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Inquisitor Retinue and Land Raider


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#1
BattleCaptain

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Just a couple of quick questions from a confused player:

1) Can an inquisitor lord take a land raider as a transport without a retinue? Codex Daemonhunters seems to prohibit an inquisitor lord from taking a land raider without a retinue. However, it would seem inane for the inquisitor not to be able to bring along a land raider without having to take his entire posse.

2) The Forge World IA:2 inquisitorial land raider says that a land raider may be taken as a transport by an inquisitor and his retinue. It does not, however, contain the same seemingly restrictive text as Codex Daemonhunters. Thus, would it be possible for a lone inquisitor to take a FW IA:2 land raider without a retinue?

Thanks for your time. :tu:

#2
Lungboy

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The codex is extremely clear, the Inquisitor needs a retinue. IA2 does nothing to overrule that as far as i can see.

#3
Grand Master Tyrak

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You can take a Land Raider for an Inquisitor without the need for a Retinue. However, Inquisitor Lords MUST have a retinue of 3-12. Elite slot Inquisitors MAY have a retinue of 0-6, and both types of Inquisitor may select a Land Raider as a Transport.

Edited by Grand Master Tyrak, 05 April 2009 - 04:48 PM.

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#4
BattleCaptain

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Thanks, Lungboy, and Grandmaster Tyrok. :drool: However, your opinions seem to be diametrically opposed when it comes to the Elite-slot Inquisitor. Do you suggest I send an e-mail to the rules guy at GW's customer service department? ;)

#5
Lungboy

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You can take a Land Raider for an Inquisitor without the need for a Retinue. However, Inquisitor Lords MUST have a retinue of 3-12. Elite slot Inquisitors MAY have a retinue of 0-6, and both types of Inquisitor may select a Land Raider as a Transport.


"If the Inquisitor has a retinue...." seems pretty clear to me. Unless you use a HS Raider.

#6
BattleCaptain

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I understand what you mean, Lungboy. However, the wording itself is not retrictive (ie., it did not say "Only if"). The reason I ask this is that I prefer to have my inquisitor mixed in with a Grey Knight squad, in order to add an additional Strength 6 power weapon (thunderhammer) as well as additional ablative Wounds since I can allocate a Wound or two to him (I usually give him artificer armor and a storm shield or icon of the just).

My taking a lone inquisitor with a land raider was never a problem until my brother recently re-read Codex Daemonhunters and questioned the viability of my action. We resolved to seek a neutral and more knowledgeable audience to adjudicate. :D

#7
JamesI

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The wording is clear. An inquistor can not take a land raider unless he has a retinue.

Also, deamonhunter transports are dedicated transports, can't put another unit in it. So, no grey knights in an inquisitor land raider (IA2 may change this though).

Just get a Grey Knight land raider and attach the inquistor to a GK squad.
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#8
maturin

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Seems to me that if the inquisitor didn't need a retinue to take a Land Raider, GW would simply have left the phrase "If the Inquisitor has a retinue..." out of the sentence entirely. Otherwise its presence makes no sense grammatically or otherwise. Therefore the only reason they would have included the phrase is with restrictive intent.

But just ask your opponent - maybe they won't care. Or alternatively, take a familiar and get him killed off at the earliest opportunity, leaving your inquisitor free to join up with the knights. :D

#9
Inquisitor =D=

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Also, deamonhunter transports are dedicated transports, can't put another unit in it. So, no grey knights in an inquisitor land raider (IA2 may change this though).


While you are correct about the Inquisitor needing a retinue to purchase one you are incorrect here sir. So long as the Inquisitor who purchased the land raider has joined with the grey knight squad they may catch a ride in his pimp-mobile. :D

Yeah, I have my codex right here and the wording is clear even if the intent was not. "If the Inquisitor has a retinue..." -_- Seems air-tight to me. Oh well, back to using the raider holding the boys in grey.

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QUOTE (number6 @ May 22 2008, 07:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We are the Ordo Malleus. We should have some hammers somewhere, don't you think? ;)


#10
BattleCaptain

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[quote name='JamesI' date='Apr 5 2009, 06:11 PM' post='1942972']

Also, deamonhunter transports are dedicated transports, can't put another unit in it. So, no grey knights in an inquisitor land raider (IA2 may change this though).

/quote]

IA2 does change this. In 4th edition, IA2 gave the Inquisitorial Land Raider Fire Control (i.e. POTMS), albeit at BS2, which was in-line with the 4th edition SM Codex. In 5th edition, per the free update, IA2 clearly intended to make the Inquisitorial Land Raider similar to the 5th edition SM Land Raider (but not identical, because it cannot take a multi-melta). Also, in both editions, IA2 only states the the Land Raider is a transport option, not a dedicated transport. And yes, I do use a FW Land Raider. :D

The reason why I don't want to take a Grey Knight raider is because my Inquisitorial Land Raider is painted and accessorized as an Inquisitorial Land Raider, not a GK one. I'm planning to make myself a GK one soon tho.

#11
Lungboy

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Also, deamonhunter transports are dedicated transports, can't put another unit in it. So, no grey knights in an inquisitor land raider (IA2 may change this though).


While you are correct about the Inquisitor needing a retinue to purchase one you are incorrect here sir. So long as the Inquisitor who purchased the land raider has joined with the grey knight squad they may catch a ride in his pimp-mobile. :D


If the Inquisitor has a retinue then he can't join with a unit of GK. If he doesn't have one he can't buy the Raider in the first place.

#12
Grand Master Tyrak

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BattleCaptain Posted Today, 06:01 PM
Thanks, Lungboy, and Grandmaster Tyrok. -_- However, your opinions seem to be diametrically opposed when it comes to the Elite-slot Inquisitor. Do you suggest I send an e-mail to the rules guy at GW's customer service department? :D


Don't - you'll get a third different interpretation, and then if you e-mail again you'll get a fourth. :P
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Have a look through this too.
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#13
Aidoneus

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The land raider can be thought of as a transport option for the retinue. Independent characters cannot take their own dedicated transports, ever (although this isn't stated explicitly anywhere, there are no exceptions). The wording is clear, by taking a retinue, the option for the transport is "unlocked," so to speak.
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#14
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Also, deamonhunter transports are dedicated transports, can't put another unit in it. So, no grey knights in an inquisitor land raider (IA2 may change this though).


While you are correct about the Inquisitor needing a retinue to purchase one you are incorrect here sir. So long as the Inquisitor who purchased the land raider has joined with the grey knight squad they may catch a ride in his pimp-mobile. ^_^


If the Inquisitor has a retinue then he can't join with a unit of GK. If he doesn't have one he can't buy the Raider in the first place.


You mis-read my words. The Inquisitor joining the knights is under the assumption that the retinue has kicked the bucket. ;)
QUOTE (number6 @ May 22 2008, 07:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We are the Ordo Malleus. We should have some hammers somewhere, don't you think? ;)


#15
JamesI

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The rules in my DH codex say an IC can join a unit and use their transport. Nothing states a unit can use the ICs transport.
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#16
Marshal Paul

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As far as I am aware, if the Inquisitor has a retinue means just that.
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#17
Eltnot

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Someone please add this to the DH Gotcha FAQ. It comes up enough to warrant it's inclusion in there.
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#18
BattleCaptain

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I just want to say thanks for everyone who took the time to answer my questions. :D

#19
Marid

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Someone please add this to the DH Gotcha FAQ. It comes up enough to warrant it's inclusion in there.


I could add something, but it seems pretty clear.

Can a transport be purchased for an elite Inquisitor that does not have a Retinue?
Answer: No.

If an Inquisitor loses his Retinue during play and then joins another unit as an IC, may that unit embark the Inquisitor's transport?
Answer: Yes.

#20
Gentlemanloser

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I think one of the Problems here is the Elite Inquisitors Retinue size.

By RAW, an Elite Inquisitor could take a Retinue of Size Zero. Which would unlock a LR as a Transport. Personally, I'd plump that you can't have a retinue of size zero, and the entry should read 1-6 (as the Retinue is optional and having a retinue of zero is actually *not* having a retinue and the 0-6 is misleading and redundant), but RAW is RAW.

And size Zero Retinues for Elite Inuisitors stand.
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#21
Marid

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Does a Retinue of 'Size Zero' count as a kill point?

#22
Gentlemanloser

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How do you kill it? ;)
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#23
Marid

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Exactly. It is absurd.

#24
Grand Master Tyrak

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Gentlemanloser Posted Today, 10:00 PM
How do you kill it? ;)


How do you ever finish deployment? :)
My DIY Chapter, the Blades of Duty.

Common errors in DIYing
Inquisitor ex Machina, Deus ex Mechanicus and Warp ex Machina - 40k variants of Deus ex Machina
Have a look through this too.
DIY tip of the day - the Inquisition does not exist. There are merely lots of Inquisitors.

"Be an Inquisition informer, betray your friends and family - Fabulous Prizes to be won!"

#25
Gentlemanloser

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Exactly. It is absurd.


I agree. But it's not been FAQed or Errated (and in al seriousness, there's no mini's to kill, nor deploy, so no problems there), so it's still RAW.

The Elite Inquisitor may take a Retinue of size zero.

Now, as you can't kill the retinue, there's no way for him to ever revert back to IC status, and he can never join another Squad. And maybe the zero sized Retinue would count as an additional Kill Point, if the Inquisitor himself is killed.

So it's really of limited use. (Edit: all I can think of is if you want a 7 Raider List, and want to skimp on buying 1/2 Mystics for the Elite Inquisitors....)

Edited by Gentlemanloser, 06 April 2009 - 09:36 PM.

QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.




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