b1soul Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Aaron's answer to a question on another forum: It does indeed [in response to whether MoM features a BA main character]. A Blood Angel called Zephon, fighting alongside a Space Wolf pack called Howl of the Hearthworld. We all know where we've seen Heresy-era BA and SW interaction before (Fear to Tread: that spot of fun between Amit and Red Knife). I thought Swallow wasted a fine opportunity to explore the dynamic between the VIth and the IXth. Red Knife and his pack don't really contribute much to the story and they never receive any character development. That said, I have much, much more faith in Aaron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 The Space Wolves and Blood Angels are distrusted allies though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 10, 2014 Author Share Posted July 10, 2014 The Space Wolves and Blood Angels are distrusted allies though... I'm not sure whether MoM is pre-Signus or post-Signus That said...BA and SW might be friendly in 30K. Another possibility might be that Zephon and the pack fight alongside each other out of necessity. They're not trusted allies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Tee hee I had something niggling in my mind that ADB always wanted to write blood angels but didn't out of respect for another author who had claimed it (don't quote me on it lol). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xin Ceithan Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 So, ADB put BOTH his fanboy Legions into one Book :) And gets to write about Abbadon! I'd like to fanboy high-five him for his luck and counsel him on stress / pressure issues simultanously ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarKnight Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Looking forward to seeing how AD-B goes into depth on the Blood Angels. I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels (Dark Angels = Knights/Astartes, Night Lords = Serial Killers/Murderers/Astartes etc. to simplify) I never noticed on the chart that the Blood Angels and Wolves were distrusted allies, I would've assumed Sanguinius and Russ got along, maybe it's the wings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFH Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Fear to Tread established some...philosophical differences on the part of the VI and IX over the Librarius. The fact that the Wolves were major proponents of the Edict and ignored it applying to Rune Priests, whereas the Angels were proponents of the Librarius and followed the Edict was a source of contention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 10, 2014 Author Share Posted July 10, 2014 I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels Well, he has written about the Flesh Tearers (the short story "At Gaius Point"). I can't think of a better BA/BA successor work. Sort of like how "Savage Weapons" is probably the best depiction of the DA I have ever read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A D-B Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Looking forward to seeing how AD-B goes into depth on the Blood Angels. I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels (Dark Angels = Knights/Astartes, Night Lords = Serial Killers/Murderers/Astartes etc. to simplify) I never noticed on the chart that the Blood Angels and Wolves were distrusted allies, I would've assumed Sanguinius and Russ got along, maybe it's the wings? I think the Blood Angels have one of the strongest dichotomies of any Legion or Chapter. Much of what makes the Blood Angels of 40K stand out is a little less pronounced before Sanguinius's death. It's still undoubtedly there, though. I tend to see it a little like this: They're artists, painters, poets, architects, musicians, and philosophers - the very cream of humanity's creative and enlightened aspirations, risen from barbarian tribes that scavenge amidst the red dust of a poisoned homeworld. They don't create art in the pursuit of perfection, or to glorify themselves by displaying their own talents. They do it to understand what it means to be human, acknowledging as they do how far away they are from humanity. And, of course, they do it to understand, conquer - and, to some degree, hide - the dark halves of their souls. Some of the galaxy's most breathtaking sculptures and paintings lie in the deepest, darkest chambers of Blood Angel warships, or displayed in the chapels of their fortresses, never to be seen by human eyes. The Blood Angels are the Renaissance in power armour, with all of that majesty, splendour, and ingenuity turned anaemic by vampirism... with a mandate to conquer the galaxy on wings of iron and fire. They're paladins with sacred weapons and beauteous facemasks, crying out in inhuman choirs for the taste of their enemies' blood. That's how I tend to see them, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betrayer41 Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 wow.........can you just finish the HH series by yourself please? i absolutely love your take on everything i've read so far. You may inspire me to play BA like you did WE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarKnight Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Looking forward to seeing how AD-B goes into depth on the Blood Angels. I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels (Dark Angels = Knights/Astartes, Night Lords = Serial Killers/Murderers/Astartes etc. to simplify) I never noticed on the chart that the Blood Angels and Wolves were distrusted allies, I would've assumed Sanguinius and Russ got along, maybe it's the wings? I think the Blood Angels have one of the strongest dichotomies of any Legion or Chapter. Much of what makes the Blood Angels of 40K stand out is a little less pronounced before Sanguinius's death. It's still undoubtedly there, though. I tend to see it a little like this: They're artists, painters, poets, architects, musicians, and philosophers - the very cream of humanity's creative and enlightened aspirations, risen from barbarian tribes that scavenge amidst the red dust of a poisoned homeworld. They don't create art in the pursuit of perfection, or to glorify themselves by displaying their own talents. They do it to understand what it means to be human, acknowledging as they do how far away they are from humanity. And, of course, they do it to understand, conquer - and, to some degree, hide - the dark halves of their souls. Some of the galaxy's most breathtaking sculptures and paintings lie in the deepest, darkest chambers of Blood Angel warships, or displayed in the chapels of their fortresses, never to be seen by human eyes. The Blood Angels are the Renaissance in power armour, with all of that majesty, splendour, and ingenuity turned anaemic by vampirism... with a mandate to conquer the galaxy on wings of iron and fire. They're paladins with sacred weapons and beauteous facemasks, crying out in inhuman choirs for the taste of their enemies' blood. That's how I tend to see them, anyway. Many,many,many thanks on the elaboration my dude. I saw them much the same but mentally that started to bleed into Emperor's Children territory with the caveat of the pride and ego of the EC and their whole pursuit of perfection kick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Hands Fanatic Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Looking forward to seeing how AD-B goes into depth on the Blood Angels. I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels (Dark Angels = Knights/Astartes, Night Lords = Serial Killers/Murderers/Astartes etc. to simplify) I never noticed on the chart that the Blood Angels and Wolves were distrusted allies, I would've assumed Sanguinius and Russ got along, maybe it's the wings? I think the Blood Angels have one of the strongest dichotomies of any Legion or Chapter. Much of what makes the Blood Angels of 40K stand out is a little less pronounced before Sanguinius's death. It's still undoubtedly there, though. I tend to see it a little like this: They're artists, painters, poets, architects, musicians, and philosophers - the very cream of humanity's creative and enlightened aspirations, risen from barbarian tribes that scavenge amidst the red dust of a poisoned homeworld. They don't create art in the pursuit of perfection, or to glorify themselves by displaying their own talents. They do it to understand what it means to be human, acknowledging as they do how far away they are from humanity. And, of course, they do it to understand, conquer - and, to some degree, hide - the dark halves of their souls. Some of the galaxy's most breathtaking sculptures and paintings lie in the deepest, darkest chambers of Blood Angel warships, or displayed in the chapels of their fortresses, never to be seen by human eyes. The Blood Angels are the Renaissance in power armour, with all of that majesty, splendour, and ingenuity turned anaemic by vampirism... with a mandate to conquer the galaxy on wings of iron and fire. They're paladins with sacred weapons and beauteous facemasks, crying out in inhuman choirs for the taste of their enemies' blood. That's how I tend to see them, anyway. I'll hazard a guess that the IXth aren't the anonymous Legion which you're not so keen on then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarKnight Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Fear to Tread established some...philosophical differences on the part of the VI and IX over the Librarius. The fact that the Wolves were major proponents of the Edict and ignored it applying to Rune Priests, whereas the Angels were proponents of the Librarius and followed the Edict was a source of contention. I did my best to black that novel out, but yeah I guess I can see the difference in opinion between the Legions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Going off that I can see what Sanguinius would get along with with the Khan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarKnight Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels Well, he has written about the Flesh Tearers (the short story "At Gaius Point"). I can't think of a better BA/BA successor work. Sort of like how "Savage Weapons" is probably the best depiction of the DA I have ever read That is true, and I agree as far as it being amongst the best Blood Angels/ BA successor work there is, however IMO the Flesh Tearers, though having the same geneseed, are far deviated from the mindset of the Blood Angels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Angel Scout Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Distrusted Allies?... Personally, never saw it as being a big issue from Fear to Tread, in fact on the contrary, considering the Wolves "priest" pretty much encourages the BA's former Librarians to prepare for Signus or that a primarch's bodyguard is concerned about potential security issues in context of how the Wolves appear. When is MoM released? Isn't it set in the webway on Terra, which to me could mean runs concurrently with Signus? As a side, ADB could write about his Angel Numinous, successors version of the Legion, ADB's own BA series...can but hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 11, 2014 Author Share Posted July 11, 2014 The Blood Angels are the Renaissance in power armour, with all of that majesty, splendour, and ingenuity turned anaemic by vampirism... with a mandate to conquer the galaxy on wings of iron and fire. They're paladins with sacred weapons and beauteous facemasks, crying out in inhuman choirs for the taste of their enemies' blood. A very nice way of encapsulating the essence of the BA. I especially like the way you explain the BA's love for art representing humanity's beauty and noblest aspirations. Their existence is a struggle to overcome that dormant beast rumbling within them all I have a question or two: 1. Do you think the major difference between 30K BA and 40K BA boils down to the Black Rage. Apparently, the BA struggle with the Red Thirst even during the Great Crusade (thus the Red Thirst is not limited to 40K BA). I'm guessing the Red Thirst isn't as rampant among the 30K BA as it is among the 40K BA? On top of that, 30K BA have no Black Rage as that affliction only arises after Sang's death? 2. Do you place much stock in the idea of a 30K rivalry between the IXth and the XIIth? It seems like there's some sort of competition between the BA and the WE over which legion is the "hardest" (shall we say) in close combat. Does that really fit the 30K Blood Angels legion? That is true, and I agree as far as it being amongst the best Blood Angels/ BA successor work there is, however IMO the Flesh Tearers, though having the same geneseed, are far deviated from the mindset of the Blood Angels. The Flesh Tearer mentality is represented in 30K...by Amit and his buddies. Those BA who struggle most with the Red Thirst (and some who might even embrace it) As for the rest of the 30K BA, yeah...they should be quite different from Amit and his crew, sort of like how not every IF is like Sigismund and his Templars. For instance, Pollux and his men have a very different mentality and fighting style Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Looking forward to seeing how AD-B goes into depth on the Blood Angels. I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels (Dark Angels = Knights/Astartes, Night Lords = Serial Killers/Murderers/Astartes etc. to simplify) I never noticed on the chart that the Blood Angels and Wolves were distrusted allies, I would've assumed Sanguinius and Russ got along, maybe it's the wings? I think the Blood Angels have one of the strongest dichotomies of any Legion or Chapter. Much of what makes the Blood Angels of 40K stand out is a little less pronounced before Sanguinius's death. It's still undoubtedly there, though. I tend to see it a little like this: They're artists, painters, poets, architects, musicians, and philosophers - the very cream of humanity's creative and enlightened aspirations, risen from barbarian tribes that scavenge amidst the red dust of a poisoned homeworld. They don't create art in the pursuit of perfection, or to glorify themselves by displaying their own talents. They do it to understand what it means to be human, acknowledging as they do how far away they are from humanity. And, of course, they do it to understand, conquer - and, to some degree, hide - the dark halves of their souls. Some of the galaxy's most breathtaking sculptures and paintings lie in the deepest, darkest chambers of Blood Angel warships, or displayed in the chapels of their fortresses, never to be seen by human eyes. The Blood Angels are the Renaissance in power armour, with all of that majesty, splendour, and ingenuity turned anaemic by vampirism... with a mandate to conquer the galaxy on wings of iron and fire. They're paladins with sacred weapons and beauteous facemasks, crying out in inhuman choirs for the taste of their enemies' blood. That's how I tend to see them, anyway. With your words and Morgan Freeman's voice, I shall conquer the galaxy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betrayer41 Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Looking forward to seeing how AD-B goes into depth on the Blood Angels. I wonder what dichotomy he envisions for the Blood Angels (Dark Angels = Knights/Astartes, Night Lords = Serial Killers/Murderers/Astartes etc. to simplify) I never noticed on the chart that the Blood Angels and Wolves were distrusted allies, I would've assumed Sanguinius and Russ got along, maybe it's the wings? I think the Blood Angels have one of the strongest dichotomies of any Legion or Chapter. Much of what makes the Blood Angels of 40K stand out is a little less pronounced before Sanguinius's death. It's still undoubtedly there, though. I tend to see it a little like this: They're artists, painters, poets, architects, musicians, and philosophers - the very cream of humanity's creative and enlightened aspirations, risen from barbarian tribes that scavenge amidst the red dust of a poisoned homeworld. They don't create art in the pursuit of perfection, or to glorify themselves by displaying their own talents. They do it to understand what it means to be human, acknowledging as they do how far away they are from humanity. And, of course, they do it to understand, conquer - and, to some degree, hide - the dark halves of their souls. Some of the galaxy's most breathtaking sculptures and paintings lie in the deepest, darkest chambers of Blood Angel warships, or displayed in the chapels of their fortresses, never to be seen by human eyes. The Blood Angels are the Renaissance in power armour, with all of that majesty, splendour, and ingenuity turned anaemic by vampirism... with a mandate to conquer the galaxy on wings of iron and fire. They're paladins with sacred weapons and beauteous facemasks, crying out in inhuman choirs for the taste of their enemies' blood. That's how I tend to see them, anyway. With your words and Morgan Freeman's voice, I shall conquer the galaxy. ^^^^ Like like like like like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zynk Kaladin Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 I know this thread is about MoM, but I can't resist posting an earlier post of mine here after reading Our Lord and Savior's AD-B's words regarding the dichotomy of BA psyche. One big theme that attracts me to the Blood Angels is their generally positive attitude. Now this doesn't mean they go handing out flowers to loyal Imperial citizens with a big smile on their face saying how wonderful everything is going. Far from it. Rather, the Blood Angels FORCE themselves into a state of nobility and dignity, despite almost everything that has gone wrong with their chapter, Imperium, and even within themselves. Although their glorious beginnings as sons of the LITERAL angel of mankind mark them as saints in the glittering eyes of men, deep down inside lurks a force of evil that could very well have had their chapter vilified and erased from history. I mean, heck in the current state of affairs in 40k the chapters of Sanguinius, the rich history that follows them, and their legacy are dying. And we even KNOW for a fact that Sanguinius is not returning so we have nothing to look forward to except the end. The Blood Angels have their inner daemon completely at war with everything the chapter holds dear: nobility, optimism, and hope for mankind, and he's not a weak one. Not only is this flaw a thirst for blood, but of violence, destruction and dare I say... chaos. It is a fact of astartes nature that everything they do is grounded in violence and warfare. Every second of every minute of every day is a struggle for an angel to maintain not only his sanity, but his basic combat discipline and organization knowing fully well that one day you will either die in nobility, or fall into your own inner hell. I mean jeez, their chapter tactic specialty thrusts them into the blood-hurricane of violent close combat. Not only do they murder that which is literally in front of them, they do it WELL. Everything is stacked against them as far as their flaw is concerned and I dare say, it's a fear that their own weakness of heart and mind puts loyal, Emperor-loving lives at risk. And oooh man when they fall they fall HARD. It's almost painfully ironic that Blood Angels live longer lives only to suffer that much longer. Despite these damning flaws and state of affairs that mock what it means to be a loyalist Astartes, the Blood Angels still carry on as the true and literal angels of mankind. They fly on ivory wings, combating the blackness which seeks to consume them. They adorn themselves in shining gold and rich crimson, mocking the sour state of affairs their chapter suffered through in history. They blast themselves into self-damning close combat, defeating the most powerful and dangerous enemies mankind has ever known with blade and fury. They chain the daemons inside them: the Red Thirst, the Black Rage into a force of close combat beat-train known as the Death Company and unleash it upon those who would piss on the Throne of our Imperium. It is my belief that the descendants of Sanguinius, like their father, will sacrifice everything (their legacy, their lives, their future) just for a chink in the armor of the enemies of man. And we all know it is through that chink that the Emperor slew Horus. THIS is what the Blood Angels are. Anyway, I'm really looking forward to this book. No pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronotonic Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 He should probably write codex fluff to make us all happy haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustus Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Since you're lurking here ;) AD-B, do you think the Emperor's Children have a lot of overlapping themes with the Blood Angels? In many ways I always thought the EC as Renaissance-esque marines whose quest for improvement gave way to hubris (colonialism) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Strikes me that the EC and the BA, and the Phoenician and the Angel, had very different reasons for their behaviour. The EC sought perfection as an end in itself out of a fear that being flawed had nearly destroyed them in the past (let's make sure we are never flawed again). The BA didn't seem perfection, which they knew they could never attain, but nobility. Saying to a BA "you strive to be perfect" would earn a bitter laugh. They know they aren't perfect and never can be - there's a monster in their veins and mutant wings on their Lord's back. Instead of trying to eradicate their flaws - a fool's errand - they seek to ensure that *despite* their flaws they act and show nobility in all things. Slightly different fears that produce some superficially similar behaviour. The EC wanted to remake themselves, the BA wanted to conceal themselves and do good despite themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustus Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Interesting analysis. I just remember. Fulgrims history on Chemos was likened to a Renaissance. In a way the Great Crusade was a macro Renaissance. I like the destinations you offered. Only that the flaw was discovered close to the end if the GC. So I dunno how much it affected the development if the Legion as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adra'Melek Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 On Chemos there were hardly any resources so Fulgrim vastly improved the efficiency of processes so make the most of them. Same happened when his legion arrived (300 marines?). They had to be efficient to be able to fight at all. That striving to make the most out of resources get twisted to drive for perfection...at least that's how I saw it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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