist for tank/MC busting. I'd also consider making the squad 8-10 Raptors.


Defiler w/ extra DCCW, TL Heavy Flamer
6 Havocs w/ x3 AutoCannons, IoCG
2 Obliterators

Defiler and Obliterators are good but Havocks seem kinda small to me. I'd replace them with a Predator, probably a Combi-Predator (AutoCannon/LasCannons) as you get 3 48" range weapons for cheaper.
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#3
Psyan 2

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With regard to the Dreadnoughts.. the Heavy Flamers cost 5pts and the Missile Launchers are free. Even with the Extra Armor, they only cost 120 pts apiece. I could get rid of the extra armor, but it might slow me down and prevent me from getting them into assault, where they belong.

Also, you'll notice that one of my CSM Champions isn't toting a Power Weapon.. I'm intending on him becoming the Daemonhost and the rest of his squad (with their plasma guns) become a rapid fire/forward objective holding squad.

I'd love to have more Raptors, but they're not very high in my list of priorities. I'd probably be sending them forward with the DPs as a mobile QRF.. and I'd be very surprised if I ever have any of them left at the end of the game.

#4
minigun762

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With regard to the Dreadnoughts.. the Heavy Flamers cost 5pts and the Missile Launchers are free. Even with the Extra Armor, they only cost 120 pts apiece. I could get rid of the extra armor, but it might slow me down and prevent me from getting them into assault, where they belong.

Oh I know, the Heavy Flamer/Missile Launcher change is more because the weapons don't really fit together (atleast in my book) one is very short ranged which means you're probably better going with 2x DCCWs while the other is better at sniping enemy units. Of course my main concern was the Extra Armor, back in the old days it would have been an automatic addition, but its just soo expensive now that I'll take my chances without it.

Also, you'll notice that one of my CSM Champions isn't toting a Power Weapon.. I'm intending on him becoming the Daemonhost and the rest of his squad (with their plasma guns) become a rapid fire/forward objective holding squad.

Yeah I saw that and it could work. My worry is that Greater Daemons rely on a fair amount of luck to be successful. If you are lucky and your unit is in place at the right time, they are a nasty assault unit. If they burst too early, you have a slow guy walking up the board.

I'd love to have more Raptors, but they're not very high in my list of priorities. I'd probably be sending them forward with the DPs as a mobile QRF.. and I'd be very surprised if I ever have any of them left at the end of the game.

Yeah they're going to die to be sure, thats why I was thinking more bodies could help. Good use of them though.
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#5
Brother Gothard

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I have three things to say, listed in order of importance:

1- Why dreadnoughts, when almost any other choice for the same points will be more effective (you can say "oh 1 in 6 that'll never happen" but it actually happens in every game I've played with a chaos dread, and a friendly model ALWAYS dies).

2- PM squad is too small for a PF champ. Drop the champ or boost the squad

3- Now that we're in 5th, I think predators with sponsons are really awkward. Therefore, I would say that 6 Havocs with 3 ACs is just as effective as 1 predator with 1 ac and 2x HB, and 2 oblits is WAY more effective than a predator with 3x LC. Therefore I would keep the current HS setup, and forgo the predators.

Cheers!
"And you run and you run to catch up with the sun, but it's sinking and racing to come up behind you again"

#6
chillin

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3- Now that we're in 5th, I think predators with sponsons are really awkward.


Why so ?

#7
minigun762

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3- Now that we're in 5th, I think predators with sponsons are really awkward.


Why so ?


Yeah I'm going to have to agree with Chillin on this one.
Predators went from being mobile gun platforms in 4th Edition to mechanized Havocks in essence. However the big benefit is that now you can be static and still shoot at things due to the changes in LOS. Sure the target will get a cover save, but I'd rather that I was able to fire at something with a cover save then not fire at all.
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#8
Psyan 2

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I went with the Dreads because I have a nicely converted pair of them that I've never fielded before.. they're kinda what this list is about. I put the missile launchers on them because they cost the same as the additional CCW and give the Dread a way to inflict some damage if they get immobilized before they reach assault. The Dreads both have Heavy Flamers because I wanted them to be armed to face hordes (Orks primarily come to mind) and because I do want them to get up close and personal. Early in most matches, I will probably just run them forward.

I have a single Predator painted and another that I've yet to put together.. and I've never fielded one of those, either. I'm usually a big fan of Havocs and Obliterators.. I used to always run 3 units of infiltrating Havocs and a full sized squad of Oblits (when they were still Elites) back in the last edition. I'm trying to experiment with units I didn't use much in the past. I won't argue that the Preds are more effective than the Havocs and Oblits.. but I'm thinking that they might fit into the list a little better and possibly draw some fire off my Dreads and Rhinos. That's the real reason I'm considering using them.

I'd love to add a few models to that squad of Plague Marines... but what would I get rid of to make the points? I'm planning on having them defend my home objective, so I won't be putting them in a Rhino... and I've also considered using Noise Marines with a few extra Sonic Blasters instead of the PMs. Does anyone have any ideas/suggestions?

Edited by Psyan 2, 03 April 2009 - 02:02 AM.


#9
minigun762

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I went with the Dreads because I have a nicely converted pair of them that I've never fielded before.. they're kinda what this list is about. I put the missile launchers on them because they cost the same as the additional CCW and give the Dread a way to inflict some damage if they get immobilized before they reach assault. The Dreads both have Heavy Flamers because I wanted them to be armed to face hordes (Orks primarily come to mind) and because I do want them to get up close and personal.


I personally would love to hear how your DCCW/Missile Dreads work out for you. Toss up some battle reports when you get a chance.
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#10
Psyan 2

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Well... I'm going to be in Vegas drinking beer for the next two weeks, but when I sober up and the hangover wears off, I'll seek out a few vict.. err.. opponents at the LGS and let you know how it turns out.