Ace Debonair Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I think it's in everyone's best interests if you figure out a different metric for this year, not least because there is no concrete reopening date that you can be given for the Librarium returning to full operational status. With that in mind... Perhaps we should just change that to 'complete an IA that meets general Liber approval and doesn't have any gaping plot holes, inexplicable cliche bombs or other suspension-of-disbelief-breaking offences.' Yeah, it's technically a similar thing, but leaving the Librarium out of it altogether. Plus, we don't have to come down like a critiquing thunderstorm every time someone makes a mistake.* ;) It also leaves room for the writer to refine the chapter later on, as and when the Librarium returns to operation and is accepting DIY chapter submissions. Then there's all the monthly challenges to fulfil besides. :lol: *Unless we really want to, that is. This is the Liber, after all. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosjetka Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Perhaps we should just change that to 'complete an IA that meets general Liber approval and doesn't have any gaping plot holes, inexplicable cliche bombs or other suspension-of-disbelief-breaking offences.' Nice one Ace, good idea. I guess that the Liber's judgement is quite near to the Librarium's own standard for accepting IA/IT's (but then I can't know, having not submitted anything), so problem solved? Ludovic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingsOfTheFalcon Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 TBH it depends on the challenges but it could also be a great way to work up to a small (say 500pts) force of painted minis, whilst building solid fluff and learning from each other. Librarium or not, I say stick with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I suggest that once the number of participants is finalised, then you consider each is a judge with 10pts to allocate. Say there are 20 judges, that makes 200 points obviously, and to be considered "complete" you need 180points from the participating judges. Theres a simple example, which relies on people involved rather than a currently non-existant Librarium - also note that some of the people commenting, such as the Wonder Duo.. er.. Octy an Apothete - have the cpacity to comment in a vaguely official way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingsOfTheFalcon Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Just did a run through of all the linked IAs on the OP, lots of good ideas out there guys. Suggest you all do the same, that way we can help each other to progress. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Just did a run through of all the linked IAs on the OP, lots of good ideas out there guys. Suggest you all do the same, that way we can help each other to progress. B) I browse, but if something is being critiqued to death already I don't comment unless something has been missed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 inexplicable cliche bombs You are a maser of humorous word wizardry Ace! Yeah, it's technically a similar thing, but leaving the Librarium out of it altogether. Plus, we don't have to come down like a critiquing thunderstorm every time someone makes a mistake.* Speak for yourself, those storms make one feel alive! ... Is that an ominous rumbling I hear in the distance? I suggest that once the number of participants is finalized, then you consider each is a judge with 10pts to allocate. Say there are 20 judges, that makes 200 points obviously, and to be considered "complete" you need 180points from the participating judges. The problem with having a panel of judges is that if they are also participants, they can't be relied upon to be totally objective and will more than likely be far harsher of others mistakes and errors, not to mention softer on those they consider their friends. It's an unequal system. I think when it comes down to the line, the IA's that have completed the highest amount of challenges are lined up for the final round. A way to judge them would be to bring back all the failed participants to judge the finalists, yes it might make some things a bit dicey but once the judge has no personal stake in the proceedings he might be a bit more objective. Then again he may just swear fiery vengeance upon everyone and to hell with the rest of us. This is getting overcomplicated. You could have a panel of senior Liberites as judges, people who have been round the block for a while, those more mellow of individuals. :P Or you could just dismiss my ramblings and go with whatever works, like anyone who has completed all the challenges is a winner regardless of how many other winners there are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I say dismiss all that and go with my idea... I wouldn't say that have to be "senior" - that implies those without a "long service badge" have nothing of vaule to offer - just pick a selection who are willing to judge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 that implies those without a "long service badge" have nothing of vaule to offer That's not what I'm implying at all, don't read so closely between the lines you start to read the grain of the paper. It's more about experience, the longer you've been in the Liber the more likely you are to spot inconsistencies, plot holes and guideline errors. It would be bad if the winning votes come down to a reasoning of 'well it's his chapter and his 40k' when we're all working under the shared universe after all, and that is typically the attitude of a newcomer. How many Lexicanii or Moderators do you see with 10 posts and a membership history of last Tuesday? That said, I think having no judges whatsoever is better, leads to less bad feeling or problems with said judgment if viewed to be unsatisfactory by one or more people, the challenges themselves being all completed are more easily recognizable and are also rather hard to get all done, therefore eliminating many of the competition anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrus Manus Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Surely, for you guys and girls, the easiest thing would just be to work on your Chapter with the goal of attaining the highest quality possible and 'forget' about about the Challenge, whilst simultaneously fulfilling the requirement of the IG if that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Debonair Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 inexplicable cliche bombs You are a maser of humorous word wizardry Ace! I try my humble best. :P Say there are 20 judges, that makes 200 points obviously, and to be considered "complete" you need 180points from the participating judges. The problem with having a panel of judges is that if they are also participants, they can't be relied upon to be totally objective and will more than likely be far harsher of others mistakes and errors, not to mention softer on those they consider their friends. It's an unequal system. I think when it comes down to the line, the IA's that have completed the highest amount of challenges are lined up for the final round. A way to judge them would be to bring back all the failed participants to judge the finalists, yes it might make some things a bit dicey but once the judge has no personal stake in the proceedings he might be a bit more objective. Then again he may just swear fiery vengeance upon everyone and to hell with the rest of us. Wait, what? I didn't think this was a 'there can be only one' sort of challenge. I thought it was like last year's one, where by signing up you volunteer to help all the other participants too. You could have a panel of senior Liberites as judges, people who have been round the block for a while, those more mellow of individuals. ;) In short, more sacrifices to Octavulg and Apothete. :D Or you could just dismiss my ramblings and go with whatever works, like anyone who has completed all the challenges is a winner regardless of how many other winners there are. I don't find myself disagreeing with GHY often, but This gets my vote, for what it's worth. I'd also count completing an IA to the 'generally agreed decent standard' as a challenge, in fairness. :D EDIT: and out of the shadows, Ferrus Manus strikes! :ph34r: Surely, for you guys and girls, the easiest thing would just be to work on your Chapter with the goal of attaining the highest quality possible and 'forget' about about the Challenge, whilst simultaneously fulfilling the requirement of the IG if that makes sense. Just use the Iron Gauntlet as a motivation for getting some IAs up to maxmimum excellence? Well, that works too. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 that implies those without a "long service badge" have nothing of vaule to offer That's not what I'm implying at all, don't read so closely between the lines you start to read the grain of the paper. What else am I supposed to do when I'm bored? Huh? Huh? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrus Manus Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 EDIT: and out of the shadows, Ferrus Manus strikes! Hah. It has been a while since I'd consider myself an active Liberite. I'll try and use this challenge to get back into it. Besides, my bowling ball hasn't been used in a while <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saerivic Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I would like to sign up my loyalist chapter. The Claws of Forca. http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=218959 I would do an IT, but all the ideas floating around in my head are more toward loyal chapters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacklight Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Whether or not there's a competition doesn't matter to me, this is just a really great way to motivate myself to build up my chapter and army. I've been wanting to get into 40k for ages now and just never had the money/drive/time to do it. Now that I'm not in college, have a 40 hour a week job with good pay, and am working on my own chapter, I'm ready to get into it. Having the Liber here and this challenge, whether it's a competition or not, will be a great motivator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Forcystus Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Plus the whole thing seems to have made feedback more frequent and widespread, which in my poinion is a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WookieeGunner Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 My vow copy and paste, broke my link. Here is the full one: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=219097 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofTerra Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I agree with the sentiment that it doesn't really matter if we're doing this to get into the librarium, more of a tool to motivate us to finish our projects, both IA wise and for those who are actually modelling their chapters those as well. So i say continue on, and if their is no "getting into the librarium" from it, oh well, its more about the journey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reyner Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I agree with the sentiment that it doesn't really matter if we're doing this to get into the librarium, more of a tool to motivate us to finish our projects, both IA wise and for those who are actually modelling their chapters those as well. So i say continue on, and if their is no "getting into the librarium" from it, oh well, its more about the journey. What he said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sousetsu Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 For the sake of getting motivated, and fully committing to my own work, I'd like to add my chapter to the loyalist list, seeing as there are still 5 open spaces. I've axed my original ideas and I'm spending a lot of time trying to get nice and original ones, so for the moment, my chapter is named The Imperial Knights and is yet to make its appearance online, but I'd like to put it in the running anyways. I will be putting up an IA as soon as I've ironed all the little details out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I'll be home from Iraq with open access to what is needed finally, so count me in. Quick question, though: is this only for DIYs? I was thinking about fleshing out the Lion Warriors who are, right now, just an insignia and paint scheme from How to Paint Space Marines. If that's not an option, my ideas will work equally well as, oh, say, the Lions Rampant. Either way, they are a Loyal to the Throne. IA coming soon! Edit: Sweet. IA linked here: IA: Lion Warriors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Argent Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 So I'm thinking the goal will be to COMPLETE an IA to an accepted standard by the end of the year. What exactly is defined as complete I'll deciude when we get there, or whatever. This is just so the challenge can continue. I think it will be either a concensus on whether the article is complete or perhaps just a few individuals. As that will be nearly a year away for most participants I dont think a 100% confirmed alternative is needed yet. Note to0 those saying about htere being a "winner" of the IG2011, note that this is a challenge, not a competition. Any who complete the challenges will be a "winner" and there will be no Chapter secified as being a winner above the others. As to Deus ex Ferrum, yep you can use the Lion Warriors. Its a good scheme isn't it. I was actually going to use it and develop a Chapter myself a while ago but in the end it morphed into my Exculpators whom I am just starting now. I'll address any other questions and update the first post again later. Keep those sign ups coming people, only a few Loyalists left. And we need more Traitors! Later Challeges may require co-operation between a loyalist and a traitor so Loyalists, get out there and recruit some Traitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacklight Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 So as a requirement are we going to need to have models assembled and painted? I just wanna know, so I can start building up a stockpile. It's hard to get bits where I am ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Can I change from Wraiths of Darkness to Lords of Shadow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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