CKO Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 The pretending to be other chapters was very creative! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted July 23, 2010 Author Share Posted July 23, 2010 Pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaren Posted July 23, 2010 Share Posted July 23, 2010 You're still going to deep into the past history of the planet. Just explain how after a brutal battle, they diverged from codex, and slowly went more extreme from there. Spend less time on the battles. Explain more about the repainted armor, the trophies, and the sneakiness. You're giving us way to much detail. I don't need to know why your marines repainted their armor, especially for such a silly reason as matching the color scheme of a planet they do a vast minority of their fighting on. They spend much LESS time on their homeworld than other battle fields, so changing your scheme for that reason is pointless. I don't need to know the history of the Inquisitor, just that he was bad. I don't need all the details on the war against the Tau, or the Tau's ambush, just that it was brutal, and the Templars kinda got beat down. I don't need to know which ship exploded when, just that the fleet was destroyed. I don't need to know about the indigenous people and a war they fought against some Imperial jerk decades before your chapter even existed, I just need to know the broad ideas of what they are about. Do you see the pattern here? Broad strokes. Also, I know you think the vehicle patterns are cool, and they are. They just add nothing to IA, except to lengthen an already bloated article. As a reader, I don't need to know what type of modified vehicles they use, just that they use modified vehicles. I know your sidebars are an attempt to streamline it, and make things easier to read and work through, but they are so long. Especially about battles, battles which honestly don't convey much to the article as a whole. Neither of those sidebars is necessary. Instead, use the sidebar space to talk about the Inquisitor and his backround, which doesn't need to be in the IA proper. Use it to explain one or two vehicle types. If you are going to use it for a battle, use it for the Tau vs Templar vs Genesis chapter battle, since that is the only one of import. The ideas are all there, just like last time, and they are good ideas. Its still way too long, and covers WAY too much detail. Ease the perspective back about 150 ft, and let the details blend together a bit and see a wider picture. I like the chapter, I like the ideas, ESPECIALLY the painting their armor, and being all sneaky like. I don't like having to read about battles, history, and people that don't really add anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted July 23, 2010 Author Share Posted July 23, 2010 Then I apologise for attempting to create a chapter with a detailed and developed back story. I won't waste your time any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaren Posted July 23, 2010 Share Posted July 23, 2010 You're missing the point of what I am saying. Its a good STORY. It's just too detailed for an IA. That's what I am getting at. Yes, knowing all the detail is good, but for the reader, it is largely unnecessary. If you are just trying to convey the whole story, then that is all well and good. However, if you are trying to make an IA, with the intent of submitting it to the Librarium, then these are my thoughts. If that is not your intent, than it is fine. My comments are solely based on the article as an IA. Not as a reflection on the chapter as a whole. I don't think you should give up, I do think there is so much potential here. I don't think it is all necessary for an Index Astartes article. I do think it is all part an amazing story, and an amazing chapter. I don't think you understood the point of my criticisms. I do think you took what I said a little personally, and I'm sorry if I offended you or your story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGriffon Posted July 23, 2010 Share Posted July 23, 2010 I think the story is pretty good, and I also second that you shouldn't give up. I think what Shin means is this: You need to condense to get the most impact. Thing of Bruce Lee's "One-Inch-Punch." Sure, Bruce Lee could whip you many other ways, but the "One-Inch-Punch" is the what the Liber is all about. So, you need to pick the main points of the story and stick it to us. I thin the main points (and this is just my thoughts) - Origins fighting Orks - The daemon sword striking the Captain and a piece being left in (pretty cool) - Their fall - Their beliefs - Their doctrine of masqurading as loyalists. It can still be very deep, but short. You want the max amount of energy in the shortest amount of space. Such as, the Technology section. Whereas it is neat, it isn't really appropriate for an IA. Now, when you finally finish an IA, then you can move onto a Codex where you can add all this depth. You know what I'm sayin'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted July 23, 2010 Author Share Posted July 23, 2010 No you seem to misunderstand. The reason it's a detailed backstory is why i'm giving up on it, I wouldn't know which elements to remove from it as too many actions would seem without cause or spontanious. The suggestion that I should remove the whole background to why the Inquisitor is corrupt and why he wants to destroy a chapter would make his actions seem a little strange to say the least. And probably sound somewhat moronic by comparison with some of his later actions. If it's too long winded or overly long then it's better simply to start with something else than try to salvage something which has already developed beyond what is required. I have one or two things in mind for another chapter so I might come back to this in a few months. Thanks for the help and feedback with this by the way, both to Shinzaren and all who've helped develop it beyond the wreck it was when it started, i'll try to put it to good use in the next project and when I come back to this in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaren Posted July 23, 2010 Share Posted July 23, 2010 Ok, we just don't want you to give up on your idea because of us :) I look forward to your next project, because it is clear you have a ton of imagination, and lots of good ideas. Just remember, broad strokes; less is more. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGriffon Posted July 24, 2010 Share Posted July 24, 2010 If it makes you feel any better I think I have started something like 8 IAs. I am pretty sure I am down to my final two. My Crimson Warlords and the Paragons. I am sure I will eventually make more, but there is no shame in starting, scrapping, and starting again. many authors write whole novels just to toss them out. I look forward to more of your work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 Pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Hmmm, well. I'm no exactly keen on the sneaky-ninja theme for Chapter of Space Knights. The Origins section is awfully long. Try to condense the major points or disperse them amongst other sections.(edit: After looking at the above points I'm just repeating the arguments of others. ;)) Each tribe’s young would take a Trial of Manhood before being accepted into the ranks of their warriors. This would involve being taken blind-folded deep into the heart of the wastelands, drugged and having to return. - I don't understand, where the people get the idea of Trial of Manhood = Trial of Death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 The Origins section is awfully long. Try to condense the major points or disperse them amongst other sections.(edit: After looking at the above points I'm just repeating the arguments of others. :lol:) Sorry for having a detailed background. If you've actually got any suggestions as to which parts to shift about, any indication of any sections you're actually referring to, i'll happily do so. Each tribe’s young would take a Trial of Manhood before being accepted into the ranks of their warriors. This would involve being taken blind-folded deep into the heart of the wastelands, drugged and having to return.- I don't understand, where the people get the idea of Trial of Manhood = Trial of Death. It's more a trial of survival than anything else. Besides, i've seen others who's background consisted of them having to fight dragons or some such monsters. I think having to find your way back to your people through the same hellish wasteland you have always lived in is less dangerous than going out and killing monsters several times your size with a spear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 It's more a trial of survival than anything else. Besides, i've seen others who's background consisted of them having to fight dragons or some such monsters. I think having to find your way back to your people through the same hellish wasteland you have always lived in is less dangerous than going out and killing monsters several times your size with a spear. You have two trials mixed together. Trial of Manhood =/= Trial of Acceptance into Chapter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 It's more a trial of survival than anything else. Besides, i've seen others who's background consisted of them having to fight dragons or some such monsters. I think having to find your way back to your people through the same hellish wasteland you have always lived in is less dangerous than going out and killing monsters several times your size with a spear. You have two trials mixed together. Trial of Manhood =/= Trial of Acceptance into Chapter. Ah, my mistake. But yeah, if anyone has any constructive advise besides 'I never liked this sort of idea and I just agree with everything everyone has said until now' i'd like to hear it please. Any suggestions on how to cut down their history would be helpful as that seems to be the part people keep commenting upon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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