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Road to Nationals - 2013

lists batrep blood angels tactics meta

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#101
Calnus

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If it helps any, I have ran Mephiston into a Riptide before, mostly because his other target ran away at the end of shooting :(

 

He failed exactly 1 save and I saved 1 warp charge for force weapon.  Dead riptide at I7, Meph swaggers into terrain for a 5+.

 

Thinking back on it, you're just about on averages with  Meph vs. a Riptide.  You get 6 attacks on the charge, if you hit all at 3+ you get to wound at 2+ with Sanguine Sword (assuming you didn't pop Unleash Rage, I think preferred enemy vs. Sword is about the same overall), if you manage to get 6 wounds on after those dice, not terribly difficult, then you should on average see a single failed armor save.  And after passing one psychic test, you get 1 dead Riptide.

 

Otherwise the MC will hit on 5s wound on 4s and probably knock a wound of Meph, letting you try for that mystical 1 armor save again.

 

Anecdotal evidence aside, I personally like the BA/DA list.  Its fast, has gatling guns, and embodies the Angels of Death.  I think it would be more fun for me to play than the BA/SM.



#102
Ushtarador

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Mephi is indeed quite good against riptides, they have a hard time even hitting him and he will almost surely kill them within 2 rounds of combat :)

Also, black knights are surprisingly decent in cc, after all they have 4 attacks on the charge, S5 rending and hit&run if things go bad.

 

The power field generator sounds like a great idea, but the bike+libby+priest squad sounds quite expensive, not sure if that's worth it.



#103
Chaplain Admetus

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I prefer the DA one on balance over the SM one, but Black Knights are VERY expensive IIRC. You might as well just cheese it up and take a bolterwing contingent :P


The Angel Sanguine - UK Throne of Skulls, October 2012

#104
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Guys, need your help!

 

 

Played in 2 playtest games this week and have finally found stuff that is working for me, that I feel is balanced enough to take into a tourney.

 

Im now looking at this (similar core)

 

 

Mephiston

DA Libby- Bike, Auspex, Lvl2, Axe
 
1x 5man BA ASM - flmr
Razorbacks - AC,
1x 5man BA ASM - flmr
Razorbacks - Las/Plas -
1x 5man BA ASM 
Razorbacks - undecided
1x5man DA Scouts
 
3x Attack Bikes- 2MM
1x DA Whirlwind
2x BA Ravens - TLMM, TLAC
 
1x Vengeance Turret - Cannon.
 
 
AAAND  either:
 
A:  4x Black Knights
 
or
 
B:  3x Attack Bikes (3x MM)
 
A:
PROS-
Scouts Move
Can outflank
Can drop entire squads T or I.
Lots of AP2
Decent Fighting
High Cover Save
CONS
1W models - bad saves lose them quickly.
Drakes eat them (wld probs have to outflank vs. Drakes which is not bad.)
 
B: 
PROS-
Longer Range 
AP1
Higher S - instapop
More Wounds - more resilient to drakes
CONS
Not as good in combat
 
 

Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

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#105
Ushtarador

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Black Knights, they are waaayy more flexible and you have enough melta with the other attack bikes and the ravens. Also, their coversave is better :P



#106
Calnus

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I don't really see how any of your army, aside from Meph, really wants to be in combat anyways.  While I like the Black Knights in general, in this case I feel you're better served with more attack bikes, to keep the resiliency up.

 

You get the most out of the BK, in my opinion, as support for a heavy melee component.  The grenades turn fights of marine vs. marine into relatively easy wins for ASM, plus thinning out a target is always a good thing.  But without using that benefit, all it really gets you is a slight increase in the effectiveness of anti-infantry weapons and some solid mobile plasma.  And I'm still convinced that Melta beats Plasma in overall effectiveness, even with rapid fire.  Being able to kill vehicles at will and wound pretty much anything on 2+ helps.



#107
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Blargh! sorry to do this to you lot :P  I saw the terrain at the hosting event- gonna be LOADS of multilevl ruins - which means whirlies are not ideal

 

 

What do you think of either of these:

 

Meph

Libby- Lvl2, bike, auspx, axe.

4x Black Knights- Apoth, Champ.   (or 5bikers straight - your thoughts?)

 

2x 5man BA ASM (1 flmr) - Razors 

1x 5man DA TAC - Razor-

1x 5man DA SCT

 

3x Attk Bk - 2MM, 1HB

3x Attk Bk - 3HB

 

2x Ravens

 

 

OR

 

Meph

Libby- Lvl2, bike, auspx, axe.

 

2x 5man BA ASM (2 flmrs) - Razors 

1x 5man DA TAC - Razor

1x 5man DA SCT

 

3x Attk Bk - 2MM, 1HB

3x Attk Bk - 3MM

 

2x Vengeance Turrets (1 punisher, 1 cannon)

 

2x Ravens


Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#108
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I'm real interested in how the Vengeance gun worked for you in the earlier list.  The S8 AP3 large blast is tasty, and BS hardly matters with scatter anyway on something like that. 

 

So here's the deal--Given that what you're looking at is between AP2 on bikers and AP3 (or less) on fortifications, essentially, do you expect more terminators or marines to be needing shot?  Or neither?  If neither, I'd go with the Black Knights.  If its substantially more marine-types than terminator-types, then the vengeance batteries (especially if you can tweak points for dual cannons, perhaps drop the auspex?) should perform well.



#109
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Calnus, i think overall maybe less 2+ save stuff, but the top player will have the riptides and serps.  

For me, its more about the ability to place those things in the way and give myself some cover.


Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#110
Calnus

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If all you are using the vengeance guns for is cover and annoyance, then I'd almost certainly take the Black Knight list.  I'd probably tweak the unit though--Getting 6 bikers for the dual grenade really ups your reliability of getting that debuff off each turn.  I'd be looking at the second mastery level on your DA lib, and the apoth and chap upgrades for points to take from.

 

And also, if you can find points, I'd really like to have an ASM unit with a power weapon of some kind in this list.  Even if its attached to a razorback, having a unit you can put in a gunship and drop turn 4-5 to clear a backfield objective and score works really well.  You'd do it based on your opponent having little anti-air, as opposed to keeping them in the razor if they have less anti-vehicle at range, but its an astonishingly effective trick to pull.  And at least locally, very few people see it coming until you've done it a time or two.  Tactical flexibility for the win!



#111
Chaplain Admetus

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I had typed out a long and thoughtful reply. Then the phone rang and my train of thought was successfully derailed. I'm going to say Black Knights, because they look like they'd be more fun to use and would fit the theme of the army better. I also know absolutely nothing about the vengeance turrets though, so bear that in mind.

 

The list looks solid though, definitely much better than the (hopefully lethal) joke list I'll be bringing out for my game this evening :P.


The Angel Sanguine - UK Throne of Skulls, October 2012

#112
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Chap! Thanks for the thoughts - another tick for the BKs it seems.

 

Calnus, 

 

thanks for the thoughts!  BKs are looking like the smarter choice hey.  They're currently in as HQ, so they dont give away KP in scouring.  So, max of 5.  I could feasibly switch em round to Fast, but there's no way I can lose the lvl2 libby- hes incredible.  I also need another lvl 2 hood on the field for the Psychic Choir guy.  Having the libby diminishes his effectiveness by 50%.  Also, the telepathy powers are nuts - the majority of the powers on that table are useful.

 

I also thought about losing the Apoth- but vs. Drakes, it means the squad flamed just dies, instead of getting a 5+ recourse.

 

Id LOVE to get a PW in the squad of marines- i seem to be putting them in the ravens more and more it seems. Especially when theres no anti-air - im so tight on points though- suggestions where from?


Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica

#113
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Also, played a game today with two of these things.  Again, underwhelming as far as damage potential is concerned, but for tactical potential i really, really enjoyed it.  Made my opponent play completely differently, made him charge it early to kill it, dragging his dreadknight out (and in range of me killing it).  

Seems to have its benefits!  Will test further. Maybe get one more game before nationals on Sat.


Gamist, cheesy, beardy or broken; If Games Workshop put it in the book I'll gladly play against it, or with it. - Mort
"Use soft words and hard arguments." (Henry George Bohn [1796-1884].)

There is no harm in, on occasion, having disagreements. It's another thing entirely, however, to be a tool in conveying that disagreement.

"OP: The term used by players to describe a combination of yours they are personally unable to beat"

Collection of Battle Reports
Corbulo Tactica