Guns guns guns and guns

[MagicMan]

Just a question for any Heresy nuts, is it acceptable to use current 40k guns (bolters, meltas, flamers etc etc) on 30k mini's?

I've heard that Storm-Bolters are a no-no. Despite Horus using one in the first hundred pages of the first HH book....

[Marshal Rohr]

I prefer the modern melta, modern chaos plasma, and IG flamers to the Heresy counterparts, but for Bolters I like the Phobos as the standard rifle, Tigrus as a carbine, and Umbra as a specialized version. 

[Knight of the Raven]

Why in the bloody world would it be not acceptable?

 

A bolter is a bolter is a bolter. If you like the looks of 40K special weapons better, or like the tactical squad missile launcher more than the huge 30K one, knock yourself out.

 

I've seen a few people use modern bolters in their heresy army, though I don't have anyone specific in memory at the moment.

[Marshal Rohr]

I like modern lascannons too, feels heavier and more destructive. 

[MagicMan]

Why in the bloody world would it be not acceptable?

 

 

Lol im one of those guys that gets a bit OCD about my models. Like making sure the shoulder pads have the right little rectangle bit on it (If that makes sense? lol).

 

I have about 10 Terminators that i won't touch because when i made them i glued the Crux Terminatus on the wrong side.

 

 

 

I just wondered if the 40k marks of weapons were around during the HH. Otherwise i'd feel weird using them on Heresy models. :)

[Knight of the Raven]

I don't know about the weapon marks, but the 'modern' rhino certainly was there during in 30K. It's called the Mars pattern and, predictably, it's inferior to the Deimos one but easier to male and repair.

I get you though. I have, ah, difficulties using 40K shoulder pads on maximus armour. The trim is just too wide.

[Brother Captain Lucian]

I wouldn't make my 30k models with 40k variants of weapons. Im going "all in" anyway, so i find no reason not to use the FW variants.

 

But that's just how i feel, it's not like i would yell at someone who did though.

[Marshal Rohr]

I prefer the mark 2 and 3 pads on all models because it looks sturdier. The trim on mark 4 looks like banding.

[Hyaenidae]

I rarely have the occasional piece here or there, like my First Sergeants' Combi-Plas:

But for the most part, no. Almost all the weapons I'm using hail from the 30k era, or at least look like it (Like the old 2nd edition cinder-block bolters)

[MagicMan]

So the 40k versions aren't used then? :(

 

 

Its a shame cause i really like alot of the 40k weapons, looks-wise. Must conquer Ultramarine like adherence to modelling correctly, lol.

[Quixus]

So the 40k versions aren't used then?

Forgeworld makes a lot of nice HH models. They obviously must look different from GW's 40K models because there would be no point if they looked the same.

You would have to hunt down each version of gear for availability during the Heresy to know what is allowed. With the whole idea that technology is at best stagnant after the heresy, chances are good that most of the 40K stuff was already around during the Heresy.

I see no problem with using most of the newer stuff. New Lascannons and missile launchers are fine IMHO, but the box magazines on the heavy bolters somehow look too modern to me. BTW wasn't there a miniature that looked more like the HB marine in Dawn of War?

Since Björn was interred in a MkV dreadnought in M31, this type must have been around at least that long, so most likely it and previous marks (most notably the MkIV of the venerable kit) should fit in a heresy army. BTW do the HH books have rules for non-contemptor dreadnoughts?

IIRC the MkVII and VIII power armours were later developments.

[BFeeder]

I consider myself something of a "purist" when it comes to modelling 30k, but personally I dislike the look of most of the FW heavy/special weapons. However, I don't consider it outside of the scope of the setting for you to use "40k weapons" in 30k. The Great Crusade is a vast affair and there are plenty of Forgeworlds that may have produced said "40k weapons" in 30k, but they may not have reached a great level of popularity at the time.

Furthermore (and to use the above as an example), I myself use Lucius pattern plasma guns and meltas to arm my tactical veterans. I reason that both of these Forgeworlds existed during 30k and given the technological stagnation of the Imperium, it stands to reason that whilst they may have undergone minor revisions in the ten thousand years since, they would (functionally and aesthetically) have been the same in M41 as in M31. The same logic could be applied to any weapon in the Imperium's arsenal.

It's also your own damned hobby and you can do as you please

[MagicMan]

It's also your own damned hobby and you can do as you please

Haha, very true!

Thanks for all the responses guys. If the weapons were around during the Heresy, then its really up to my personal taste. Which is great news.

I know its a bit sad, but i wouldn't want to give a HH marine something that wouldn't be around for them to use.

On that note, which armour marks are out? Just MK 8? The cool thing about 40k Marines is that you can really mix up the armour marks without worries.

[Hyaenidae]

I'd limit mk VII, to be honest. Even the defenders on Terra (BA, IF, WS) would have only gotten a production run or two before the big fight.

Mk VI would be great, though. Even looks good in IV Legion colors. :P

[Adeptus-Alaska]

I like modern lascannons too, feels heavier and more destructive. 

I was going use the Volkite culverin with the muzzles removed and Las cannon barrels attached! I actually quite like the "currently Modern" bolter design. I remember when they cam out with the release of the 3rd edition. I was like "finally" bolters that look like actual, functional weapons. (anyone else remember the old RT era bolters with the Magazine almost at the barrel tip?)

[MagicMan]

I'd limit mk VII, to be honest. Even the defenders on Terra (BA, IF, WS) would have only gotten a production run or two before the big fight.

Mk VI would be great, though. Even looks good in IV Legion colors.

Haha, looking awesome. I am reading Angel Exterminatus at the moment. :P

I really like that theres more of an effort with the new SM kits to have older armour MKs in plastic.

So Mk VII is really rare, anything else goes. Thats cool. Thanks.

[Hyaenidae]

As mentioned by Knight of the Raven and Quixus above, Mars Pattern Rhinos existed (though were considered inferior), so it could be assumed that Mars Pattern Predators existed as well; also, the old 'block' dreadnought hulls were used extensivley, so there's no harm there either (they even show a Word Bearer on in the 2nd book). Though I love the FW models for the most part, there are a few GW designs I enjoy a lot. I'll be making a squadron of flamestorm Preds using three BA Baal predators, simply because I like the look over FW's version, as well as the idea that the design wasn't well loved, but was easier to build, so would fit the idea of armour carrying volitle chemicals around the battlefield. They explode? No harm, no foul (to the Iron Warriors, at least, who saw the Pred and Rhino designs as disposable anyway).

 

Your hobby, your wallet, man. I'll blame no one who's trying to reduce impact on their bank account. Thus why I buy Ebay lots of old models and strip them for my use, or sell what I don't. Second / third hand models, and the finances I gain from selling them again, is how I've been able to build my Iron Warriors so far.

[Knight of the Raven]

Remember that the Imperium, even when it's not at its largest, is huge. You might perhaps get only one type of glaive kicking about, but there will be several different types of everything mundane, from bolters to chainswords to toilet paper. Masters of forge worlds keep their secrets with the jealousy of a possessive lover, whether they belong to the Mechanicum or to a willingly complying planet. Maybe the latter developped bolters of their own and bestowed them on Legio X, "Gigglotrons" XIX Company after they rescued them from Lolz, dread Roflady of the dork eldar. Perhaps the guns used by Armpit III's paintball masters can be turned into bolters just by looking at them funny. You don't need a 500 worlds empire to make up your own gear. You don't even need a homeworld, as Sarum and the World Eaters proved.

[Marshal Rohr]

If you're a converter vehicles are the easiest things to explain. That's an X pattern Y from Z and your legion/army kept an extensive number of them around for their superior A, B, and C. I like my tanks up armored, and that's hard to do with the Deimos Predator, so I'll be converting mine. The Sicaran is just too cool to substitute though, so I'll use stock models for that. I prefer the look of Phobos bolter because they look like rifles, and I prefer Mark 3 armor because it look like what powered armor should look like. Aesthetics are personal preference.

[reckoning]

30k weapons may be superior but they look like

40k weapons look the part.

Your money means your hobby.

[Grotsmasha]

iirc, The old Collected Visions has pics with the Goodwyn pattern bolter, I'll try find some.

 

Here we go,

 

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20111109150057/warhammer40k/images/d/d9/Blood_Angels_Pre-Horesy.jpg

 

Cheers,

Jono

[Aqui]

(anyone else remember the old RT era bolters with the Magazine almost at the barrel tip?)

I've got quite a few spares from all of the RTB01's I've got. When I get around to 30k, I'll see if I can integrate them into the army (assuming I can get the arms cut away from them without damaging them )

[TemujinZero]

There are basically three camps. You have your resin purists who limit themselves to the FW kits. Then there's the fluff purists who limit themselves to the equipment that actually existed in 30K. Finally you have the non-purists who use whatever they want.

 

I'm building my alpha legion as an all FW project, and my Imperial Fists as a fluff compliant project that will give a home to some of my plastic kits.

 

There are numerous reasons, chiefly aesthetic and thematic, to go all FW, but the number of hard fluff restrictions is much smaller than many seem to think. A month ago, using Mk VI armour for the Alpha Legion would have been looked down upon by many, but FW used a bit of imagination and declared that they manufactured a variant using stolen prototypes.

 

We should put together a list of all the various gear and whether they are good to go for 30K.

[Quixus]

A month ago, using Mk VI armour for the Alpha Legion would have been looked down upon by many, but FW used a bit of imagination and declared that they manufactured a variant using stolen prototypes.

Why would the Alpha Legion have less MkVI than other legions?

[TemujinZero]

The first batch was salvaged from Mars by the Imperial Fists and gifted to the Raven Guard, so it was thought to be only in use by the Raven Guard and later the loyalists on Terra. We now know that all legions potentially have access to prototypes, and the Alpha Legion can manufacture their own.