Hyaenidae Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 "Man, I love X, Y, and Z Legion, but I don't know what to pick" "Help me find the Legion for me!" "What the heck do you mean that the -blank- Legion does that? The old IA article doesn't say that!" We see these threads and comments a lot in the Age of Darkness forum. Many folks are still getting their bearings with the release of the Horus Heresy Tomes from Forgeworld, and the novels from Black Library. Some are brand new to the glories of the Old Legions. Many simply love all the Legions for various reasons. Who's to blame them? The Legions are vast, and as Forgeworld and Black Library expands on their histories, from the Unification Wars to the Great Scouring, we are treated to even more variation and wonderful stories that we could never have imagined. But this doesn't exactly make it easy to pick one to build for an army, huh? So, this thread is dedicated to assisting our Legion Brothers and Sisters in deciding on the Legion (or Legions) to choose. This is NOT a "which Legion is best" thread, but rather is a "how can we, as a unified community, help jump start your imagination" thread. So, if you're in the dark or a touch lost in an idea, post your questions here, and we shall guide you to the light. If you prefer the darkness and are blinded by the light, post your questions, and we shall guide you to the darkness. Just remember, this is a community exercise to be helpful to our future brethren and cousins; please be civil and polite.... ....No matter which side of The War they choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother-Chaplain Kage Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 The thing I see the most in these sorts of threads is something along the lines of "I like X Legion and I want to do Y tactics with it, but the fluff(usually 40k type casting) says they're only good at/never use Z". This is a whole new ball game, brothers. All the Legions had access to the same gear, and all of them used whatever tactics were required to do the job. Were some Legions better at different aspects? Sure, each one had a strength, but they were not yet crippled by the inherent weaknesses that came with the breaking of the Legions and overspecialization of the Chapter organization. Something else to consider is figuring out which paint job you would mind painting the least in large quantities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apologist Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 One consideration is what the prospective commander wants out of the timeline. For some, it's a great opportunity to extend their 40k army. What were their forbears like before or during the Heresy? Perhaps you have a Traitor army, and want to see what they look like in their loyalist regalia. If you have a Loyalist force, it's a great way to explore a slightly altered scheme – just to scratch that variant itch that can otherwise disrupt a uniform look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthamal Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 I'm pleased this is getting a sticky slot in the forum. The glory of 30k is attracting many new brothers towards the 18 Legions and it's only fitting that there be a useful primer for them to get started. I think they've already got the part "Check the bolter is carrying mass reactives" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted August 12, 2014 Author Share Posted August 12, 2014 Glad this has been well received so far. :) Going off of what Apologist said, you can go the other way as well, and conduct war during the infancy of the Legions; The Unification Wars. All of the Legions have received some real in-depth history, leading all the way back to Terra, including Unifcation era paint schemes. Seeing some folks take on the Legion of their choice prior to their Primarch being found would be amazing, and gives the builder a great storyline to play around in, one that hasn't been touched on much; the unification of Terra and the Sol system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 The big thing is to stop second guessing yourself, if you love the nobility io the warhounds but hate what angron did to them don't give up on it just do what first comes to you and if you want some sneaky stabby alphas do a squad no one will stop you utilising them here. Let the imagination run wild if it's RG predation fleets with attached WE allies do it they can be the basis for charcharodons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemon2027 Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 As the latest person to post a 'what Legion...' Thread I thought I would give my experience. I personally have found it daunting to settle on one Legion, not made easy by the increase in quality of Forge Worlds products. However, constant changing of the project is both costly, in time and resources, and annoying. So, I have been trying to figure out which Legion speaks to me, and in the end I figured out three, and, with the input of others, have seen it mesh together I to one idea. The main thing to remember is not to get stuck with stereotypes. This can be hard, we all have perceptions of a Legion, which is fine, all Legions have a certain vibe, it stops them being blank copies of each other, but these vibes don't have to completely define them. Sure the rules can sometimes limit your choice, but in only one case so far does is completely stop the use of a certain unit. If there is a certain Legion you want to do, but your not sure on there usual methods, take a look at the background. There are always exceptions, even of it's only a hint. Use this to form your idea. And don't be afraid to ask in here, I have seen some fantastic ideas, from Iron Warrior trained Raven Guard siege saboteurs, to Moritat themed Word Bearers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ion Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 Something also to think about as well is the Legion's proclivity to work in inter-legionary groups and second officers to other legions for training purposes. It's not uncommon for a few legions to be working together in an Expeditionary fleet, and if you just have to have at least one model from another legion, an officer seconded to your main one is a great way to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apologist Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 Another approach is to pick a particular piece of background and try to theme your selections as closely as possible to it. Perhaps the battle for Tallarn, or the desperate treachery of Isstvan III. A Black Library short or scene from a novel might influence you, and there are myriad threads to draw from. This also gives the opportunity to have two opposing forces – which can be a great way to keep your painting mojo up; particularly when you can field them alongside each other for a Great Crusade-era game... :) The period lends itself well to 'historical' correctness, if you want to pick out rivets and get things just so; but the breadth of possibility in the Legions means that a Crusade or Heresy-era army also provides an opportunity to spread your creative wings and do something that's impossible in 40k. My three pieces of advice: Remember you don't have to build the whole Legion. Build and paint one model to the best of your ability, and see if that scratches your itch. If it does, great – you've got a showcase model of which you can be proud. If not, build and paint another and see where it takes you. Do the bit that you enjoy most the first. If you love Hator Maat, build and paint him first; then look to his forces. Chop and change, if you enjoy it. There's nothing keeping you focussed beyond your own proclivity; and nothing makes painting a drudge than the feeling you'd rather do something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthamal Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 The most important bits of advice I can provide are: 1) Read. Read. Read. Read. Whether it be the FW series, the BL series, an audidrama, graphic novel or digital short, read every scrap of info you can on the Legions that interest you. Devour any and all lore relating to them. Once you've done that, start thinking about themes and concepts that appeal to you, then compare that against what you know about the Legions and pick out what catches your eye or sets fire to your imagination. And finally, look at colours. You're going to have to paint a LOT of models in a chosen colour, so make sure it's one you're comfortable with. If you can't stand black for example, it's unlikely you'll choose Dark Angels, Iron Hands or Raven Guard. 2) Forget everything 40k related to a particular Legion.The chapters/warbands derived from the Legions are the product of ten thousand years or war, suffering and betrayals. "World Eaters are Khorne Bezerkers in 40k and I hate Khorne!" The World Eaters are the third largest Legion and have massive armoured companies. Do they still like it face to face in the dirt? Absolutely. But they have thousands of tanks to call upon if the need ever arises. Bottom line,if you want a fully armoured spearhead force or a bunch of infiltrating kill teams, for more or less all the Legions, it's legal and it's fluffy to do whatever you want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 Something that I think will help : In the event that your one of many who are having a REALLY hard time choosing between any of the 18 Legions and have not even gotten anywhere close to narrowing down your liked and disliked Legions, take a look at how you play RPGs. Whether they be video games or Table Top. What is the style of play you naturally gravitate towards? Are you more of a close range, in your face fighter? A sneaky git who uses deception, guile and skill to gain the upper hand? Or are you someone who prefers mowing down your enemies at range? Etc. Just figuring out one of the above can help you make some good progress into finding out what speaks to you the most or at least what doesn't. Another idea that I saw somewhere else in this forum and that I have repeated in one of the "help me..." threads is to write down all your potential Legions on individual strips of paper and to randomly draw one. If you draw a Legion and IMMEDIATELY think "aww I wish I had drawn X or Y" then you know what you've just chosen isn't for you while also giving you some choices to put above others. Another thing that might help but takes a lot of work is to self-analyze. Figure out what makes you well..you! It is very likely that some if not a lot of your own traits will be reflected in one way or another throughout one if not more Legions. And remember, as the previous posts have stated, this is 30k. Legions number in the Tens to Hundreds of thousands of marines. Anything goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Different players place varying degrees of importance on fluff versus a competitive list. Not all Legions are created equal rules wise. Iron Hands, Imperial Fists, Word Bearers, Salamanders and Iron Warriors stand above the rest either through better legion rules or superior unique units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brofist Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 If you’re careful with your planning, you can easily build an army that works with multiple 40k and 30k factions. Loyalist Iron Warriors? Traitor Alpha Legion? With the right color scheme and unit selection, you can easily work those into a CSM, SM, or Legion army list. That way if you ever encounter somebody that doesn’t want to play 30k, no problem, you have options To save money while building out a core army, consider using regular 40k plastic instead of FW resin. With the right bits you can easily convert 50 marines, an HQ, some apothecaries, some rhinos, some predators, and maybe a land raider. Sure, it’s not the same as an entirely FW army, but from the money you save you can buy all the shiny toys unique to the heresy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relict Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Some more resources: - The Legions were enormous forces fighting throughout the Galaxy. Even the smallest of them were still around the 100,000 mark. The realities of war means that in terms of their equipment and colors, there could be a wide range of possibilities. For example, the Salamanders are known and loved today for their elaborate wargear and ample use of flame-based weapons. However, a Salamander unit fighting in a remote corner of the Galaxy could resort to using mass-produced equipment with little to no embellishments and whatever weapons were most readily supplied due to attrition. - All Legions had access to the same list of equipments and weapons. In the hobby, this is represented by the Age of Darkness Space Marines list. Aside from specialized Legion-specific units and characters, however, each Legion utilized that same general inventory differently. For example, we know the Night Lords as master terror tacticians who avoid outright firefights whenever possible. However, the VIII Legion was noted to have at least one highly competent armored formation with heavy tanks. - It is key to remember that none of us (barring the utterly insane) will be able to build and paint enough models to represent a Legion in its entirety. Our tabletop armies will likely be around a company (100 Legionaries) in size. That company can be whatever you want it to be - the Sons of Horus's first company of Reavers and Justaerin, an Imperial Fist void warfare group, or a Word Bearer armored unit. In the end, it is your money and your time. The FW rules are generous enough to allow us to build whatever army we wish and the fluff is likewise generous enough to allow for justifications. The most important thing to remember is this: have fun! Why paint a scheme you dislike just so your army will fit the "established lore?" :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Carnelian Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Okay, I guess I will venture forth as the first person who needs this thread. I'm super torn. Basically, I love all the legions. But from that I have narrowed down my choices. First up, traitors since I only would ever go one route with them: Sons of Horus. I love their tactics, color scheme, ideology, background, special characters, everything. If I made an army of them, I would cover them in battle damage (a first for me) and model them as if they are fighting in the Legion Wars in the Eye of Terror. That way, I could justify running them with CSM rules when needed. My force would represent only the most hardened (read: broken) members of the Sons of Horus, the ones who lived long enough only to see their primarch fall and their dreams die on Terra's soil. Onto the two loyalists. I'm completely 50/50 on the Imperial Fists and the Blood Angels. I feel like I could really do some cool stuff with the red of the Blood Angels, plus whatever models Forge World makes for Sanguinius and Amit with wreck face for sure. I'm the sort of sucker who likes his good guys good and they don't come much more noble and compassionate than the Blood Angels. In fact, i would go with them entirely if it weren't for one huge factor: Sigismund. Sigismund. My man. My inspiration. The dude who keeps me reading Heresy books. The could make a whole series about him and I would buy every single first edition they put out. Hell, I'll write them if the Black Library will ever have me. He exemplifies everything I love about the Legiones Astartes. Human enough to care, hardened enough to press on past the point where saner men would have retreated. I love the character, the rules, everything. But the rest of the Imperial Fists I could take or leave. Also, I have painted that yellow before. It. Sucked. So what do you guys think? Maybe a Blood Angels force with allied Templar Brethren led by the exemplar Sigismund? I need your aid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Since your only reason for considering the Imperial Fists is Sigismund, why not make a scouring era Black Templar Chapter? Use the Sigismund model when (not if) it comes out and it would save some money since you could use plastic BT sprues and upgrades to fill out the force. Beyond that it seems that the sons of Sanguinius are your main draw here. Because lets be honest, choosing a Legion because of one (albeit awesome) character first and foremost and not the Legion and what it represents with the characters being sprinkles on the sundae, would probably lead to disappointment down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Golem Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Blood Angels and Imperial Fists from the siege of Terra? Best of both worlds, and Sigismund was a proper BA there ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Carnelian Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Blood Angels and Imperial Fists from the siege of Terra? Best of both worlds, and Sigismund was a proper BA there I agree. Thanks gang! Will do! Kudos to Heathens for making the thread. It's a good idea! (If only my poor locator thread had caught on.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grand_master85 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I'm in the fortunate position of having a fully fledged army now (my Salamanders). Unfortunately, that's not quite enough and I'm a big fan of the Istvaan campaigns so am looking at one of the Legions there to start up next. At least that's taken already the number of choices left from 17 to 11 :-) just can't decide who or what I want to do. Back to the Istvaan Campaign Legions book it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemon2027 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I guess the first thing to figure out is if you want a traitor side to go opposite your Salamanders or a loyalist to stand next to them. That will cut down a few more choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grand_master85 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 At the same time, though, there were loyal;ists and traitors within various Loyalist/Traitor Legions. I just like to have my cake and eat it. Oh, Sons of Horus are definitely out. I would really like to have an interest in them, I just can't. One down... "Ten Little Legions, standing in a line, one toddled home and then there were nine." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemon2027 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I remember seeing your Alpha Legion over on TFE, could they be an option? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grand_master85 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Perhaps. I didn't particularly like the route I was going down with them at the time. Very fast, so Jetbikes, Assault Marines and Speeders. My Salamanders are mechanised, but I can live with that. We see a lot of World Eaters at my local, and they are getting more and more popular. So I'd rather not do them. I've also tried Iron Hands 3 times now and it never seems to go anywhere. So they're out. Plus, I had a large Iron Warriors army up until recently and I found them either too dull to paint (lots of silver) or I wanted to cry paiunting hazard stripes haha. Emperor's Children? I just don't particularly like the Legion rules or their units. Shame, as I like the scheme and they have somne gorgeous minis in the Phoenix Guard. My problem has been that cos I identify and like a lot of the Legions, I find it hard to pick one so I have stopped, started, done a lot of the Legions and moved on. This is the first time I've decided to just stick with a Legion. SO this is more of a bonus for me, a nice added extra. Still, having a think knocks a few down! Just leaves Imperial Fists, Night Lords, Death Guard, Word Bearers, Raven Guard and Alpha Legion. Makes it a lot easier! Also, didn't know you were on TFE :-) I'll have to keep an eye out for you on there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemon2027 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Over there I am Omegon, I even have a tshirt and jumper :) I know what you mean about identifying with a lot of legions, i can pick bits from them all I like. I am currently enjoying working on Crimson Son Night Lords, hopefully it will last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Well, with the Legions you have left, why not paint one mini of each? See which one you enjoy painting the most? Since you'll be painting a lot of it if you settle on anyone of them :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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