36 replies to this topic

[Drelthar]

Though Khorne is my favorite chaos god, I feel bad for you followers of Slaanesh. Forge World has yet to make Slaanesh conversion kits, or a Slaanesh HQ model (this goes the same for Tzeentch as well). I know that the Khorne and Nurgle kits/models were part of the Siege of Vraks releases, but I just don't get why they left you and the Tzeentch folks out. There have been incredible Slaanesh termies made through the use of greenstuff and added bits, but on the other hand, I've seen squads that look Slaaneshi only in color.

I don't have much to say beyond a rant, but I do have a question: how many of you would be interested in Slaanesh models from Forge World? Even better, what details would you want on the models?

[the jeske]

non . slanesh sucks and almost no one plays the army [because it sucks] . models for armies with a low following make little to no sense to be made , so FW doesnt make them it is only natural .+ being FW they are not legal for tournaments and a lot of people wont let people use them[specialy if they make an army which sucks better , so harder to win against. no likes easy wins getting tougher] , so there is even less market for them .


As modeling goes . It would be nice to get something different like the violators chapter master [before he was blown up] in a dread , for example . anything but the generic boobs with whips [which isnt even very slanesh to begin with].

[Doghouse]

In your opinion they suck mate, FW Emperor Children upgrade kits would be tourney legal and have no effect on the rules.

I think that it's more to do with Khorne and Nurgle being far more popular than Slannesh and Tzeentch. FW are limited to what they can sell so it makes sense to focus on the two powers that are the most popular from a sales point of view.
I think that noise marines and rubric marines made by FW would be extremely popular to be fair as would Emperor's Children marines but unfortunately they can't cover everything at once.
Dreadnoughts on the other hand are a staple of the FW income hence the reason why there are Legion specific models. If they ever had the chance to do another FW book with chaos you could well see them pop up on their website but the releases seem to be determined by the nature of the IA book campaigns.

[Drelthar]

Forge World special characters and rules I could see as being illegal in tourneys, but using the models or bitz from them as counts-as for legal units would probably be fine. From what I've heard about Slaanesh armies, they seem like a mixed bag, so I don't have enough factual information over whether or not they're able to be competitive. A large deterrent I've noticed in regards to making Slaanesh armies is how expensive making noise marine squads can be - I almost bought a squad recently (I want to build a Slaanesh army as well as the Khorne one that I'm working on), but the fact that I'd have to buy more sonic weapons in a separate pack stopped me.

I totally forgot about the dreads when I started the topic - the fact that there are two seperate models for the Slaanesh-inclined is nice. Being able to sell a product comes first, so I can't blame Forge World for sticking with Khorne and Nurgle.

[the jeske]

In your opinion they suck mate, FW Emperor Children upgrade kits would be tourney legal and have no effect on the rules.

do you play EC to know if they suck or dont ? because I do .

From what I've heard about Slaanesh armies, they seem like a mixed bag, so I don't have enough factual information over whether or not they're able to be competitive

small example of how "good" they are .
6 NM with sonics and a blast master and a fist for the champ . 200pts +rhino
6 GK with blessed ammo[str5 storms] psycannon [str7 4 shots rending] hammer for the champ 165pts .+rhino

GK have all force weapons , a psychic power . they actualy have enough points to jump to i6 [so faster then ECs] if they take halabards . but they acan also buy more dudes and get more out of the str5 storm bolters .

both units have the same way to play .

I think that noise marines and rubric marines made by FW would be extremely popular to be fair as would Emperor's Children marines but unfortunately they can't cover everything at once.

if the rules were good . Do you see people swarming to nids because of the awesome FW models , I mean at least technicly they do have more models then EC ?

[DarkMark]

Khornes always been king of the hill, so it follows they'd get the most goodies. The imagery is fairly easy too: skulls, angryness, and symbols aplenty. Nurgle is fairly straight forward too, lots of rot.

Slaanesh is far trickier to nail. I'd love a general bits pack with funky heads, pads, legs, and that sort of thing. I believe an avid EC collector is now at FW, so maybe one day we'll see something from them!

[DeathKnight2000]

psycannon [str7 4 shots rending] hammer for the champ 165pts .+rhino

Psycannon's don't benefit from Psybolts only "bolter type" weapons and Assault Cannon/ Auto Cannons.
So any player "up-ping" there psycannon to Str 7 is not in line with the rules.

On topic: Slannesh marines don't have much love. There awesome to paint, and convert but most people with morals, and a sence that under age players maybe attending tournament, they don't bring their hardcore slannesh models like I've seen online. ( DakkaDakka) Also you are basing your points cost off a out dated book. Right now the GK is the bee's knees because their up-to-date, the best stuff right now, but once the new Chaos dex rolls out it will have lots of good stuff that will put up a good fight. be patient

[breng77]

Psycannon's don't benefit from Psybolts only "bolter type" weapons and Assault Cannon/ Auto Cannons.
So any player "up-ping" there psycannon to Str 7 is not in line with the rules.

PSycannons are base Str 7....They are basically assaultcannons with psybolts (that have 2 firing modes)

[DeathKnight2000]

Psycannon's don't benefit from Psybolts only "bolter type" weapons and Assault Cannon/ Auto Cannons.
So any player "up-ping" there psycannon to Str 7 is not in line with the rules.

PSycannons are base Str 7....They are basically assaultcannons with psybolts (that have 2 firing modes)

Opps.. I meant Str 8. thanks for the catch.

[Lord_Caerolion]

Well, Forge World has stated that they'll do some Slaaneshi and Tzeentchian models at some point, they just haven't had the opportunity to do so yet. They can't have every book be about Chaos.

[Stormbrow II]

On topic: Slannesh marines don't have much love. There awesome to paint, and convert but most people with morals, and a sence that under age players maybe attending tournament, they don't bring their hardcore slannesh models like I've seen online. ( DakkaDakka)

This. I played a tournament recently using my EC as GK (what else) and it didn't get any easier to explain before each game that the Blastmasters were Psycannons, the Tentacle arm was the Hammer and the guy with the penis was the Justicar.

[The Colossus]

Isn't the next forge world book gonna be Minotaurs chapter vs Tzeentch chaos marines? So I'd expect Tzeentch bits and kits as a result?

Edit : typoss

Edited by The Colossus, 12 February 2012 - 06:56 PM.

[DIDM]

well it is the newest chaos god, so it would seem fitting that the army gets dealt with last

[KingDeath]

well it is the newest chaos god, so it would seem fitting that the army gets dealt with last

Yeah, instead Forgeworld can make yet another crappy dreadnought weapon or yet another Malcador variant....meh.

[emperors immortals]

In your opinion they suck mate, FW Emperor Children upgrade kits would be tourney legal and have no effect on the rules.

do you play EC to know if they suck or dont ? because I do .

I think that noise marines and rubric marines made by FW would be extremely popular to be fair as would Emperor's Children marines but unfortunately they can't cover everything at once.

if the rules were good . Do you see people swarming to nids because of the awesome FW models , I mean at least technicly they do have more models then EC ?

HEY wait a minute there...I love my EC noise marines - they are competitive and lethal if given the right space to play in (dont be sick).They dont suck, bu there not Uber-competitive.

And as for Tyranids i know a few locals who do extremally well and chose the Nidz because they LOOK good - not even for a competitive edge!!!!

Ive run and loved every cult army now since i could glue stub guns on a beastmen pack almost 18 odd years now and Slaanesh stil deserves a much better definition - its just as said above its easier to sell Heavy Metal angry marines and things that rot/shoot mind bullets then what amounts to the most anti-christian, amoral and hedonistic philosophy born because of a Xeno races superhuman perversions.Try getting granny to agree at xmas.

[Ethrion]

I think this subject touches on the main point that GW don't know what Slaanesh really does that's different to the other gods. Does Slaanesh make marines more shooty or more close combat oriented? They seem to be stuck in a little bit of a limbo and because they haven't nailed down exactly what these guys do they avoid dealing with them. I hope beyond hope that they've thought about it a lot and we will see a focus in this upcoming chaos codex. If they don't do anything to Slaanesh this time round it'll be a big shame.

[Ah-a-nothepsis]

I imagine that GW and FW is taking care of all that, and that the EC will get some attention.

It makes sense that they are proficient in both ranged and close combat, and with the way GW has done the Dark Eldar codex I see no reason why they would not include combat drugs just for the EC.

So maybe they're just in limbo as far as what they want to do, but will gain the option to improve certain skills as the battle rages (or before) due to their drugs.

Edited by Ah-a-nothepsis, 01 March 2012 - 05:22 PM.

[chaplain belisarius]

i miss combat drugs...i think in the new codex slaaneshi armies should get +1 I, option to take combat drugs, the blissgiver (as its great fun!) and make noise marine weapons cheaper. Maybe give them fleet to represent how much quicker they are? how about something like-

perfectionist-all slaanesh followers seek perfection in all they do. Slaaneshi marked marines always count as having a higher weapon skill in combat? (so hit on 3+ normally)

just my thoughts...

[Ethrion]

i miss combat drugs...i think in the new codex slaaneshi armies should get +1 I, option to take combat drugs, the blissgiver (as its great fun!) and make noise marine weapons cheaper. Maybe give them fleet to represent how much quicker they are? how about something like-

perfectionist-all slaanesh followers seek perfection in all they do. Slaaneshi marked marines always count as having a higher weapon skill in combat? (so hit on 3+ normally)

just my thoughts...

That's a pretty cool idea actually, I like it! Either that or they get the option to take the equivalent of pairs of scything talons so that they can re-roll ones and if paying for an extra set then ones and twos. This would fit with Slaaneshi close combat units because their strength and toughness wouldn't be all that different from a normal marine, but their weapon skill would be noticeably better.

[emperors immortals]

Ive always liked the idea of models in CC with slaaneshi forces must pass a Ld test or stand transfixed (lose an A maybe?), IoS makes unit unbreakable and noise marines can access frenzy (FnP maybe) as combat drugs upgrade.

It seems GW have hijacked the whole charisma and leadership aspect and given it to chaos undivided as Choas Glory - which it should be but also EC need some love.

[The Red Worm]

I agree with Ethrion. Games Workshop doesn't seem to know what to do with Slaanesh or Tzeentch armies. Slaanesh and Tzeentch probably are best represented in the background rather than the desktop. Khorne and Nurgle are pretty straightforward to repesent on the tabletop.

To be honest, I'm not sure GW has had much consistency on Chaos within the 40K universe. Look at the evolution of the models and armies. They've lost some units from the Imperials, but gained new units that do similar things.

I'm looking forward to FW turning an eye towards Slaanesh, and Tzeentch in particular. It will be interesting to see if FW plays up the change aspect of Tzeentch. I have no idea how to represent Slaanesh in the rules. Having their trademark noise weapons get a refresh is easy. How they function in the rules doesn't concern me much, but I hope both armies find a good niche among 40k players and Chaos players in particular.

[jmurph]

Finding niches is definitely important for design. right now Slaanesh (as pointed out) is just a terrible GK. Here's how I would do it:
Khorne: Specialist CC- so +1a, +1WS, but a drawback that limits ranged options (like Rage)
Nurgle: Tarpits- +1 T, FNP, EW characters but slow so -1 I and maybe always count as in difficult
Tzeentch: Mystic specialists- Inv saves, psyker ACs, Relentless. AP3 bolters. Psychic powers like Ghost Bolts- on a Psychic Test squad bolt weapons cause successful cover saves to be rerolled. Hellfire- Psychic test and bolters fire like a flamer. Make them like the Chaos Sternguard.
Slaanesh: Debilitators/Raiders- Fleet, Warp Glamour- Roll nightfight when shooting at them and in assault LD or be reduced to WS 1 in CC. Psyker powers that allow you to make enemies attack their own models, move, etc. +1 Init and SBs replace bolters. Can take Doom Siren instead of flamer or BM instead of AC/ML.

Undivided- Reroll failed LD, cheap (13 pts for BP/CCW/Bolter grenades marine)

I think they need to focus on making CSM feel less like a subpar loyalist force with a few different options. Instead of banners boosting units, have them weaken nearby enemy units. For example, have a dirge caster lower LD of enemy units withing 6 inches by 1 (cumulative). Have Chaos banners that once per game cause all enemy units in CC reroll all successful rolls. Bring back marked vehicles. Let's see some Dread weapons like the BAs. And spike upgrades that cause any models in CC to take a S4 hit. How about getting rid of the stupid random Possessed tables and just pay for upgrades ala Wolf Guard.

Just some ideas.

Edited by jmurph, 28 March 2012 - 09:36 PM.

[Northstar]

I've always seen Slaaneshi units as more the long range support units, while Tzeentch is the more midrange firefighting units. Defending objectives and such would nominally be done by Nurgle forces, and obviously Khorne going in and hacking everything apart. Finally, Undivided seems more as something to be thrown in to shore up weaker parts of a whole forces... you know, the jack-of-trades units, with no real strengths, but no particular faults as well...

[makesomenoise]

I've been playing slaaneshi things for some time now and as far as it goes they are supposed to have 3 real advantages (fluff wise) speed, they are fast, they think fast, they move fast they shoot fast. Now the initiative bonus does good for thinking fast and sonic weapons are actually very effective from my point of view.

But dark eldar think fast as do a few characters. So maybe up the initiative boost to allways strikes first proportions. (Whfb term sorry)

Confusion/charm. Lash of submission does a great job here as does the pinning and general sonic theme of the noise marines. But i don't see the glamour and madness you see in the slaaneshi spell list for fantasy.

Sensations galore. Bliss giver is a big win here. It gives both speed and sensation. The ap values on the doom siren and blast master are a nice way to politely mind rape your standard trooper but i feel like their should be more.

Now if i have to pay 25 points for a standard real noise marine i would expect either fleet or feel n
o pain for the cost. (They are fast and what doesn't kill them get's them off)

The doom siren doesn't cause pinning... which would be sexy and the idea of a power fist on a hyper stim'd up noise marine offends me. I'd rather see a lucius lash on the champion.

So what's slaanesh about? Speed charm and sensation. They should be fast, they should be sexy or at least confusing and they love to hurt ppl as much as they love to be hurt... or cuddled.

Just my two cents. Now FW make it happen lol.

[chaplain belisarius]

i agree with the above! (maybe put skillful and in pursuit of perfection to the list too?)