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An exception to a rule

Xenos Inquisition

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10 replies to this topic

#1
Heru

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This topic has inspired this thread: http://www.bolterand...89365-inqusitor

I'd like to purpose a topic for consideration in regards to the B+C's no Xenos policy when dealing with the Inquisition. I'd think we should consider the merits of relaxing this rule in two circumstances only.

First I'd like to clarify:

1. I am not talking about Xenos allies or primaries or anything like that.
2. This is in regards to Inquisitor Warbands (for Inquisitor and Inquisitor 28mm).
3. This is also in regards to 40k (regular) Inquisition henchmen.
4. At the moment Jokaero are the sole exception to the no Xenos rule.

Inquisition Warbands are known to occasionally include Xenos members, and I think the exception should be reconsidered beyond "just Jokaero because you can take them in Codex GK & I".

I think generally this rule does a disservice to people who are trying to create a fluffy radical'bent Inquisition warband/army, and not a Xenos warband/army.

A rule of allowance would be more fitting to the nature of the Inquisition. Talking about a single Xenos henchman in a human dominated Inquisition warband for example shouldn't be censored. That henchman is part of the theme of that Warband, disallowing discussion or pictures of it damages said theme.

Edit: Having a Xenos in a warband says more about the Inquisitor and the Warband than it will ever say about the Xenos and his race.

If a warband was 30% or more Xenos, then there'd be an issue where discussion is likely to get bent into Xenos no-go territory.

Same could be said for 40k Inquisition Henchmen, except I think the percentage of allowance would have to be lower, and more reliant of "variety" so as not to just be a "minisquad of Kroot / Tau / Eldar".

Now I'm not saying this needs to happen, I'm just asking that the topic be put into consideration.

Edited by Heru Talon, 11 April 2014 - 11:46 PM.

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#2
Grotsmasha

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*Frater hat on*

 

I bumped into the Xenos rule with my Duels and Diorama's Challenge last year and the Mod's position (almost exclusively) was it's too much of a slippery slope and is massively open to abuse. While I agree with the sentiment, I can't see it happening.

 

Cheers,

Jono


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#3
Captain Semper

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The problem is that altough in other areas of B&C limited discussion or even depiction on Xenos is allowed, in the PC&A it's deemed to be problematic given that once depicted, one cannot forbid discussion on it. The last thing we want is to see a thread devoted to how to paint Xenos. If we allow depiction, we cannot disallow discussion. Even one Xenos picture could provoke that (let alone 30% of an Inquisitorial retinue).

 

So yes, in Tactica and Battle Reports for example some limited discussion/depiction of Xenos is allowed, but the PC&A are firmly Armies of Humanity and this is unlikely to change unless a major change in the direction of B&C occurs.



#4
Lysimachus

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Would it be a viable solution to allow Fraters to post pics of a xenos as part of an Inquisitor/Inq28 warband in the Other Games forum?

 

Or perhaps even create a sub-forum in the Other Games section specifically for Inq/Inq28 where people could create (fluff and modelling/painting), discuss and show pics of their warbands?



#5
Noctus Cornix

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I generally do not find myself in argument against any rules the BnC lays down, but this is something I must vehement voice my disappointment in because the sheer double standards the moderation team takes on this subject.

 

I find myself in two situations where I believe that Xenos SHOULD be allowed permanently under the rules of the board, these two being strictly under the clause of the Inquisition and under the case that is meant to compliment an existing BnC appropriate model, whether it be due as a trophy, corpse, or part of a Diorama. Here is my reasoning.

 

The first matter is in concern for that of the Inquisition, I feel that Heru Talon made the point rather clear so I have little to add on for the subject. It is clearly stated in the fluff for those of the Inquisition that some radicals will implement the use of xenos as warriors, agents and such. At the same time, I can see this being used as an excuse for people to post up entire swathes of xenos and try to say that their using it for the Inquisition, but such a case would simply be a member deliberately trying to abuse the system. The case concerning the Inquistion thread very specifically stated that it was to be a warrior acolyte and it was strictly 1 model.

 

The second matter would be in concern of that for complimenting BnC appropriate models. The fact of the matter is is that Xenos have been on the BnC all the time. People commonly post dioramas every once in a while involving xenos and I've almost never seen a moderator attempt to shut them down for it. In fact, a lot of people, myself included, have xenos on our bases, having our Space Marines hacking a genestealer apart, hold up their head as a trophy, or about to step on their filthy bodies. The question I ask is 'what's the difference?' because I can find none. Putting a Knight Titan about to curb stomp a Carnifex on his base and doing the same on a diorama are the exact same thing. There is no difference aside from the most minute detail that they are all on one base. Yet when you create a diorama, the base is simply unimportant to begin with. The field of the diorama is all that matters. I feel that Grot's Diorama was denied xenos to be in any diorama piece due to a groundless decision that turns a blind eye to something that has taken place numerous times on this website.

 

That is of course simply my thoughts on the matter, thank you for your time and consideration.



#6
Dam13n

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The key thing is focus. If the vile xenos either is the focus of a diorama or even just could be seen as the focus - then generally that is likely to cause a mod to power up the melta.

In your example of a Knight curb-stomping a Carnifex - the Knight dwarfs the Carnifex and is the clear focus of the overall model.

If you're unsure, then sending one of the PC&A mods a PM to check legality before posting the thread might be a good idea.

Edited by Dam13n, 12 April 2014 - 04:38 PM.


#7
Captain Semper

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Well noctus cornix the idea is to make sure that the discussion will not be directed to Xenos. In the context of the Inquisitorial retinue, a Xenos gets the same exposure as any other member and as such the right to be discussed at the same length. Same applies to a duelling diorama where you have two figures equally competing for the attention of the viewer.

Now if a Xenos is part of the basing and does not detract from the main theme (thus not generating discussion) it may be tolerated. I will not be editing out a Reaver Titan just because he steps on a half-buried Ork...

Rest assured we take no particular joy from sensoring the frater work, but maintaining the spirit of the B&C rules is very important. We also revise our stance as the hobby evolves and this is evident on the new rules of discussing allies for example or the inclusion of the IG. Having said that we need to draw the line somewhere and this is: no Xenos in the PC&A.

#8
Noctus Cornix

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As much as I still disagree on the stance, I can respect that reasoning, and you both make a solid point. I did not mean any offense by my post, and I appreciate your time.



#9
Captain Semper

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No offence cornix - it's useful to discuss such issues. smile.png


Edited by Captain Semper, 12 April 2014 - 05:42 PM.


#10
Brother Tyler

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Also keep in mind that responses from moderators/administrators in Suggestion Box discussions aren't necessarily decisions.

 

We will consider the proposal and render a decision (maybe not soon, but soon enough).


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#11
Warpsmith_Johnson

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I for one say that I rather like the limitation. It gives a focus to the forum, and that helps bring a core to build community upon. One of the reasons I stopped going to a few places online was that their focus shifted from 40k to other things, when the name of the sites created an expectation of a 40k community.


Edited by Warpsmith_Johnson, 24 April 2014 - 04:15 AM.

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