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New player's Death Guard


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#1
Plague Angel

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Hello all. I'm brand new to the hobby but have been a fan of the fluff for a while. This is my attempt at a simple, but hopefully effective Nurgle list. Please be kind and patient with me as I learn, but brutal to the list itself!

HQ — 225 points

Typhus (will be taken with Terminator retinue, see Elites)

Troops — 990 points

7 Plague Marines
*2 Melta guns
*Champion with power fist, meltabombs, personal icon, and twin-linked bolter
*Dedicated Rhino with havoc launcher


7 Plague Marines
*2 Flamers
*Champion with power fist, meltabombs, personal icon, and twin-linked bolter
*Dedicated Rhino with havoc launcher


7 Plague Marines
*2 Plasma guns
*Champion with power fist, meltabombs, personal icon, and twin-linked bolter

7 Summoned Lesser Daemons

7 Summoned Lesser Daemons

Elite — 465 points
4 Terminators
*3 Terminator champions
*Icon of Nurgle
*2 pairs of lightning claws
*Heavy flamer + chain fist
*Dedicated Landraider transport with havoc launcher (alternatively, this landraider might be a Heavy Support choice with deep-striking Terminators)

Heavy Support — 320 points
7 Chaos Havocs
*Icon of Nurgle
*2 missile launchers
*Heavy bolter
*Lascannon
*Champion with combi-flamer and meltabombs
*Dedicated Rhino transport with havoc launcher

Total: 2000 exactly!

Thoughts: Lots of redundancy, which helps keep the list simple, but that might cause some bad situations if I'm caught facing something I'm not prepared for. I've tried to incorporate what I've learned from my months of lurking here at the B&C. Other things I'm considering are a second landraider or a defiler (not sure if the defiler is fluffy though).

Edited by Plague Angel, 15 April 2009 - 07:53 PM.


#2
chillin

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I would drop all the TL'ed bolters from the champs, rerolling a single bolter really isn't worth anything.
-Termi squad is WAY overpriced. I know you want to stay fluffy and that's good but IoN for 4 models is just too much per. 10pts per model is too much to pay fpr +1T. Also 3 champs upgrades is overkill, 1 is plenty, either the CF or LC's. Drop the other LC's. Never DS termi's unless it's 3 man termicide squad. Drop havoc launch off LR, it already has 2 TL'ed LC's and a TL'ed HB. I would drop HL's off rinos too.
-No need to put IoN on havocs, it's really not going to help them out and it is very expensive. Either the HB or the LC is out of place. Either go with 2 ML's and 2 LC's if it's for anti-tank or 2 ML's and 2 HB's if its anti-troop. And drop the champ and rino altogether. A unit designed to do everything actually does nothing well.
You can still model/paint the termi's and havocs up all nurgley, but the IoN is really just a waste on those 2 particular squads.
Actually it's not a bad list at all for a 1st timer.
Welcome to chaos & the B&C

Edited by chillin, 15 April 2009 - 08:23 PM.


#3
Plague Angel

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I would drop all the TL'ed bolters from the champs, rerolling a single bolter really isn't worth anything.
-Termi squad is WAY overpriced. I know you want to stay fluffy and that's good but IoN for 4 models is just too much per. 10pts per model is too much to pay fpr +1T. Also 3 champs upgrades is overkill, 1 is plenty, either the CF or LC's. Drop the other LC's. Never DS termi's unless it's 3 man termicide squad. Drop havoc launch off LR, it already has 2 TL'ed LC's and a TL'ed HB. I would drop HL's off rinos too.
-No need to put IoN on havocs, it's really not going to help them out and it is very expensive. Either the HB or the LC is out of place. Either go with 2 ML's and 2 LC's if it's for anti-tank or 2 ML's and 2 HB's if its anti-troop. And drop the champ and rino altogether. A unit designed to do everything actually does nothing well.
You can still model/paint the termi's and havocs up all nurgley, but the IoN is really just a waste on those 2 particular squads.
Actually it's not a bad list at all for a 1st timer.
Welcome to chaos & the B&C


I did wince at how much IoN cost. Since I plan on painting the models up as Death Guard, maybe I could model Nurgle Icons on the Termis and havocs but count them as Icons of Chaos Glory. That'd be much cheaper, and still help with summoning the daemons. But is IoCG worth it, or should I just drop icons all together?

#4
chillin

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I did wince at how much IoN cost. Since I plan on painting the models up as Death Guard, maybe I could model Nurgle Icons on the Termis and havocs but count them as Icons of Chaos Glory. That'd be much cheaper, and still help with summoning the daemons. But is IoCG worth it, or should I just drop icons all together?


That would be a good idea. And yes IoCG is well worth it IMO. Just let your opponent know that it's IoCG up front so there are no problems later in the game.

#5
Plague Angel

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So, then, first revision (changes in bold)

HQ — 225 points

Typhus

Troops — 1030 points

7 Plague Marines
*2 Melta guns
*Champion with power fist, meltabombs, personal icon, and combi-melta
*Dedicated Rhino with havoc launcher


7 Plague Marines
*2 Flamers
*Champion with power fist, meltabombs, personal icon, and combi-flamer
*Dedicated Rhino with havoc launcher


7 Plague Marines
*2 Plasma guns
*Champion with power weapon, meltabombs, personal icon, and combi-plasma
*Dedicated Rhino transport with havoc launcher

7 Summoned Lesser Daemons

7 Summoned Lesser Daemons

Elite — 380 points
4 Terminators
*Icon of Chaos Glory
*Pair of lightning claws
*Heavy flamer + chain fist
*Dedicated Landraider transport


Heavy Support — 365 points
7 Chaos Havocs
*4 missile launchers
*Dedicated Rhino transport


Chaos Predator
*Turret mounted lascannon
*Heavy bolter sponsons


I'm not set on the Pred; it's just an idea with the points I had left over from making some of the changes. Plague champions now a bit more in fitting with their squads, I like that much better.

Edit: Too many points! Got rid of one of the havoc launchers.

Edited by Plague Angel, 15 April 2009 - 09:47 PM.


#6
Bonham1963

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Points are at 2015. I don't think you'll appreciate havoc launchers. I used too use them and found them to be useless. Rhinos should be moving 12 " every chance they get and blocking LOS for your other units, against the enemy. Seeing as you have LD in the army, you may want to drop HL and add more daemons in your force. Dropping all HL would give you an extra LD in each unit. This would put it at 1996 pts.

#7
Plague Angel

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Points are at 2015. I don't think you'll appreciate havoc launchers. I used too use them and found them to be useless. Rhinos should be moving 12 " every chance they get and blocking LOS for your other units, against the enemy. Seeing as you have LD in the army, you may want to drop HL and add more daemons in your force. Dropping all HL would give you an extra LD in each unit. This would put it at 1996 pts.


So they are. Dang, and I was trying to be careful.

So. I'll drop one of the havoc launchers for sure, that'll put me back at 2000. As for the rest, I'll try them out first and decide. As for the daemons... 7 is the Nurgle number, so I tried to keep the squads at that size. I just wish I could fit 7 Termis in the landraider. :)

#8
chillin

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Combi-X's are pretty useless too, esp. the combi-flamer when you already have 2 flamers in the unit.

#9
the jeske

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. As for the daemons... 7 is the Nurgle number, so I tried to keep the squads at that size.

yes and they also dont work well at that squad size .8-10 man are ok [but not for the kind of build your using]. as you already ditched fluff , why bother with fixed squad size that doesnt exist in fluff anymore? besides it would be much better to drop the demons totally and take a pm squad for those pts.


pred has a bad weapon set up . a single lascanon aint good antitank/anti MC while it fires at those the hvy bolters get wasted , the other way around with cover we have in 5th the lascanon is hardlly the best weapon against meq or horde. the las pred is also very overpriced . want a pred take a dakka one [auto canon+hvy bolters] , but the anti horde can just as well be done with a DP with rot .


the termi LR+tyfus squad... sigh... well its overcosted . first of all chaos termis are not ment to do hth . we dont have HQs that buff our termis , we dont have storm shields and our LR are small , making the termis+hq squad too small to play with [at termi squad ment for hth should be 5/6 man+HQ] . arment well we dont have storm shields this means any fast moving unit[high I is ment here not just the speed of moving] will do a lot of kills against termis [something like 2/3 dead ] then tyfus will sly some of the squad [but not enough to kill the fist guy] then the termy/is will sly so more and then the fist from the opponent squads will instant kill tyfus . even if you win the hth there is a big chance your opponent unit will not run away [as its probablly joined by an HQ ] and next turn he will strike before you and sly the rest of termis. All this unit can kill all small unsupported troop squads , but considering you almost pay 600pts for that its totally not worth it .
as tyfus goes . I think it has been writen more then a few times , why he is a bad HQ for a fluff force or not . And am to lazy to write all of that again .

"Felix wondered how Calgar might feel about the primach's unilateral altering of the Codex Astartes. The captain could not help but feel that, in his drive for victory and efficiency, Guilliman had been careless with the feelings of his existing sons. Increasingly, Guilliman looked to the Primaris Space Marines as his first solution. He made no attempt to hide the fact that the days of the older space marines were numbered."


#10
Zhukov

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Well then lets keep it short on Typhus: 225 points, yet still dead slow and instakillable. Instakillable being the real bummer here.

Also I advise you not to start with 2000 points. You dont have oversight anymore at this level if you start playing. I advise you starting with 1000 points.

Edited by Zhukov, 16 April 2009 - 07:11 AM.

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#11
tastytaste

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Keep the Havocs cheap. Drop the transport and put them up in some area terrain. Go with minimal squad count and take Chaos Glory if you are afraid of breaking. The 36" range of the H. Bolter will be long to shoot what you want. With the extra points tweek up your other squads. You need some melta somewhere find a place to get it, I know easier said then done hehe


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#12
Plague Angel

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I've caught on that I should listen to jeske.

Is this list better, then?

HQ
Daemon Prince
*Wings
*Mark of Nurgle
*Nurgle's Rot

Daemon Prince
*Wings
*Mark of Nurgle
*Warp time

Troops
7 Plague Marines
*2 meltaguns
*Plague champion with powerfist and meltabombs
*Rhino

7 Plague Marines
*2 meltaguns
*Plague champion with powerfist and meltabombs
*Rhino

7 Plague Marines
*2 plasma
*Plague champion with powerfist and meltabombs
*Rhino

7 Plague Marines
*2 plasma
*Plague champion with powerfist and meltabombs
*Rhino

7 Plague Marines
*2 flamers
*Plague champion with powerfist and meltabombs
*Rhino

Heavy Support
5 Chaos Havocs
*4 missile launchers

Chaos Predator
*Autocannon, bolter sponsons

Chaos Predator
*Autocannon, bolter sponsons

Edited by Plague Angel, 16 April 2009 - 08:54 AM.


#13
Zhukov

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yeah if you want real competative lists listen to Jeske.

Havocs are a bit meh. I would rather have 2 Obliterators.
All those meltabombs arent really neccessary.

Rest look decent enough. Not a fan of Plague marine spam though.

Some more Obliterators and/or 3 man Terminator unit w/ 3 combimeltas would make this list better methinks.

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#14
PlagueWarriorOfDeath

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The list looks halfway decent. I'd lose the meltabombs and the havocs. That way you have enough points for a couple oblits, which are awesome and they cover the long ranged anti-tank firepower that you lack.
In war, you needn't make worry about making mistakes, simply wait for your opponent to make one.

"The Emperor is dead, yet you grovel at a corpse in hopes of salvation. There is no salvation in the course you currently travel, only death. Embrace the powers and live on for eternity!"

#15
Plague Angel

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Gah. I love Oblits... I like the models, the rules, everything... but that's such a big compromise on the fluff, I don't know if I'm willing to go that far.

#16
PlagueWarriorOfDeath

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Compromise on the fluff?
I havn't really read much on the fluff but Oblits are mercenaries that sell themselves out for technology... it's not that far fetched to have oblits in a Tau list!
Plus as my friend always says, "fluff can be made to fit anything."
The fluff is made to fit your army, not the other way around
In war, you needn't make worry about making mistakes, simply wait for your opponent to make one.

"The Emperor is dead, yet you grovel at a corpse in hopes of salvation. There is no salvation in the course you currently travel, only death. Embrace the powers and live on for eternity!"

#17
the jeske

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in the new dex they are virus corrputed tech marines ;) thanks again thorpe.

"Felix wondered how Calgar might feel about the primach's unilateral altering of the Codex Astartes. The captain could not help but feel that, in his drive for victory and efficiency, Guilliman had been careless with the feelings of his existing sons. Increasingly, Guilliman looked to the Primaris Space Marines as his first solution. He made no attempt to hide the fact that the days of the older space marines were numbered."


#18
PlagueWarriorOfDeath

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Ew yea, that does suck. Though they do still act as mercs jumping from band to band for chances to get tech or research.
In war, you needn't make worry about making mistakes, simply wait for your opponent to make one.

"The Emperor is dead, yet you grovel at a corpse in hopes of salvation. There is no salvation in the course you currently travel, only death. Embrace the powers and live on for eternity!"