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Road to Nationals v.2


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#26
CitadelArmyGuy

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How did the Terminators go?

I'm glad to hear Meph did well--- I tried Biomancer-mode in my last game for the first time, and got Endurance and Haemorrage.... ;) Traded it out for Smite because I was staring down an opposing 10-man Hammernator squad :unsure:

Really a big bummer, because he had MEQ hiding behind them and I really really should have kept Mephiston's codex powers so that he could fly over those Termies and hit at the tasties behind them.

Sigh.... re-examining the Biomancy table, you really need Enfeeble and/or Iron Arm to hit, or else TEQ become units to avoid at all costs. Which means you'd rather keep Wings to avoid them and still hit where you need to. I'm leaning more and more towards always keeping Meph's codex powers.

Sure you could hit 'Enfeeble+Haemorrage' combo (awesome versus IG blobs) or Endurance+IronArm.... I'm just torn, because my first experience was such a poor one. I still firmly believe Meph is useable in 6th Ed-- Wings+Fleet (innate) means his threat bubble is huuuge and failing charges far less likely.

I'll tell you what though, MAN I wish I had a Null Zone Libby when facing down those Hammernators..... I think that SM JP-Libby is a solid choice, Mort. Why Vortex though, rather than Gate?

Active Duty United States Army, Alumni of The Citadel Military College. 6th Edition: 54 Win - 6 Tie - 5 Loss // 7th Edition: 10 Win - 0 Tie - 0 Loss

 

Nine Principles of Warfare: Objective, Offensive, Mass, Economy of Force, Maneuver, Unity of Command, Security, Surprise, Simplicity. In tabletop wargaming, 8 of 9 apply.

Military terminology: A tarpit is a Fix. A bubblewrap is a Screen. Deathstars are Shock Units. Baiting units is an Ambush. Buffing is Force Multiplication. A pre-emptive decision is a Spoiling Action. Utilizing maneuver to influence your opponent's maneuver is Diversion. Special tricks that execute in 1-2 turns are Tactics, contrasted against your over-arching approach to winning a match is Strategy.
 
I play Semi-Competitive because after being a true believer and disciple of Competitiveness for years, I personally feel that 6th Edition made a mockery of game balance... but I've never had more fun than I do now! I still play nails-hard and I play to Win, but nevermore at the expense of fun for my opponent. Play what you like, or you won't like to play


#27
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How did the Terminators go?

I'm glad to hear Meph did well--- I tried Biomancer-mode in my last game for the first time, and got Endurance and Haemorrage.... :wallbash: Traded it out for Smite because I was staring down an opposing 10-man Hammernator squad :unsure:

Really a big bummer, because he had MEQ hiding behind them and I really really should have kept Mephiston's codex powers so that he could fly over those Termies and hit at the tasties behind them.

Sigh.... re-examining the Biomancy table, you really need Enfeeble and/or Iron Arm to hit, or else TEQ become units to avoid at all costs. Which means you'd rather keep Wings to avoid them and still hit where you need to. I'm leaning more and more towards always keeping Meph's codex powers.

Sure you could hit 'Enfeeble+Haemorrage' combo (awesome versus IG blobs) or Endurance+IronArm.... I'm just torn, because my first experience was such a poor one. I still firmly believe Meph is useable in 6th Ed-- Wings+Fleet (innate) means his threat bubble is huuuge and failing charges far less likely.

I'll tell you what though, MAN I wish I had a Null Zone Libby when facing down those Hammernators..... I think that SM JP-Libby is a solid choice, Mort. Why Vortex though, rather than Gate?



Citadel, playtested the same list again. Will report back on that in a bit.

The terms did very, very well in the first game. Held up a Bloodthirster and eventually killed him after completely annihilating a Zerk squad.
In the second game, I got VERY unlucky with them. Charged a hunter squad that was led by a wolf priest - my sarge did no damage with his claws, and then i rolled 5x 1s off of 13 saves. FNP helped with 3, but was atrocious that time :(

I rocked mephy with bio/div that game (vs. the wolves) Rolled Iron arm thankfully. (was Relic mish)
I also rocked the SM libby with biomancy as nullzone wasnt needed.


As to why vortex, i feel I need all the very high strength AP1/2 as humanly possible. Deepstrike with 2d6 scatter is too iffy for me. If he was with a squad of sternguard Id possibly reconsider though.

In both games I played, mephy had no issues with the lack of wings- though, I dont see myself using other powers in games where i need to be very aggressive. Biomancy for him is just so good. I think if you really dont need the wings, then other than Haemorrhage all the other powers are great,.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#28
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Played my 3rd game with the list.

I played vs an SM/TAU list (ex Pally player)

Ethereal
Crisis Commander - stuff
3x Crisis Suits
2x Crisis Suits
2x Crisis Suits
2x6 Firewarriors
1x10 Upgraded Firewarriors (these guys troops?)
2x Broadsides
5x Terms - hammers
1x Bike Commander - Hammer, Artificer armour
5x Bikes + MM attack bike - 2MG, Fist
1x Storm Talon + typhoons

We rolled Big Guns - was a great match, very very closely fought, with some crazy rolls really influencing the game.

He wound up taking the game 8-4 when he secured 2 objectives, and managed to contest one with his bloody lucky commander. The game was swinging too and fro every turn, and it was my raven's poor armour pen rolls that allowed the talon's return fire - stunning the Raven - and not allowing me to charge his bikers with my terms. The bikers eventually went on to contest etc.
Quite upsetting! But, cant be helped.

Im still very happy with the list, only thing im thinking of now is that I may HAVE to find 15 points for EA on the raven, if those terms are going to be viable.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#29
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Citadel - i realised that Vortex is "heavy" - so its now out. Instead, i put in Avenger. Didnt do too badly!
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#30
Rutzah

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If you are still trying the GoI ability with the sternguard, you could give your raven a locator beacon and have them DS there with no scatter. If you are lucky enough to use it on round 2(and the raven survives ofc) you can zoom on round 3, use GoI again and shoot at something else and so on. It can be a bit tricky though, so dunno, its just an idea.


Edit: The locator beacon must already be on the table at the start of the turn for it to be used, so you cant use it on round 2, my bad.

Edited by Rutzah, 10 August 2012 - 01:52 AM.


#31
CitadelArmyGuy

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Citadel - i realised that Vortex is "heavy" - so its now out. Instead, i put in Avenger. Didnt do too badly!


You know, I saw that ability and was wondering about whether it was any good or not! Seems so tricky to get in the right spot to be able to use it. But at it the right moment, it can be awesome.

Does it provide overwatch Wall of Death hits?

Bummer about Vortex being 'heavy', I never even noticed that before haha. SO much worse... Idk, I mean on any turn you aren't casting Null Zone then the 2nd power should be something else thats still worthwhile... idk maybe Force Dome even? That being said, I think Gate is still really useful--- not as a 'primary mobilty power' but more as a just-in-case contingency power to allow for a 'strategic redeploy' for last-turn objective or table-quarter denial.

I can't count on one hand how many times I've wished a unit could just 're-materialize' somewhere-- even if risky.

Active Duty United States Army, Alumni of The Citadel Military College. 6th Edition: 54 Win - 6 Tie - 5 Loss // 7th Edition: 10 Win - 0 Tie - 0 Loss

 

Nine Principles of Warfare: Objective, Offensive, Mass, Economy of Force, Maneuver, Unity of Command, Security, Surprise, Simplicity. In tabletop wargaming, 8 of 9 apply.

Military terminology: A tarpit is a Fix. A bubblewrap is a Screen. Deathstars are Shock Units. Baiting units is an Ambush. Buffing is Force Multiplication. A pre-emptive decision is a Spoiling Action. Utilizing maneuver to influence your opponent's maneuver is Diversion. Special tricks that execute in 1-2 turns are Tactics, contrasted against your over-arching approach to winning a match is Strategy.
 
I play Semi-Competitive because after being a true believer and disciple of Competitiveness for years, I personally feel that 6th Edition made a mockery of game balance... but I've never had more fun than I do now! I still play nails-hard and I play to Win, but nevermore at the expense of fun for my opponent. Play what you like, or you won't like to play


#32
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Citadel - i realised that Vortex is "heavy" - so its now out. Instead, i put in Avenger. Didnt do too badly!


You know, I saw that ability and was wondering about whether it was any good or not! Seems so tricky to get in the right spot to be able to use it. But at it the right moment, it can be awesome.

Yup yup- i found with the Jump Pack -its pretty cool.

Does it provide overwatch Wall of Death hits?

It certainly appears to. Psychic shooting attacking.

Bummer about Vortex being 'heavy', I never even noticed that before haha. SO much worse... Idk, I mean on any turn you aren't casting Null Zone then the 2nd power should be something else thats still worthwhile... idk maybe Force Dome even? That being said, I think Gate is still really useful--- not as a 'primary mobilty power' but more as a just-in-case contingency power to allow for a 'strategic redeploy' for last-turn objective or table-quarter denial.

I can't count on one hand how many times I've wished a unit could just 're-materialize' somewhere-- even if risky.


Im gonna look into GoI a bit too. Not sure exactly how just yet.

Also, any clues on how our ability with DoA interacts with non DoA JP models? (and why?)
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#33
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REALLY good advice about Force Dome though. I think a 5++ may be quite useful in certain situations.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#34
CitadelArmyGuy

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Just thought of something-- If you really wanted to go ahead and use Vortex 'o Doom, you could always put the Libby on a bike to give him Relentless.

As far as DoA JPmodel with non-DoA models existing in the same unit... here is my take:

"A Blood Angels Unit with this special rule..." (Codex P.23)

"Battle Brother's are friendly units from all points of view..... Battle Brothers can be joined by allied Independent Characters." (BRB P.112)

"While an IC is part of a Unit, he counts as part of the Unit for all rules purposes" (BRB P.39)


So this means if the base Unit is a Blood Angels Unit, then an attached Battle Brother IC won't change the fact that it is still a BA Unit. And BA Units have DoA.

Active Duty United States Army, Alumni of The Citadel Military College. 6th Edition: 54 Win - 6 Tie - 5 Loss // 7th Edition: 10 Win - 0 Tie - 0 Loss

 

Nine Principles of Warfare: Objective, Offensive, Mass, Economy of Force, Maneuver, Unity of Command, Security, Surprise, Simplicity. In tabletop wargaming, 8 of 9 apply.

Military terminology: A tarpit is a Fix. A bubblewrap is a Screen. Deathstars are Shock Units. Baiting units is an Ambush. Buffing is Force Multiplication. A pre-emptive decision is a Spoiling Action. Utilizing maneuver to influence your opponent's maneuver is Diversion. Special tricks that execute in 1-2 turns are Tactics, contrasted against your over-arching approach to winning a match is Strategy.
 
I play Semi-Competitive because after being a true believer and disciple of Competitiveness for years, I personally feel that 6th Edition made a mockery of game balance... but I've never had more fun than I do now! I still play nails-hard and I play to Win, but nevermore at the expense of fun for my opponent. Play what you like, or you won't like to play


#35
R0N1N

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Just thought of something-- If you really wanted to go ahead and use Vortex 'o Doom, you could always put the Libby on a bike to give him Relentless.

As far as DoA JPmodel with non-DoA models existing in the same unit... here is my take:

"A Blood Angels Unit with this special rule..." (Codex P.23)

"Battle Brother's are friendly units from all points of view..... Battle Brothers can be joined by allied Independent Characters." (BRB P.112)

"While an IC is part of a Unit, he counts as part of the Unit for all rules purposes" (BRB P.39)


So this means if the base Unit is a Blood Angels Unit, then an attached Battle Brother IC won't change the fact that it is still a BA Unit. And BA Units have DoA.


Also on page 39- Special rules:

Special Rules
When an Independent Character joins a unit, it might have different special rules from those of the unit. Unless specified in the rule itself(as in the Stubborn special rule), the unit's special rules are not conferred upon the Independent Character, and the Independent Character's special rules are not conferred upon the unit. Special rules that are conferred to the unit only apply for asl ong as the Independent Character is with them.


This rule might stop you from using DOA on you IC that joined.



@ Mort
I guess we'll see each other at Nationals then, hopefully they can sort out the tournament rules FAQ that was posted, because some of that just does not make sense to me.

Your army looks good, I like how you always build up to a tournament with a spesific build, it shows in your gameplan on the day, and always shows in your results. Good luck to you.

#36
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@ Mort
I guess we'll see each other at Nationals then, hopefully they can sort out the tournament rules FAQ that was posted, because some of that just does not make sense to me.

Your army looks good, I like how you always build up to a tournament with a spesific build, it shows in your gameplan on the day, and always shows in your results. Good luck to you.


Cheers buddy! i appreciate it.
And yeah, man..dooont even get me started on the tourney rules :P Ill just spew rage here. I tried to keep it under control when I posted on WHG. :P
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#37
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No tricks:

Meph
Corbs
9 Stern - 3cmbi, 2Hvy Flmer, Fist
Pod - Beacon
10 Scouts - Cloaks,9 rifles, 1ML
10 TAC - PG, LC, Axe
10 RAS - 2MG, Fist
10 VVETs - TH, PF, PW
Aegis Line - Quad Fun


Thoughts?
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#38
CitadelArmyGuy

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Wow! Vanguards!

I've playtested them three times, but only as a cheap min-sized "hit squad."

What are your experiences running them big like this? I suppose 5 or 10 is the way to go, since combat squadding could add mucho flexibility if needed.

Edit: I should mention I am a huge huge fan of VV in 6th ed. ;)

Edited by CitadelArmyGuy, 20 August 2012 - 11:02 PM.

Active Duty United States Army, Alumni of The Citadel Military College. 6th Edition: 54 Win - 6 Tie - 5 Loss // 7th Edition: 10 Win - 0 Tie - 0 Loss

 

Nine Principles of Warfare: Objective, Offensive, Mass, Economy of Force, Maneuver, Unity of Command, Security, Surprise, Simplicity. In tabletop wargaming, 8 of 9 apply.

Military terminology: A tarpit is a Fix. A bubblewrap is a Screen. Deathstars are Shock Units. Baiting units is an Ambush. Buffing is Force Multiplication. A pre-emptive decision is a Spoiling Action. Utilizing maneuver to influence your opponent's maneuver is Diversion. Special tricks that execute in 1-2 turns are Tactics, contrasted against your over-arching approach to winning a match is Strategy.
 
I play Semi-Competitive because after being a true believer and disciple of Competitiveness for years, I personally feel that 6th Edition made a mockery of game balance... but I've never had more fun than I do now! I still play nails-hard and I play to Win, but nevermore at the expense of fun for my opponent. Play what you like, or you won't like to play


#39
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Wow! Vanguards!

I've playtested them three times, but only as a cheap min-sized "hit squad."

What are your experiences running them big like this? I suppose 5 or 10 is the way to go, since combat squadding could add mucho flexibility if needed.

Edit: I should mention I am a huge huge fan of VV in 6th ed. ;)


Really good actually CAG.

I played for 1st place in the last game of the South African 2011 Nationals tournament ->
2011 Nats BatReps

And you're spot on about the combat squads. If the enemy goes MSU, then the dual squads are great - especially against long fangs and the like. It shifted the course of every game I played if i remember.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#40
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So, thoughts on that list? Stronger than the one before? Or potentially weaker?
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#41
CitadelArmyGuy

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Meph
Corbs
9 Stern - 3cmbi, 2Hvy Flmer, Fist
Pod - Beacon
10 Scouts - Cloaks,9 rifles, 1ML
10 TAC - PG, LC, Axe
10 RAS - 2MG, Fist
10 VVETs - TH, PF, PW
Aegis Line - Quad Fun


General Opinion: the list kills opposing Light and Medium infantry more efficiently, but has less solutions for Heavy Infantry-spam or Tank-spam. Although since the majority of Armies use Light/Medium Infantry as their scoring units, you should do well in 'playing the mission' rather than 'headfirst engagement of the enemy list.' Taking quadgun means you can take down 'gimmick' flyers (Necron "one-of" transport shenanigans, Ork dakkas, Talons) but AV12-ers may still be dicey. However you can go for their troops and again, win by mission. By not taking a Flyer yourself, you are negating your opponent's points spent at AA so that's good.

I'm not sure if the missions for your tournament have been published or not, so you may be privy to critical information which would improve my understanding of list-strength. But at face-value, Meph is always a solid choice-- the biggest change that hurt him is *not* his AP3 sword as many think, but the fact that challenges change melees he used to win in 2 rounds into melees he needs 3 turns to win-- he loses a lot of his ability to truly run solo (if necessary) like he could in 5th.

Corbulo&Sternguard is great as usual, but I'm curious about the Fist in the Sternguard. Due to being podded, Corbs can certainly soak non-ID challenges-- but what about using Corbs as a tank against wounds put on the Unit, and so kit the SternSgt to fight challenges instead? Just a thought, perhaps a SS would go great here- idk I can see both sides of the issue.

I'll tell you now I don't like cloaks on scouts, but its a preference thing. base-Scouts have cheapness factor going for them, and cloaks make them cost as much as normal MEQ. I run my 140pt 10x Scout Snipers all the time, a great unit for its cost-- but I don't like paying more than base cost (or else a Tactical squad becomes 'better' if I let my mind think about it too long). But if you have good success with them, I could see them being good.

The Vanguards are really great, I can see excellent utility coming out of those guys-- one thing VV certainly have going for them is 'hidden' weapons (just like DC). Perhaps you'd think about switching both the PF and TH into Axes and add Meltabombs to make the points difference? Slightly worse at fighting MCs, but better at taking on any other target. If you kitted them specifically with MC hunting in mind, then probably leave them as-is. But since Meph, Sternguards, and (somewhat) Snipers can handle MCs, you may not need the VV kitted to take on MCs too.

For the Fortifications, how is the Tourney running them? Will terrain for all tables be setup before-hand, and then you get to add your fortifications in addition to the table-terrain in your deployment zone? If so, then it is a simply awesome 50pts.

Edited by CitadelArmyGuy, 24 August 2012 - 05:05 AM.

Active Duty United States Army, Alumni of The Citadel Military College. 6th Edition: 54 Win - 6 Tie - 5 Loss // 7th Edition: 10 Win - 0 Tie - 0 Loss

 

Nine Principles of Warfare: Objective, Offensive, Mass, Economy of Force, Maneuver, Unity of Command, Security, Surprise, Simplicity. In tabletop wargaming, 8 of 9 apply.

Military terminology: A tarpit is a Fix. A bubblewrap is a Screen. Deathstars are Shock Units. Baiting units is an Ambush. Buffing is Force Multiplication. A pre-emptive decision is a Spoiling Action. Utilizing maneuver to influence your opponent's maneuver is Diversion. Special tricks that execute in 1-2 turns are Tactics, contrasted against your over-arching approach to winning a match is Strategy.
 
I play Semi-Competitive because after being a true believer and disciple of Competitiveness for years, I personally feel that 6th Edition made a mockery of game balance... but I've never had more fun than I do now! I still play nails-hard and I play to Win, but nevermore at the expense of fun for my opponent. Play what you like, or you won't like to play


#42
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Meph
Corbs
9 Stern - 3cmbi, 2Hvy Flmer, Fist
Pod - Beacon
10 Scouts - Cloaks,9 rifles, 1ML
10 TAC - PG, LC, Axe
10 RAS - 2MG, Fist
10 VVETs - TH, PF, PW
Aegis Line - Quad Fun

Although since the majority of Armies use Light/Medium Infantry as their scoring units, you should do well in 'playing the mission' rather than 'headfirst engagement of the enemy list.'

I see myself running into trouble with paladin and termy spam lists, but other than that you're 100% right, id be playing to the mission.


I'm not sure if the missions for your tournament have been published or not, so you may be privy to critical information which would improve my understanding of list-strength.

Its going to be 5 of the 6 missions from the rule book. Not sure which ones just yet

Corbulo&Sternguard is great as usual, but I'm curious about the Fist in the Sternguard. Due to being podded, Corbs can certainly soak non-ID challenges-- but what about using Corbs as a tank against wounds put on the Unit, and so kit the SternSgt to fight challenges instead? Just a thought, perhaps a SS would go great here- idk I can see both sides of the issue.

Again- im a 2xS fan for reliable death. Also, cant get SS in Sternguard :huh: and i wouldnt want to lose his bolter through any more weapon options. I considered a claw, but the fist is a really beneficial all-rounder. Good call on the unit tank though- almost didnt consider that. Makes MUCH more sense.

I'll tell you now I don't like cloaks on scouts, but its a preference thing. base-Scouts have cheapness factor going for them, and cloaks make them cost as much as normal MEQ. I run my 140pt 10x Scout Snipers all the time, a great unit for its cost-- but I don't like paying more than base cost (or else a Tactical squad becomes 'better' if I let my mind think about it too long). But if you have good success with them, I could see them being good.

It would be the first time I tried! I usually run them like you do- 140 - cheap and cheerful.

The Vanguards are really great, I can see excellent utility coming out of those guys-- one thing VV certainly have going for them is 'hidden' weapons (just like DC). Perhaps you'd think about switching both the PF and TH into Axes and add Meltabombs to make the points difference? Slightly worse at fighting MCs, but better at taking on any other target. If you kitted them specifically with MC hunting in mind, then probably leave them as-is. But since Meph, Sternguards, and (somewhat) Snipers can handle MCs, you may not need the VV kitted to take on MCs too.

I'm more concerned about bloody paladins to be honest. Need that 2xS for stuff. Also, since theyre tank hunting a lot of the time, I like the 3xS8 attacks rather than the 1xS8 2d6

For the Fortifications, how is the Tourney running them? Will terrain for all tables be setup before-hand, and then you get to add your fortifications in addition to the table-terrain in your deployment zone? If so, then it is a simply awesome 50pts.


This is indeed how the forts will be set up! And i'll def have the quad gun in so 100points for it.

Edited by Morticon, 24 August 2012 - 08:20 PM.

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#43
Morticon

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Not sure whether to test out the above list tomorrow or this one:


BA Libby - Fear/Rage, Jump Pack
Lysander
Corbulo
Furioso - Frag Cannon, heavy flamer
Drop Pod
10 SM Stern Guard - 2cmbi Melta, 1cmbiPlas, Hvy Flmr, Axe
Drop Pod
10 RAS - 2MG, Fist
10 RAS - Flmr,MG, Fist
10 SM Sct - SR
8 DC - Fist
Drop Pod.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

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#44
Chaplain Admetus

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Why bother allying with SM? You can get a similar effect from all the Sternguard in a pod with a BA librarian, taking divination for constant prescience. As a bonus, this takes effect even when you fire the combi parts of the weapon (which Bystander won't do). You lose out on 1 Sternguard (since our pods have a max cap of 10), but you have the spare elites slot to use it, and dumping Lysander in favour of a bog standard librarian frees you up 100 points (125 once you take into account the sternguard you have to drop), points you can instead spend on a jump pack priest to boost the RAS effectiveness, and either get camo cloaks on the scouts (points permitting) or tool up the Death Company a bit. You lose Lysander's tanking potential, but you gain increased survivability in other areas to make up for it.
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#45
knife&fork

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Why bother allying with SM? You can get a similar effect from all the Sternguard in a pod with a BA librarian, taking divination for constant prescience. As a bonus, this takes effect even when you fire the combi parts of the weapon (which Bystander won't do). You lose out on 1 Sternguard (since our pods have a max cap of 10), but you have the spare elites slot to use it, and dumping Lysander in favour of a bog standard librarian frees you up 100 points (125 once you take into account the sternguard you have to drop), points you can instead spend on a jump pack priest to boost the RAS effectiveness, and either get camo cloaks on the scouts (points permitting) or tool up the Death Company a bit. You lose Lysander's tanking potential, but you gain increased survivability in other areas to make up for it.

Can't use blessings and maledictions when you drop, so the lib would have to stay with another squad.
24 years of Blood Angels

#46
Morticon

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Why bother allying with SM? You can get a similar effect from all the Sternguard in a pod with a BA librarian, taking divination for constant prescience. As a bonus, this takes effect even when you fire the combi parts of the weapon (which Bystander won't do). You lose out on 1 Sternguard (since our pods have a max cap of 10), but you have the spare elites slot to use it, and dumping Lysander in favour of a bog standard librarian frees you up 100 points (125 once you take into account the sternguard you have to drop), points you can instead spend on a jump pack priest to boost the RAS effectiveness, and either get camo cloaks on the scouts (points permitting) or tool up the Death Company a bit. You lose Lysander's tanking potential, but you gain increased survivability in other areas to make up for it.


As noted, you cant use the rerolls when they come on. Also, its constant.
I think the potential that Lysander brings to that squad is epic. He's also a killing machine that rivals mephiston. He lacks the speed and flexibility, but the consistency of always being S10 and being eternal warrior AND having a 3++ really makes up for it.

The way I see it, if I lost Lysander, id have the stern at 9 (for Corbs) meaning i cant combat squad.
Id have 225 points to play with then. Id need something to help with heavy hitters. Nobs, thunderwolves, pallies.
I could even get mephy if i dropped the stern to 8. Maybe thats a way to go??

But, i dont know if i would take a regular libby and im pretty sure i wouldnt put him in a pod - too easy a warlord kill i think.

If i used the 225 points elsewhere, I could maybe get a defense line and a small dev squad?
Just cant shake the feeling that if I lose him I take away from the ability to just soak up inordinate amounts of firepower and be killy.

Maybe another drop dread and some extra spice for the DC?
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

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#47
CitadelArmyGuy

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Lysander is an amazing choice-- I've been trying to find a way to work him into a list. 200pts for ultra-amazingness, he's one of the 'best value' ICs ever. For one, he is the single-best duelist (challenge winner) in the entire game (AP2 where it counts, always Str10). Draigo can be situationally better but that's about it!

Lysander answers so many questions its not even funny. You name it, he doesn't care! 4 wounds with EW and 3++.... just so good. Dropping him in with 10 Sternguard like that... such a great unit. Honestly Mort I think this Lysander list you've come up with is the best all-rounder for tournament play that you've come up with yet.

Active Duty United States Army, Alumni of The Citadel Military College. 6th Edition: 54 Win - 6 Tie - 5 Loss // 7th Edition: 10 Win - 0 Tie - 0 Loss

 

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#48
Morticon

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Lysander answers so many questions its not even funny. You name it, he doesn't care! 4 wounds with EW and 3++.... just so good. Dropping him in with 10 Sternguard like that... such a great unit. Honestly Mort I think this Lysander list you've come up with is the best all-rounder for tournament play that you've come up with yet.



Im of the same opinion about Lysander- will have to see how he works out.

One question though CAG, a mate on a private forum suggested some flexibility, maybe with fliers too.
So, what came up was dropping the DC and one RAS squad, and subbing in an 8man assault squad in JP (fist/mg) then an aegis line and 3 attack bikes.

Seems to balance out against fliers a little more, since i'll actually HAVE long range stuff to work with.
Thoughts?
Not worth the sub?
I essentially lose 8 resilient DC bodies for the survivability and flexibility of the aegis line, quad gun and bikers.


EDIT: @ChaplainA - I thought about what I could get for 225 and realised that's Dante's cost. May even be opportune to throw him in there - can have the RAS coming down with him too in turn 2. Could be really good.

Edited by Morticon, 26 August 2012 - 06:39 AM.

Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

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Corbulo Tactica

#49
knife&fork

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One question though CAG, a mate on a private forum suggested some flexibility, maybe with fliers too.


There's a fine line between adding flexibility and diluting your list. And I think you are very close to it.

I have to say I'm not crazy about the way your list is heading. Don't know about your local meta but I still expect long fang spam, priests with JoTWW, psyflemen, vindicare assassins and guard with lots of dakka.
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#50
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NO idea what the meta will be K&F, its up in Joburg (totally different city over 1000miles away).

I play tested this list today (without any changes). played against this:

BT1750

Master of Sanctity - frg, arty armour, term hons, 2 cenobytes.
Champ - SNTUTL
5 Terms - tank hunter, 2yclones
Dready - Venerable, smk, lascan, tnk hunter
5 Crusaders - las/plas
5 Crusaders - las/plas
6/3 Crusaders - Axe, MG, frg
10/8 Crusaders - PF, MG, frg
Land Raider - extra armour
2 Typhoons.


We played the short board edge game, and as a result I chose to deepstrike my jumpers too.

The amount of firepower corbs can take is just sick, im seriously debating when to bring this pod on. Im not sure which is best in which situation just yet. I didnt get the pod in the 2nd turn which was almost trouble.

Lysander is a joke. Complete beast. A few unlucky shots though and he can go down. I got him to have FNP within 3" of objectives, so, with the pod, him and the squad got FNP - nice.

In the end, we just called it at turn 4, he would have only had the land raider left had we played another full turn each.
Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica