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Tactica Chainaxe; World Eaters and What to Hit With Them

World Eaters Horus Heresy Tactics List Building XII Legion

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#2301
Slips

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So... ten Destroyers.
With jump packs or in a Dreadclaw/ Termite?
With missle launchers or with Plasma Pistols?

With 1 Plasma Pistol per 5 + Sergeants (iirc he can take one?), youre paying a fair chunk for 3 Plasma Shots; might as well stick to the Rad Missiles since thats something only a handful or other units can take. Also would take jetpacks so that they have generally more mobility to make use of their 12" shooting; also lets you reroll charges if necessary.


Edited by Slips, 13 February 2019 - 05:29 PM.

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#2302
Gorgoff

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So... ten Destroyers.
With jump packs or in a Dreadclaw/ Termite?
With missle launchers or with Plasma Pistols?

With 1 Plasma Pistol per 5 + Sergeants (iirc he can take one?), youre paying a fair chunk for 3 Plasma Shots; might as well stick to the Rad Missiles since thats something only a handful or other units can take. Also would take jetpacks so that they have generally more mobility to make use of their 12" shooting; also lets you reroll charges if necessary.

I thought about it the last days and I dare to say that's a bad idea. Ten dudes without FnP but with very high potential to be devastating have to be taken out and killing them is comparable easy.

My advise is to play them like Seekers or Terminators with Combi-weapons. Let them deep strike via Dreadclaw/ Termite.*. That way you can place them where you want in safety (relatively speaking of course). Two missle launchers and one Phosphex Bomb should be included so that they have a good damage output.


*I know that Terminators do not fit in the Termite, but Seeker an Destroyers do. 
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#2303
Gorgoff

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Is it possible to field Endryd Haar as your Warlord in an Shattered Legion?
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#2304
Varyn

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I'm looking at doing a deep striking type WE force and would appreciate some tactics/feedback/suggestions from you chain axe wielding chaps!

 

Crimson Path - 2500 Points

 

Khârn, legacy of blood

Warmonger, power fist, artificer armour

 

3 Apothecaries, 2 with jump packs

Contemptor dreadnought, power fist, chain fist, 2x grav guns, drop pod

8 Destroyers, jump packs, melta bombs, power fist, artificer armour

 

15 Assault marines, melta bombs, 3 power axes, power fist

18 Tactical marines, power fist, melta bombs, artificer armour

5 Red butchers, 4x dual power axe, power fist, chainfist

10 Veterans (weapon masters), melta bombs, power fist, artificer armour

 

Anvillus dreadclaw

 

Kharybdis assault claw

 

Obviously the assault squad, tactical squad and veterans have chain axes in place of chainswords smile.png

 

Khârn goes with the tactical squad and an apothecary in the kharybdis, the weapon master vets go in the dreadclaw, the 2 jump pack apothecaries join the destroyers and assault marines and the warmonger deep strikes with the red butchers. I'll get 2 of the pods on turn 1 and hopefully the warmonger with butchers and 3rd drop pod on turn 2.

 

It'd be nice to fit a damocles to help the other reserves arrive on turn 2, but not sure what to drop.

 

What are your experiences of the units I've included? are some too small/big?

 

thanks!


Edited by Varyn, 10 May 2019 - 09:40 PM.


#2305
Gorgoff

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I would never deep strike a dedicated close combat unit. They have no firepower whatsoever which means that they are doing nothing until turn three in a best case scenario. In addidtion they can't run so they gonna get it by big templates after deep striking.
I guess you get butchered with that list.
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#2306
Varyn

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Had a bit of a rethink and shuffled the list a bit:

 

 

Crimson Path - 2500 Points

 

Khârn, legacy of blood

 

3 Apothecaries, 1 with jump pack

5 Red butchers, 4x dual power axe, power fist, chainfist

9 Veterans (weapon masters), 2 power axes, melta bombs, power fist, artificer armour

 

15 Assault marines, melta bombs, 3 power axes, power fist

18 Tactical marines, power fist, melta bombs, artificer armour

 

Anvillus dreadclaw

Anvillus dreadclaw

3 attack bikes, multimeltas, melta bombs

 

 

Kharybdis assault claw

Deredeo, autocannons, aiolos missiles

Sicaran venator, combi bolter

 

 

I agree about deep striking the red butchers with the warmonger, it wasn't a good plan. The red butchers will now be in an anvillus, as will the weapon master veterans with an apothecary. Attack bikes will give some flexibility and movement for objectives and some anti armour from the deredeo and venator. Hopefully this looks a little better!



#2307
Gorgoff

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Oh yeah. I like that list.
Attack Bikes should be great. They have 5 Attacks S5 each on the charge after all. :)
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#2308
Fangbanger

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My only concern would be just having 3 units on the board turn 1 if you don't go first. You have to be able to hide them well or they will just get smashed.

 

Kharybdis and anvilus are super fun though.

 

FYI the bikes won't score, so bear that in mind if your plan was objectives (Though as pointed out, tonnes of attacks so legit)


Edited by Fangbanger, 24 May 2019 - 03:33 AM.

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I done a world eaters plog.........http://www.bolterand...ld-eaters-plog/

#2309
WolfLogic

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I had a friend send me a World Eaters list but he wasn’t sure if it was viable. I’m not sure myself either so I thought I’d ask here. Idea is to have Khârn run with Red Butchers and the Apothecaries to run with each Tactical Squad in a Spartan

 

3000pt

RoW- Berserker Assault

 

HQ (190pt):

Khârn the Bloody

-Legacy of Blood

 

Elites (995pt):

Apothecarion Detachment

-3x Apothecaries w/ Artificer Armor + Chainaxe

 

Red Butchers

-8 Butchers w/ second power axe

-Devoured w/ second power axe

 

Spartan Assault Tank DT

-Armored Ceramite

-Flare Shield

-Hunter Killer

 

Troops (705pt):

3x 19 man tactical squads

-chainaxe + bolt pistol

-sergeant w/ artificer armor + power axe

 

Heavy Support (1110pt):

3x Spartan Assault Tank

-Armored Ceramite

-Flare Shield



#2310
Unknown Legionnaire

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Yeah, it's legal ... if slightly repetitive (read: boring).

 

Well, at least it doesn't contain Gahlan Surlak.


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Smile like Dynat when you're winning !


#2311
WolfLogic

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I know it’s legal, but would it be able to win 3000pt games?

#2312
Dreagher

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4 Spartans will most likely live for a while,so you will get into Assault. Seeing as most of your enemies shooting will be useless against them unless the tailor their list against you. It isn't the most fun list to play against, but it should win games. What I would definitely change in that list, would be some powerfists/melta bombs on the seargents and at least a chain fist on the devoured. Otherwise you have very little against vehicles and a single dreadnought could tarpit an entire tac squad.
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#2313
Charlo

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Four Spartans is an easy way to make people not want to play you. Do be careful!
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#2314
Gorgoff

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Yeah, pretty much. And those kind of lists are just plain boring to play against and with.
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#2315
Daemon Prince Marbas

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Which Rite of War is better: The Crimson Path or Berserker Assault?

#2316
Dreagher

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Which Rite of War is better: The Crimson Path or Berserker Assault?


Normaly Berserker Assault. The fnp of Crimson path is nice, but as it only triggers in your opponents deployment zone most of your army will most likely not benefit from it (if your oppent doesn't just walk out of his deployment zone an negates or completely).
If you don't have a specific list in mind, that is tailored to CP, BA is both more flexible and benefits more of your army.
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#2317
Warsmith Klegane

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So with the leaks we've seen (and I know it's not the final / complete picture), did we get a nerf or not?

Angron seems a beast, as he should be.

But the loss of force wide hatred via berserker assault seems a bitter pill to swallow.

Thoughts?

Edited by Warsmith Klegane, 04 April 2022 - 09:27 PM.

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#2318
The Scorpion

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Bonuses to get into melee are superior to bonuses that buff the melee.

It's the World Eaters. Cadere weapons are decent now, and +1 attack with chainaxes will be enough to make short work of most things. More rules than that would be overkill, especially when the Legion rules for 2.0 are more subdued across the board.
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#2319
SkimaskMohawk

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So with the leaks we've seen (and I know it's not the final / complete picture), did we get a nerf or not?

Angron seems a beast, as he should be.

But the loss of force wide hatred via berserker assault seems a bitter pill to swallow.

Thoughts?

Previously, the power of the world eaters was mostly tied up in it's normal units. Angron was a cruise missile, but you could just take blobs of assault marines or despoilers and have them swarm everything with 4 attacks at STR 5, reroll all hits and reroll 1s to wound. The downside was that rampagers were...not very compelling, and butchers had a narrow application (fighting infantry).

Now, you still get chain axes (and a full reroll to wound) and effective rage, but lose out on hatred. The upside is rampagers are really good compared to how they used to be, butchers are harder to kill, and the characters are frankly terrifying. You do not want Khârn with gorechild anywhere near any unit, let alone angron.

So with that context in mind, is rerolling to hit worth the +2 charge bonus? I'd say yes. And then I'd realize that it probably stacks with the bonus to charging you get from higher movement value, so those rampagers with jump packs and assault marines can hit 12" charges on a roll of an 8+. Terrifying.

I'll use that breakdown to say I disagree with scorpions assertion on "most legion rules are subdued in 2nd". When you look at the mechanics as a whole and consider how they overlap and add up, most legions got a marked increase to their power, though their premiere rites may have lost that concentrated boost they previously had.

Edited by SkimaskMohawk, 05 April 2022 - 11:25 PM.

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#2320
Arkhanist

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So thanks to 2.0 I'm looking at finally dusting off my calth and prospero boxed sets and painting up some axe wielding maniacs! I need to test out paint schemes, and expect to go infantry heavy.

 

I'm unsure whether to go with truegrit tactical squads, i.e. give them an additional CCW with the chainaxe, or drop the bolters and just go despoiler style with pistols/axe.

 

The advantage of keeping the bolters is that I can keep the arms and bolters I already have, and just add a chainaxe to the pack (I'll do some wielding the axe) For despoilers, I'm going to need a lot more new CC arms and pistols, but does save points.

 

I'll be using greenstuff to add to their height so they better fit the new mark VI, or maybe just outright replace legs with taller ones. I already have a bunch of chainaxes to use (I planned to do this years ago, and never got round to it), and can easily get more.

 

It'll take me long enough to do the ordinary guys, so I can add on the fun stuff later once rules/roles are clearer, though I think I'll try to add some termis and contemptors cos I love em smile.png

 

So basically - are the bolters likely to be worth it on tac squads with the new rules, or should I wait until I can get a bunch more melee arms and pistols?


Edited by Arkhanist, 09 April 2022 - 04:20 PM.

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#2321
SkimaskMohawk

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Well in the new rules, despoilers are their own separate thing from tacs.

You can get a bonus chainsword on the tacs at hefty 5ppm (bet it's going to be changed) and you get fury.

Or you can get despoilers for the same cost as base tacs, have options for power weapons, the Sgt can take a melta bomb, and have spite instead of fury. Spite lets you reroll wounds on the charge against a unit with no character, or is pinned, or is falling back. But also all chainswords have shred so they already do that.

Id honestly stick to the bolter and slung chainaxe and choose when you want to pay points for the melee weapon. Save the CCW Arma for assault marines, who are now rely cheap and really good. Especially with world eaters.
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#2322
panascope

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World Eaters are looking real good in the new edition, here are some initial thoughts.

 

Tac Squads look a lot better than Despoilers. Fury of the Legion isn't as much of a liability now since you don't lose a turn of shooting in the new rules and getting the extra shot at long range is sorta nice too. Spite of the Legion is pretty lame and requires you to buy a bunch of power weapons to be relevant, which I generally don't think is good to do on cheap units. Sniper looking quite strong in the new edition makes your special weapons dudes pretty vulnerable. Going Tactical and buying the chainaxe upgrade is probably the better move mechanically.

 

If you were like me and loaded up on Inductii, the playstyle has changed almost entirely. Before you could totally skip thinking about objectives since none of your stuff scored but now you're incredibly interested in fighting over objectives, because getting a FNP you can stack with an Apothecary is really potent. Your berserkers are surprisingly durable under the right circumstances.

 

Assuming the Rites of War don't change much, Berserker Assault looks far stronger than Crimson Path. A 6+ FNP isn't that good in the first place and the fact that they went out of their way to make sure it doesn't stack with any other FNP rolls you might be getting makes it really uninteresting. Berserker Assault on the other hand buffs everything you want to do with the only drawback being that you have to declare a charge.

 

Interesting units obviously include Contemptors, which have been buffed tremendously, Red Butchers, which have gained a similar immunity to power fist instant death that the Sons of Horus are gaining in 2.0, and Javelins, which have quietly become an excellent World Eaters unit.

 

The Javelin Attack Speeder boasts impressive weaponry, with a multi-melta and the lascannons making you effective against a lot of different units. It also has access to both Deep Strike and Outflank, which are very handy since alternative deployment shenanigans are becoming much more limited. On the charge they'll get 5 attacks with their chainaxes, and with T6 they're tough to move. As Cavalry you can't use melta bombs or krak grenades against them, and dropping an Evade reaction against enemy fire lets them reroll their Shrouded save which makes them pretty durable. A bad combat can be dropped out of using Hit and Run. I plan on painting a few of these for both my World Eaters and Sons of Horus armies.


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