Max_Dammit Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I'm selling my bike as i dont have time to ride with the kids and my buggy is my main wheeled hobby. If its sold i want to use a small amount of the money to stem the pain of selling it by getting a FW flyer I dont get a lot of games in but i love both of these models, but i like the look of the Fire raptor a bit more Will i mis out in game by getting the fire raptor over the storm eagle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrotherCaptainArkhan Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Nope. Storm Eagle is a little overshadowed by other flyers in most departments unfortunately. It has great transport capacity, but you'll rarely want to use it to transport 20 marines on the offchance that it doesn't turn up when you need it most. The Fire Raptor can provide better support in terms of firepower; it can even fulfil a reasonable anti-flyer role, something the Storm Eagle can only do partially if you give it the expensive lascannon upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leif Bearclaw Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Probably. The Eagle can pack a truly nasty amount of firepower. A 2 shot whirlwind launcher, a pair of twin lascannons and your choice of twin heavy bolters/multi melta or a cyclone launcher. The Raptor struggles because it can't focus its fire, the side turrents can't shoot the same target as the boltcannon and missiles. The Raptor is primarily armed for infantry hunting, a field Wolves don't really need flyers to handle. We need a flyer for AA/AT work, and imo the Raptor is easily inferior to the Eagle for this. The model is boss however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjorn_Stormwolf Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I lean torwards more firepower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrotherCaptainArkhan Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Ha, talk about conflicting viewpoints. If you're keen on allies, ally in vanilla Marines and take the Roc Pattern Storm Eagle - it is indisputably a better tank/flier killer than either its regular brother or the Fire Raptor. I still personally lean towards the Fire Raptor over the Storm Eagle. I don't know where Leif gets the turret autocannons not being able to shoot the same target as the avenger bolter - they don't count towards the total no. of weapons fired and can be shot at independent targets, as long as they can trace LOS to the Avenger bolter's target I can't see why they couldn't shoot it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 The problem with the Storm Eagle is that you cannot shoot other fliers at full BS and shoot the big missile launcher in the same turn. If you're in skyfire mode, attacks against ground targets are snap shots. Blast weapons cannot target fliers, nor can they be snap shot. Sure, you can give it lascannons for anti-air, but while fulfilling that role, you're paying a very high points cost to essentially take a couple of whirlwinds for a scenic tour. The Storm Eagle has some hefty firepower but it is more useful focusing on ground targets. I second the motion for a Roc pattern storm eagle. I was disappointed when IA22E extended the Roc to all vanilla marines (it was minotaurs only in IA12) but didn't share it with Space Wolves. It's a fantastic anti-air flyer. Also, I don't think the Fire Raptor is too bad, anti-air. Personally, I think they would work even better in pairs, though. It gives you a better chance of obtaining air superiority so that you can happily go to town with those avenger cannons for longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohail187 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Personally I would prefer the roc pattern storm eagle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune_Priest_Rhapsody Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I would give a motorcycle for either, hell, BOTH!! Throw in a Caestus and I'm good!! Either choice is going to be awesome Max, and like you said since you're not playing much these days go for the one that stokes the fire inside. End of Line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leif Bearclaw Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Ha, talk about conflicting viewpoints. If you're keen on allies, ally in vanilla Marines and take the Roc Pattern Storm Eagle - it is indisputably a better tank/flier killer than either its regular brother or the Fire Raptor. I still personally lean towards the Fire Raptor over the Storm Eagle. I don't know where Leif gets the turret autocannons not being able to shoot the same target as the avenger bolter - they don't count towards the total no. of weapons fired and can be shot at independent targets, as long as they can trace LOS to the Avenger bolter's target I can't see why they couldn't shoot it. Yeah, but getting LOS with the ball turrets and the bolt cannon. They can't traverse to face forwards and so can't fire forwards (as far as I'm aware they're on a 45 degree arc if fire out the side of the model) to engage the same target as the bolt cannon. Now it's not impossible to engage the same target, but then you're reliant on big enemy squads in the correct posistion, and hence firing all guns at thesame target can't be relied on. So to get the best out of the Raptor you really need enemy to the right, left and forward, and the bolt cannon itself isn't deadly enough on its own imo. Essentially the Eagle offers a decent amount of firepower that can worry pretty much anything you point it at, while the Raptor can nibble at three different units if you're lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leif Bearclaw Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I second the motion for a Roc pattern storm eagle. I was disappointed when IA22E extended the Roc to all vanilla marines (it was minotaurs only in IA12) but didn't share it with Space Wolves. It's a fantastic anti-air flyer. I'm afraid not, it's still 'Space Marine armies representing the Minotaurs Chapter' in IA22E, no change from IA12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I think the fire raptor will prove to be the better anti-flyer option, and is a cool little gunship. 7th edition may take the rules for flyers and tip them on their head for all we know... if you like the Raptor, get it. Id probably get the storm eagle. Why? Because Ive wanted one for longer, sure its only because its been out longer but Im silly like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karack Blackstone Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Storm Eagle: Strong Anti-Armor from the Air, has a healthy anti troop option with the missiles it can toss. The TLMM is one of the few, if any, ways to get a TLMM in any SW unit that I know of. The TLLC can go from Anti Armor to Anti Air and reliably pick off things, within reason. Just watch those to pen rolls; those can get a bit iffy if the dice don't like you. Fire Raptor: I'm not that familiar with this one, however, I would expect one's life to be difficult to get the three primary damage dealer weapons all lined up on the right target. Stormwing Formation: As far as this one goes, I have not tried it; however, that said, in terms of theory craft there's one more TLLC than on the Storm Eagle for nearly twice the points, providing three targets rather than one. This selection is about tradeoffs: there's three reliable TLLC spread across three flyers, however, two will prove rather easy to take down. The nice part is that the Formation can fire on one target, or up to three in the same turn, even being fully independent in terms of where they take aim. I personally would recommend the Storm Eagle as it hits high AV harder with its expensive TLLC option; that said, there's the issue of how to deal with a dedicated anti flyer role the SW's lack. The best fit I can think of is one or two Stormwing Formations, if one can afford the points and models' costs to get. Still, go with what you need: - Storm Eagle: anti tank, anti flyer, anti troop - Fire Raptor: anti troop, anti flyer, anti tank - Stormwing: anti flyer, anti tank, anti troop. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reichfaust Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 - Storm Eagle: anti tank, anti flyer, anti troop - Fire Raptor: anti troop, anti flyer, anti tank - Stormwing: anti flyer, anti tank, anti troop. Hope this helps. - Caestus Assault Ram: anti-frigging-everything As far as I'm concerned you can't go wrong with an AV13 flying battering ram armed with a 5" blast melta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Unless you want it to shoot other flyers, because it simply cant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted April 24, 2014 Author Share Posted April 24, 2014 Its a lot of interesting info, but the look of the raptor is just so good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanPesci Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Unless you want it to shoot other flyers, because it simply cant. Does it not have missle pods upgrade? obviosuly not the best thing ever but its something. Also, can you ram other flyers? :D im guessing not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 No, you cant ram flyers, sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Its all space marines, as well as minotaur siege assault vanguard. At least, that's how I parse the text. The grammar is fairly ambiguous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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