Teutonicorder Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Hi all, was hoping to discuss Cypher and how to use him. Iv always liked his fluff and I like his rules and want to get him into a list and wondering how you guys would use him. I'm bouncing between a few options. 1) with a large unit of space marines minimally equipped but with the icon of vengeance. infiltrating and going for rapid fire and trying to grab back field objectives. 2) Using crimson slaughter and going with a group of chosen for plasma spam in a rhino for outflanking. 3) a group of khorne termies with lances. First thing is what to take him beside as a warlord, the -1 leadership could be very bad on a psyker obviously and a psyker would be very good with crimson slaughter due to divination, which means for option 2 at least and probably the others a lord is needed. what about running him along side Huron, 2-4 infiltrating units plus huron seems a decent character and the 2 of them together are not hugely expensive. anyway how would you field him? If anyone has any experiences using him also they would be good to hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaolin_Monkey Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I filed him in a Black legion list with plasma chosen. The list also includes a few other squads of special weapons spammed chosen all in Rhinos. Cypher and his Fallen crew get their own green rhino. Occasionally I have also run him just with big squads but he needs to avoid combat with anything beyond a sarge. As to the issue of a lord I go with Khârn usually and he doesn't much care about leadership! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Hi all, was hoping to discuss Cypher and how to use him. Iv always liked his fluff and I like his rules and want to get him into a list and wondering how you guys would use him. I'm bouncing between a few options. 1) with a large unit of space marines minimally equipped but with the icon of vengeance. infiltrating and going for rapid fire and trying to grab back field objectives. 2) Using crimson slaughter and going with a group of chosen for plasma spam in a rhino for outflanking. 3) a group of khorne termies with lances. First thing is what to take him beside as a warlord, the -1 leadership could be very bad on a psyker obviously and a psyker would be very good with crimson slaughter due to divination, which means for option 2 at least and probably the others a lord is needed. what about running him along side Huron, 2-4 infiltrating units plus huron seems a decent character and the 2 of them together are not hugely expensive. anyway how would you field him? If anyone has any experiences using him also they would be good to hear. Well, seeing as #1 and #3 are against the rules, I guess #2 ;-) Edit: Unless you use Huron/Ahriman as your warlord and give the units Infiltrate in their own right. Use the Dataslate Fallen instead of the Slaughter Chosen. They get infiltrate for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teutonicorder Posted August 31, 2014 Author Share Posted August 31, 2014 ah i see, cant confer it on the unit, well damn yeah unless huron 1 and 3 arnt working. unless cypher infiltrates and joins the deep striking termies but then its getting complicated. perhaps the marines can run forward and meet up with him on the way. any way, forgetting those, what unit setups would you go for? i mostly went crimson chosen for the champ and re rolls on all the plasma, arnt over heats going to be a problem with a bunch of rapid fire chosen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Why do crimson slaughter get rerolls on plasma? Plasma overheats are always a risk, but the amount they kill is worth it. Statistically, your 5 plasma chosen squad will get in 2 rounds of shooting before one dies. In the meantime, they may have killed 10 terminators. It's a good trade. Cypher can still join a unit in reserve then have them outflank. Take Huron, give a large unit of terminators infiltrate, add Cypher to the unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron-Daemon Forge Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Why do crimson slaughter get rerolls on plasma? Plasma overheats are always a risk, but the amount they kill is worth it. Statistically, your 5 plasma chosen squad will get in 2 rounds of shooting before one dies. In the meantime, they may have killed 10 terminators. It's a good trade. Cypher can still join a unit in reserve then have them outflank. Take Huron, give a large unit of terminators infiltrate, add Cypher to the unit. There a upgread allow one unit to be Draznicht's Ravagers (Chaos Chosen with mace weapon) & he given the unit preferred enemy against who every there battle against in games. IP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teutonicorder Posted August 31, 2014 Author Share Posted August 31, 2014 they have a 10 point upgrade that makes the champ give the unit preferred enemy while he's alive which lets them re roll, unless iv screwed that up too. ok so if im going to take those 2 and the terminators iv got to make the rest of the list support them. thinking a land raider with mok csm and huron, a 10 and 5 csm melta rhino, 2 vindicators, 2 heldrakes and 6 termies with cypher. Termies would be 6 Terminators Mok Vets 2 power fists 2 combi meltas heavy flamer icon of wrath 4 power lances. think its kinda of versatile and with hit and run the lances hopefully will be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron-Daemon Forge Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 they have a 10 point upgrade that makes the champ give the unit preferred enemy while he's alive which lets them re roll, unless iv screwed that up too. Nothing screwed up. Draznicht's Ravagers (upgread for Crimson Slaughter Chosen) give preferred enemy, allow you to re-roll 1's to hit & wound both in shooting & close combat. IP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
40kChrista Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 ... I'm bouncing between a few options. 1) with a large unit of space marines minimally equipped but with the icon of vengeance. infiltrating and going for rapid fire and trying to grab back field objectives. 2) Using crimson slaughter and going with a group of chosen for plasma spam in a rhino for outflanking. 3) a group of khorne termies with lances. ... Well, seeing as #1 and #3 are against the rules, I guess #2 ;-) Actually #3 is still legal, unless there is something in the FAQ I don't know about, the unit entry for Chaos Termies simply states they have a power weapon... on page 179 of the BRB (full size) it states that if the model's wargear says that it has a power weapon, with no other special rules, then look at the model to determine what type of power weapon it has. So you could still have Khorne Termies with power lances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Well obviously my comment doesn't make sense if you cut out the words before it...I wnever said that lances were illegal. Have another read ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
40kChrista Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 My mistake then, but even if you were just talking about mostly deployment issues... I fail to see how his #1 and #3 options are illegal. I don't get to play as much as I like, so I could be reading the rules wrong. I think for his first option he meant CSM, not SM. Couldn't you attach Cypher to that unit, Outflank, and shoot stuff up? Or do the same thing with the Termies? Infiltrate them, charge in with lances, Hit and Run, then charge again? I'm not saying you're wrong, and I guess I misread it about the lances, I'm just failing to understand why those options won't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stev Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Sorry if im hijacking or going off in a different tangent...my plan was to run cypher with his infiltrating fallen champions. My csm is mostly berzerkers in rhinos/landraider so the plan was cypher and his guys get rid of anything that the rest of the army might struggle with or stuff that could shoot them before the make combat. What I need my fellow chaos players advice on is how to equip the fallen. Ill be using the dv chosen so I have -twin lightning claws (might leave as is cuz its cool) -2 bolters (will change 1 or both to meltaguns or plasma guns. Melta seems safer but what is your opinion? Id like them to be able to take out a small squad of devestators or terminators, nercon vehicles or tyranid monsters as those would be the main things I face that the berzerkers might struggle with) -power fist and bolt pistol (change bolter to plasma pistol maybe?) -power axe and bolt pistol (again swap out pistol?) I know starting with the dv chosen somewhat limits my options and isnt optimal but hope with some simple weapon swaps I can get a squad that at least serves a purpose. Any advice is appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 I'm not saying you're wrong, and I guess I misread it about the lances, I'm just failing to understand why those options won't work. Grim, I pm'd you about the cypher/infiltrate issue to keep this thread clear :-) the unit loadout isn't the issue, but trying to infiltrate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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