rick_m Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Hi I was wandering if I could get some input. This is my first foray into 30K, I have been playing 40k for a few years and have allways wanted to do imperial Fists in this period, I have had 2 Imperial Fist armys in my time and want to do them justice. What i want to create is a list that is competative while not being a full-blown tournament army, at the same time as being fitting with the background of the Fists. HQ Legion Praetor - Paragon Blade - Digital Weapons - Iron Halo Master of Signals - Power Sword Elites 1 Legion Apothecary - Power Sword - Artificer Armour Contemptor Dreadnought - Multi Melta Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought - 2 Twin Linked Autocannon Legion Rapier Weapons Battery - Additional Gun Platform - Laser Destroyers Troops Tactical Squad - Additional 5 men - Power Fist - Combi Melta - Artificer Armour - Apothecary and Praetor with this unit Tactical Squad - Power Fist - Combi Melta - Artificer Armour - Rhino Tactical Squad - Power Fist - Combi Melta - Artificer Armour - Rhino Tactical Squad - Heavy Chainsword - Artificer Armour - Rhino Fast Attack Land Speeder - Multi Melta Land Speeder - Multi Melta Heavy Support Legion Artillery Tank Squadron - 2 Legion Whirlwind’s Fortification Aegis Defence Line - Icarus Lascannon My main concerns are as follows. - Too much melta for 30k wiith all the armoured cermate. Taking this into account what anti tank sould i be thinking about? -Can the master of signals pass on his abilty's to the rapier battery? -My experience of Whirlwinds is limited, I like the idea of my guys hunkering down behind their fortifications, using artillery support and counter attacking with their rhino squads. but I doupt they will be much use. Thankyou in advance for any advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstalker Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I think you're definitely too heavy on the melta. At 2k, I think that facing at least a Land Raider Phobos should be expected. You might be facing more, even as much as two Spartans with Flare Shields and Armored Ceramite. If you run into any AV14 vehicles with Armored Ceramite, you're going to be struggling to take it down with just an Icarus Lascannon and two Lasdestroyers - and those same weapons will likely be the enemy's prime target. I think the firepower of the standard WW is far too anemic. For fewer points you could get the tougher and much more effective WW Scorpius, or you could swap both of them out for a single Medusa. The Medusa would give you some added anti-tank. The Master of Signal can buff the rapiers BS just fine (it's any unit within 6 inches, no difference between artillery, vehicles, infantry - just no ICs or Superheavies). But in order to do that, he needs to give up his own shooting, which means he's not firing the Icarus. Y'know, I think the idea is fairly sound: provide yourself a firebase with artillery, rapier lasdestroyers, and some troops to keep your home objective secure and give yourself an anvil for a matching hammer. I question some of the choices, though. If that tactical blob is just hiding in the back, why are you stuffing a 160 point HQ with them? What value is he providing? If you're going to take someone like him, wouldn't it be better to get him out front with those attacking Rhino squads, where he'll actually use those expensive close combat upgrades? I'm worried about this army's longevity. It's 49 power armored bodies (plus the HQ and Apothecary), 5 AV 11 vehicles, 2 AV10 vehicles, and 2 AV13 vehicles. The ADL will help, but I don't think it'll do enough. You've got too many points tied up in paying the additional unit taxes (30k incentivizes larger units over small ones through discounted prices on additional squad members) and in a Praetor who is all dressed up with no where to be. Given the availability of armored ceramite and the prevalence of high strrength, high rate of fire shooting in the legion list, I don't think sacrificial units like MM Land Speeders make sense. In 40k, if you use two of them to nail a Land Raider, you're happy about what a good trade you got. In 30k, they will not kill the Land Raider and will die senselessly, putting you 100 points down. The risk is increased and the chance of reward is lessened. For fewer points you could have added a third rapier to your squad instead of getting one of those speeders. You should maybe consider finding your Praetor a Land Raider of his own with a Vet Squad (and Apothecary) to ride with him. I would look at cutting the standard Contemptor, Heavy Chainsword tac squad, and the Land Speeders for this. It will also give you some rolling cover for your Rhinos to help make sure they can deliver their tactical squads where/when needed. Maybe it should be terminators instead of Vets in a Spartan instead of a Phobos. I'm also not a particular fan of the combimeltas on the sergeants, I think they're too unreliable for the points cost. A meltabomb is something you can use every turn and actually goes through Armored Ceramite (having the Armorbane and not the Melta rule). If it's a heavy vehicle you need to kill, you're going to be within six inches of it for the combimelta anyway. Vehicles also do not get jink or cover saves against meltabombs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheForgottenAngel Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 When I think of imperial fists I don't think of rhinos and melta. Legion Medusas area bargain and with some vox on your tactical marines they get even better. This will fulfill your idea of danger close support to your tactical squads. Have you thought of breacher squads? Their rules are very fluffy and good against templates, throw in an apothecary and you have an immovable object. Very imperial fisty. Meltabombs as said earlier are the way to go on sergeants, and a powersword (artificer armor is optional). One thing to know is that Wall of Martyrs giving stubborn in 30k is amazing where ATSKNF is absent. Much better than an aegis. I'm assuming you already bought the aegis though so we can stick with that. That being said, icarus is a waste of the master of signals rule (for me personally). On a medusa, scorpius WW, basilisk though it's really awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick_m Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Thanks for the feedback. I have made some changes. I understand the point about melta bombs, but i do love powerfists in combat being able to kill 2+ armour save with ease (what are your thought on this?). I have got rid of all of my melta and added a lot of Lascannaons/ Laser Destroyers and Demolisher Cannons for a bit of fun. I was tempted by the artillery but i have thought about it an maybe vindicators are the way to go. I also take the point about the wall of martyrs but I wanted some extra AA. The rhinos have also gone, I like the models but as was mentioned I don't think they fit the theme. My main concerns now are lack of troops/ assault potential. Any Ideas would be greatly appreciated So far I have only brought 20 marines and a Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought so i am fairly flexible. Cheers HQ Legion Praetor - Paragon Blade - Digital Weapons - Iron Halo Master of Signals - Power Sword - Artificer Armour Elites Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought - 2 Twin Linked Lascannon Legion Rapier Weapons Battery - Additional Gun Platform - Laser Destroyers Legion Rapier Weapons Battery - Additional Gun Platform - Laser Destroyers Troops Tactical Squad - Additional 5 men - Power Fist - Combi Plasma - Artificer Armour Tactical Squad - Additional 5 men - Power Fist - Combi Plasma - Artificer Armour Tactical Squad - Additional 5 men - Heavy Chainsword - Melta Bombs Heavy Support Legion Spartan Assault Tank -Armoured Ceramite Legion Vindicator Legion Vindicator Fortification Aegis Defence Line - Icarus Lascannon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheForgottenAngel Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Where you are at now here are my pennies.Get a second tactical squad of 20 men. Add additional CCW to the lot of them. You can model this with either the chain bayonets or the bladed bayonets. It also allows you to run them without. If I were you, I would drop the Aegis and Quad gun completely. It's not worth it and never makes it's points back. Like ever, ever. The Spartan will be your AA with it's quad TLLC because golly it beats everything. Add a flare shield and armored ceramite and you're cooking with oil. I like Vindicators and take them in 2's or 3's. Use these as a mobile screen for your tactical marine blobs. Laser Rapiers are awesome. However if you are facing some more hordes, you make want to take the thud gun or the heavy bolter option, stay clear of the gravcannon, it's not as good as the 40k version. My reasoning is that you get a cheap platform with ridiculous killing potential. Be on the look out for a Vol kite version in the future that is like a downsized version of the Felglaive, no eta on that though. Your Mortis (If you have the second/third book) can also act as your AA platform with actual Skyfire and Interceptor (if it doesn't move).At this point you're to buy list (In my opinion).Legion Praetors.20 Tactical MarinesSpartan-------2nd list-------- Apothecaries (Comes with 2) They make your marines + vexilla an immovable object)4X Rapier Laser Destroyers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siebold Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 I like the idea of having multiple thud guns, they would syngerize quite well with Vox, the master of signal and/or Medusae. The abillity to pin opponents right in front of your guys or when you are advancing might be worth gold, especially as morale is far morei mportant in 30k and the mortars also have the shellshock rule. It would be especially fine if the new bookwould give the fists some sort of bolter drill and/or counter attack when not moving. I wish I knew when it comes out though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloroutofspace Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 I think that putting a Tactical Despoiler squad with a Praetor or a Consul into a Spartan is a nice idea. Veterans can't hold objectives and don't get Fury of The Legion... I like the 2 Vindicators, but the problem with these is that they take a HS slot each, which matters if you ever decide to expand the list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thor1234 Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 i'd suggest swapping out the vindicators for 2 Medusas, though you'd have to fire on the same target they are deadly, and again synergise with the MoS and the Voxes..... again I agree that if you can squeeze in some Quad mortars as well, you'll be able to fire as your men advance, utilising those voxes...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick_m Posted February 3, 2014 Author Share Posted February 3, 2014 Thnaks for the contunied feedback. This is the new list HQ Legion Praetor - Paragon Blade - Digital Weapons - Iron Halo Elites Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought - 2 Twin Linked Lascannon Legion Rapier Weapons Battery - Additional Gun Platform - Laser Destroyers Legion Rapier Weapons Battery - Additional Gun Platform - Thudd Gun Apothecary Detachment Troops Tactical Squad - Additional 10 men - Power Fist - Artificer Armour - Chainswords Tactical Squad - Additional 5 men - Power Sword - Melta Bombs Tactical Squad - Additional 5 men Heavy Support Legion Spartan Assault Tank -Armoured Ceramite -Flare Sheild Legion Vindicator Legion Vindicator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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