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Stage 2 - Expanded Rules (Terrain/Battlefield Objects)


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#26
JeffJedi

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I offer Containment Doors as a possible alternative name for Heavy Doors.



#27
SentinelV

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A couple of comments going back to 1st edition rules.

 

For rubble squares the original rules were that any movement action that ends in a rubble square costs one extra AP. Thus turning in the rubble square costs an extra AP, not just entering the square. Stationary firing actions don't count as movement. Rubble originally also caused shots to deflect if they passed through it. For each dice that hit the target, roll a D6, the shot is deflected on a 5+. If a target is standing in a rubble square the shot counts as passing through a rubble sqaure. Shots passing through multiple rubble squares get multiple deflections. Flamer shots detonate in the rubble square that causes the deflection.

 

Another terrain piece introduced in 1st edition was the autofire weapon. It was a ceiling mounted  gun that shot at any model that passed under it. Introduced in The Last Stand campaign from WD137 and the Space Hulk Campaign book. They fire at all targets, friend and foe, though could be controlled from a console and thus not fire on friendly models if the console is controlled. They hit Terminators and 'stealers on 6+.



#28
Brother Tyler

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"Containment Doors" might work.

With regard to the rubble, I just found that bit in the Deathwing rulebook. I also realized that LOS for pitfalls/ladders wasn't covered well, and I completely forgot about area effect weapons. I'll make some updates and post them soon.

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#29
Brother Tyler

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I've updated both the pitfall and rubble rules to reflect the suggestions above. You can see the additional verbiage in orange in the (changes) post and a completely clean version in the (clean) version post below.

As far as autofire weapons go, I've taken a gander at those rules. I can't believe I forgot about them.

However, I'm inclined to change them. As it is, they act as nothing more than booby traps affecting a single square. They don't act like "guns."

So here's my proposal...

We can use the rapier and tarantula as our model, though these will be scaled down (i.e., they're smaller man-portable versions that can be carried by a single Terminator). We would essentially treat these as an autofire bolter (not storm bolter) slaved to some sort of machine spirit, firing at BS 2 as if on overwatch. They would essentially have a facing, just like a Terminator, and would fire at any model that performs an action in that facing, just like a Terminator on overwatch. If they jam, they're done unless a Terminator moves adjacent to them and spends 1 AP to un-jam them. They can also be attacked and destroyed just like a door.

I said "BS 2," but that essentially boils down to destroying a target on a 6 with no sustained fire bonus.

I'm on the fence about 1D6 or 2D6. I'm inclined to keep it at 1D6 so that they're not too powerful.

In missions where these are in play, the Space Marine player would be able to place them per the mission rules. They would be represented by counters with an arrow indicating facing (unless the artwork on the counters makes it very clear which way the weapon is facing).

Some missions might allow them to be placed in advance (theoretically defensive missions or missions where the Space Marines have had time to prepare the battlefield). In others, the Space Marines might have to carry them and place them as part of the mission, in which case we would treat them as large objects and they would be placed and activated for 2 AP.

This would give the autofire weapons the same performance as the sentry guns used in the movie Aliens.

For those purists that like the old version, we might include them as some sort of trap. In fact, that's exactly what I think we'll call them. "Traps"

Thoughts?

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#30
SentinelV

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I like the idea of the sentry gun. I've used 2 different types in games, 1 runs as an assault cannon, 10 rounds, no reloads, so it generates the tension seen in Aliens as the ammo counter clicks down. The other is a storm bolter, always on overwatch, cannot be unjammed. Although I have run scenarios where a techmarine is present and he could unjam the guns.

The guns blocked firing and movement and were automatically destroyed in close combat if a 'stealer spent  an AP to attack it.

 

Something that may need to be specified, is whether a trap or large object can be destroyed. The  autofire guns from The Last Stand couldn't be attacked by the 'stealers, though I see no reason they couldn't be attacked, possibly in the same way as doors, needing a 6 on any dice. Maybe mission specific.

 

There is another terrain type from first edition as well, the barricade. From the Wolf Lair campaign published in WD147.

'The barricades are specially constructed to protect troops firing from behind them. A model in a square directly touching a barricade has a line of sight through the barricade square and may fire through the barricade if a  target is in line  of fire. However, to anyonenot in a square touching the barricade it will seem like a crate, completely blocking line of sight. A barricade is destroyed in the same way as a crate, ie. roll as to destroy a door, with a succesful hit turning the barricade into rubble...'

 

Not really a terrain type, but the proximity fused plasma grenades from the Strike Deep campaign in WD149-150, may be worth including here as objects, or as another form of trap.



#31
Brother Tyler

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AUTOFIRE WEAPONS (changes)
Autofire weapons are bolters weapons which can be attached to the deck, ceiling, or wall. These weapons are slaved to a sensor array and a machine spirit, enabling them to fire automatically at any lifeform passing within their line of sight and range.

An autofire weapon may be carried exactly as a large object (see later) and placed in position. It costs 2 APs to emplace and activate an autofire weapon. When emplaced, the autofire weapon marker must be oriented with a facing and is treated exactly as a Space Marine Terminator for purposes of line of sight and line of fire. The mission special rules will indicate whether autofire weapons may be placed in advance or if they must be carried into position and placed as part of the mission.

Once activated, an autofire weapon fires as if on overwatch, rolling 1D6 and destroying targets (Genestealers, Terminators, and doors, but not containment doors) on a roll of 6. Note that autofire weapons do but does not benefit from the sustained fire bonus.

Autofire weapons come in two variants: storm bolter and heavy bolter. Regardless of variant type, autofire weapons destroy targets (Genestealers, Terminators, and doors, but not containment doors) on a roll of 6.

Storm Bolter
A storm bolter autofire weapon is treated just like a storm bolter being fired by a Terminator on overwatch. If a storm bolter autofire weapon rolls a double on the shooting dice, it jams. Place a 'jammed' marker on the autofire weapon.

Heavy Bolter
A heavy bolter autofire weapon is loaded with enough ammunition to fire ten times. Heavy bolter autofire weapon ammunition is kept track of on the Indomitus mission status display. At the start of the game place the heavy bolter autofire weapon ammunition counter on the 10 space on the track. Each time the heavy bolter fires, the Genestealer player must move the counter one space down the track. Once all ten shots have been used the heavy bolter may no longer shoot.

Reloading a Heavy Bolter Autofire Weapon
Some missions allow the heavy bolter autofire weapon to be reloaded. A heavy bolter ammunition reload must be carried as a large object (see below). A space Marine carrying a heavy bolter ammunition reload may reload the heavy bolter autofire weapon if the autofire weapon is in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. It costs 4 AP to reload the heavy bolter autofire weapon. Return the ammunition marker to the 10 space on the track. Note that the heavy bolter autofire weapon may be reloaded even if it still has ammunition, and the autofire weapon may be reloaded as many times as the mission allows.

Clearing Jams
If an autofire weapon jams, the jam may be cleared by any Space Marine model. The autofire weapon must be in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. It costs 2 AP to clear an autofire weapon jam.

Deactivating Autofire Weapons
The Space Marine player may deactivate an autofire weapon. The autofire weapon must be in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. It costs 2 AP to deactivate an autofire weapon.

Autofire weapons do not block line of sight, but block movement. Autofire weapons may be attacked just like doors. If destroyed, remove the autofire weapon marker.

Autofire weapons may be attacked just like doors. If destroyed, remove the autofire weapon marker.

Optional
If players agree, destroyed autofire weapons may be replaced by rubble and debris. If an autofire weapon is destroyed, replace the autofire weapon marker with a rubble and debris counter. An autofire weapon cannot reactivate once it has been destroyed.


Hidden Setup
Some missions allow autofire weapons to be placed in hidden locations, concealed among rubble. In these cases, the autofire weapon marker is placed facedown with the rubble side up. The autofire weapon facing must be such that the counter can be flipped with the same facing. Any action that takes place within the autofire weapon’s line of sight and overwatch fire range will immediately cause the autofire weapon to be revealed and fire. If a blip caused the action, the blip is converted. If an autofire weapon was emplaced with a hidden setup and is later destroyed, flip the marker over to the rubble side. The autofire weapon cannot reactivate once it has been destroyed.

Edited by Brother Tyler, 15 February 2014 - 04:09 PM.


#32
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AUTOFIRE WEAPONS (clean)
Autofire weapons are weapons which can be attached to the deck, ceiling, or wall. These weapons are slaved to a sensor array and a machine spirit, enabling them to fire automatically at any lifeform passing within their line of sight and range.

An autofire weapon may be carried exactly as a large object (see later) and placed in position. It costs 2 APs to emplace and activate an autofire weapon. When emplaced, the autofire weapon marker must be oriented with a facing and is treated exactly as a Space Marine Terminator for purposes of line of sight and line of fire. The mission special rules will indicate whether autofire weapons may be placed in advance or if they must be carried into position and placed as part of the mission.

Once activated, an autofire weapon fires as if on overwatch, but does not benefit from the sustained fire bonus.

Autofire weapons come in two variants: storm bolter and heavy bolter. Regardless of variant type, autofire weapons destroy targets (Genestealers, Terminators, and doors, but not containment doors) on a roll of 6.

Storm Bolter
A storm bolter autofire weapon is treated just like a storm bolter being fired by a Terminator on overwatch. If a storm bolter autofire weapon rolls a double on the shooting dice, it jams. Place a 'jammed' marker on the autofire weapon.

Heavy Bolter
A heavy bolter autofire weapon is loaded with enough ammunition to fire ten times. Heavy bolter autofire weapon ammunition is kept track of on the Indomitus mission status display. At the start of the game place the heavy bolter autofire weapon ammunition counter on the 10 space on the track. Each time the heavy bolter fires, the Genestealer player must move the counter one space down the track. Once all ten shots have been used the heavy bolter may no longer shoot.

Reloading a Heavy Bolter Autofire Weapon
Some missions allow the heavy bolter autofire weapon to be reloaded. A heavy bolter ammunition reload must be carried as a large object (see below). A space Marine carrying a heavy bolter ammunition reload may reload the heavy bolter autofire weapon if the autofire weapon is in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. It costs 4 AP to reload the heavy bolter autofire weapon. Return the ammunition marker to the 10 space on the track. Note that the heavy bolter autofire weapon may be reloaded even if it still has ammunition, and the autofire weapon may be reloaded as many times as the mission allows.

Clearing Jams
If an autofire weapon jams, the jam may be cleared by any Space Marine model. The autofire weapon must be in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. It costs 2 AP to clear an autofire weapon jam.

Deactivating Autofire Weapons
The Space Marine player may deactivate an autofire weapon. The autofire weapon must be in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. It costs 2 AP to deactivate an autofire weapon.

Autofire weapons do not block line of sight, but block movement. Autofire weapons may be attacked just like doors. If destroyed, remove the autofire weapon marker.

Autofire weapons may be attacked just like doors. If destroyed, remove the autofire weapon marker.

Optional
If players agree, destroyed autofire weapons may be replaced by rubble and debris. If an autofire weapon is destroyed, replace the autofire weapon marker with a rubble and debris counter. An autofire weapon cannot reactivate once it has been destroyed.

Hidden Setup
Some missions allow autofire weapons to be placed in hidden locations, concealed among rubble. In these cases, the autofire weapon marker is placed facedown with the rubble side up. The autofire weapon facing must be such that the counter can be flipped with the same facing. Any action that takes place within the autofire weapon’s line of sight and overwatch fire range will immediately cause the autofire weapon to be revealed and fire. If a blip caused the action, the blip is converted. If an autofire weapon was emplaced with a hidden setup and is later destroyed, flip the marker over to the rubble side. The autofire weapon cannot reactivate once it has been destroyed.

#33
Brother Tyler

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TRAPS (changes)
Traps cover a range of devices used to attack the unwary and notify the defender of a breach. These devices will automatically attack any lifeform passing through the square in which they are located.

Traps are placed during mission setup and guidelines for placing traps will be provided as part of the mission rules.

Any model passing over the trap counter is attacked. Roll a single dice. The model is destroyed on a 6.

The mission rules will indicate whether the traps are perpetual or one-use.

One-Use Traps
These traps are simple devices that are expended after one use. They will attack friend and foe alike. Once a one-use trap attacks a model, the trap marker is removed from play.

Perpetual Traps
These traps are complex devices that will continue to attack for the duration of a mission. If a model survives a perpetual trap attack, it may attack the trap just as a door. If the trap survives the attack, it will not attack again until a model moves into the square in which it is located. If a perpetual trap is removed, the trap marker is removed from play.

Hidden Setup
Some missions allow traps to be placed in hidden locations, concealed among rubble. In these cases, the trap marker is placed facedown with the rubble side up. If any model moves onto the square in which the trap is located, the trap will be revealed and will attack as normal.

Notes: These are the adaptation of the autofire weapons from 1st edition, changed slightly. I've added provisions for perpetual traps (essentially what the old autofire weapons were) and one-use traps (booby traps and IEDs). I've also added the hidden setup rule as an option for a mission. As with the revised autofire weapons, there's a possibility that traps may be placed by the Genestealers. One thing I've left out is the control panel that the 1st edition rules included. I see this as something that will be mission-dependent, so some missions may have centrally controlled traps and some might have "dummy" traps. Note that these devices represent a range of things, from scattered mines to explosive devices to whatever. We'll let the campaign/mission lore define the exact nature of the traps and use these rules as a generic baseline.

#34
Brother Tyler

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I've added the initial drafts of the (new) autofire weapons and traps for review and suggestions.

#35
Brother Tyler

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I'm hoping that the lack of feedback means that everyone that has read and considered the rules finds them satisfactory. If not, please speak up.

Also, it occurred to me that we need to throw the Genestealers a bone. Yes, we've given them pitfalls and the possibility of using traps and autofire weapons, but we haven't really given them anything they can call their own. So I'm considering two things.

First is an addition to the pitfalls - hidden pitfalls. These would be disguised as rubble and would see Terminators falling on a 4+ on the turn that they are revealed, but otherwise acting as regular pitfalls thereafter. Basically, when a Terminator enters a space that has a hidden pitfall, the rubble side would be turned over to the pitfall side. The Terminator would still pay the additional point for entering the space and would then roll to see if he falls. Naturally, this would only work on multi-level maps, and a best practice would be to have at least one or more "just rubble" spaces for each hidden pitfall.

Second would be ambushes. I haven't re-read the old ambush rules yet, so the following might change. My current concept is to similarly use a rubble as camouflage for an ambush. The ambush would basically be a Genestealer who is sneaky-like hiding (think of that scene in Aliens when Dietrich gets schwacked by the xenomorph that unfolds from the ceiling). When a Terminator enters the space, the Genestealer would be revealed and would immediately launch a close assault on the unlucky Terminator. Yes, only 1 Genestealer would be revealed. The close assault would be conducted as if the Genestealer had attacked from the side/rear, so if the Terminator wins the close assault, the Genestealer would be placed in the space to the Terminator's immediate front. The Genestealer player could always choose to convert an ambush space at any time, removing the rubble marker (after showing the reverse ambush side to the Terminator player) and replacing it with a single Genestealer. This might happen for any number of tactical reasons so I won't bother going into describing the ones I've considered. Also, the Terminator player could always clear the ambush by firing an area effect weapon into the tile in which the rubble is located (heavy flamer to the rescue). Of course, this just burns through the heavy flamer ammo and is a waste if the rubble counter is just a rubble counter (I'll leave it to the Terminator player to figure out what needs to be done tactically msn-wink.gif ). As with the hidden pitfalls, the best practice would be for at least one or more "just rubble" spaces for each ambush space.

Does anyone think I should/should not flesh these rules out for inclusion? Please provide your reasoning if you provide feedback.

Note that one big thing I need to finish is the artwork for the counters. I drew up some quick deck tiles (need a template for the various counters we'll be creating as I want consistency). I saw Grimm Blade's Space Hulk bases and I might use those as a model for the Indomitus tile artwork (three of them are really close to what I came up with). I won't be able to publish the rulebook until the artwork is done as the images of the markers are essential and will be included for clarity, and the actual markers will be available as a separate download.

And after posting the above and thinking on it for awhile, it occurred to me that we might also consider the addition of stairs that would allow for movement between levels without gravity being the motive force.

Edited by Brother Tyler, 21 January 2014 - 02:57 PM.

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#36
Brother Tyler

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AMBUSHES
Ambush counters are used by the Genestealer player to represent Genestealers that remained hidden until they can launch a surprise attack on a Terminator. Ambush counters have a rubble and debris graphic on the reverse side and are always placed using the hidden setup rule. The mission setup rules will indicate the number of ambush counters that may be used and may provide additional requirements or limitations on the placement of ambush counters.

Hidden Setup
Each ambush counter is placed facedown with the rubble and debris side up. A Terminator does not pay the additional AP to move into the space with the ambush counter. When a Terminator moves onto the square in which the ambush counter is located, the ambush counter is removed and the hidden Genestealer will be revealed and will immediately launch a close assault as if attacking from the space immediately behind the Terminator. If the Terminator wins the close assault, turn the Terminator to face the Genestealer. The Terminator player may use any remaining APs or CPs to attack the Genestealer through shooting or close assault.
 
Best Practice
There should be at least two rubble and debris markers for each ambush counter. This will ensure that the exact location of ambushes remains unknown until the Genestealer attacks. In addition, there should be no more than one ambush counter for every five Terminator models.

 
Converting Ambush Counters
The Genestealer player may convert an ambush counter to a Genestealer during the Genestealer Action Phase. The ambush counter is removed from play and replaced with a single Genestealer model with any facing desired, and is treated as a normal Genestealer for the rest of the game.
 
Clearing Ambush Counters
The Terminator player may attempt to clear possible ambush locations by firing area effect weapons. The Terminator player fires the appropriate weapon as normal and rolls the dice as normal, rolling 1D6 for each rubble and debris counter on the tile. For each result of 2+, one ambush counter is removed from the tile. The Genestealer player does not have to reveal any ambush counters that survive the area effect attack. If the area effect weapon has the persistent effect rule, persistent effect dice are only rolled if a surviving ambush counter is converted into a Genestealer.

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#37
Brother Tyler

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Draft image for deck tile. The coloration was a deliberate choice, intended to not blend with the colors of the actual tiles, though I may try to get it a bit closer so that it doesn't stick out like a sore thumb. The final version will be the base image for most of the counters, too.

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Naturally, I've drawn it much larger than necessary. This allows for detail as well as for shrinking the actual images down to the exact size needed for actual usage. This is a little more than 10x the actual size needed.

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#38
Brother Tyler

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I've decided to streamline the lift/elevator rules. The multi-door/multi-level ("multi-level" meaning three or more levels) rules were just too ponderous, so I'll save those for a later supplement.

So now the trick is to get the counters done and then make a decision on the articles about designing missions/campaigns. If I decide to include those (even if they're just starter articles that we can [vastly] improve upon later), the only real hold up will be in me finding the time to write them, re-write them, and finalize them (first drafts always suck msn-wink.gif ).

And then all I have to do is finalize the formatting so that I can put the various pictures in, at which point the basic Indomitus Rulebook will be made available for download.

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#39
Brother Tyler

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Okay, here is the tile shown much smaller. This is closer to the actual size at which it will be printed.

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#40
Brother Tyler

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Lift door tile:
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There will also be lift tiles in a variety of sizes, including 1-square tiles, 1x2 square tiles, and 2x2 square tiles. These will also feature the white and black hazard stripes on the square that is adjacent to this one (as if marking the edges of the corridor and lift).
 
Containment door tile:
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Blast door tile:
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These tiles will be placed under the door tiles. With the bases for the door tiles, only the edges will be visible, hence the striping on the edges.

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#41
Brother Tyler

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Okay, I've updated some of the rules entries. As before, deletions are marked in red and struck through while additions are marked in orange.

I still owe the correction to the rubble and debris rules (+1 AP for movement actions ending in the space).

I also need to address SentinelIV's post above. I like the concept of changing the autofire guns, with two different guns types. Or perhaps adding two more autofire gun types (with the current version serving as a "light" type). The points about consoles and controls is due some attention, too.

To be honest, I've been trying to get the counters done and I've been vacillating between counter artwork and stairs. I've almost completed my mental composition of the stairs rules, but need to get the concept down in writing so that we can pick holes in it.

More soon (hopefully).

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#42
Brother Tyler

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Okay, I've updated the autofire weapon rules. I've changed them to a storm bolter variant (follow the normal rules) and a heavy bolter variant. The heavy bolter also rolls 3D6 and has limited ammunition, but is otherwise similar to a storm bolter.

I've also added provisions for reloading the heavy bolter variant (but only if the mission specifically allows that to happen) and for deactivating an autofire weapon. I'm not sure if anyone would actually ever do that, but I didn't want to exclude the possibility.

So now I have to create two autofire weapons markers, making them distinct as a storm bolter and a heavy bolter. That should be fairly easy.

I've also updated the ambushes and hidden pitfalls.

Lastly, I checked the 1st edition rules for rubble and found only an AP increase for moving into such a space - there were no rules for increased AP cost when turning in such spaces. So I've left those rules as written.

I'll try to get the stairs rules finished today/tomorrow.
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#43
Brother Tyler

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The new release includes rules and a tile for a turbolift, so I can strike the lift rules from Indomitus (and that tile is one of the ones that has been kicking my butt, so this is a good thing).
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#44
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Mechanicus_Adept

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do you need any of the old expansion rules from the previous edition of space hulk?

 

I happen to have several links and files regarding different races used in the game. Most of it relies on a point system when two players use different races other than marines and genestealers.


Edited by Mechanicus_Adept, 28 October 2014 - 02:08 AM.


#45
Brother Tyler

Brother Tyler

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I have all of the old stuff, but thanks anyways. msn-wink.gif

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#46
Brother Tyler

Brother Tyler

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Consider the lift rules stricken from the register as the "4th edition" of the game (or 3.5, if you prefer) includes rules for lifts. We'll simply point to the official rules.

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