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1850 Tournament


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#1
Reclusiarch Darius

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Work in progress list for local tournament I'll be in. Discussion thread here: http://www.bolterand...me-list-advice/

 

Current idea: Two Nemesis Strikeforces

 

HQ:
 
Grandmaster w/hammer+psycannon, Cuirass of Sacrifice
(230 points)
 
Librarian w/hammer
(115 points)
 
Troops:
 
Justicar w/sword, 2x Terminator w/sword+psycannon, 7x Terminators w/sword
(370 points)
 
Justicar w/sword, Terminator w/sword+psycannon, 3x Terminators w/sword
(185 points)
 
Heavy Support:
 
(2) Dreadknight w/greatsword, heavy psycannon, teleporter
(205 points each)
 
(2) Dreadknight w/greatsword, heavy psycannon, gatling psilencer, teleporter
(235 points each)
 
Fortification:
 
Aegis Line w/Comms Array
(70 points)
 
Total: 1850 points

Edited by Reclusiarch Darius, 18 January 2015 - 07:09 AM.

"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
Victory is nothing more than survival. It carries no weight of honour or worth beyond what we ascribe to it.
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers."

Grand Master Khyron, Eighth Brotherhood

"One unbreakable shield against the coming darkness, One last blade, forged in defiance of fate,
Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind

#2
Exile Noctis

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What you plan to do with the Purifiers? Just warp charge batteries for CF or hold objectives?



#3
Reclusiarch Darius

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What you plan to do with the Purifiers? Just warp charge batteries for CF or hold objectives?

 

Camp the Aegis line or in the Raven. Depends on matchups. 

"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
Victory is nothing more than survival. It carries no weight of honour or worth beyond what we ascribe to it.
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers."

Grand Master Khyron, Eighth Brotherhood

"One unbreakable shield against the coming darkness, One last blade, forged in defiance of fate,
Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind

#4
Brom MKIV

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If your considering the bunker then an escape hatch is a great option. I can say it's very good at delivering purifiers, better than a land raider. Gives the option of combat squad for half in the raven or to just camp and shoot against other 24" armies. It was one of my first innovations with the army. Note that the bunker must now be deployed with your army following the normal rules, i.e. inside your dz.

..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#5
Reclusiarch Darius

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Hey guys, just thought I'd post an update. I'm considering double Raven, as one doesn't seem enough. I'd need to drop a Dreadknight though. Thoughts?


"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
Victory is nothing more than survival. It carries no weight of honour or worth beyond what we ascribe to it.
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers."

Grand Master Khyron, Eighth Brotherhood

"One unbreakable shield against the coming darkness, One last blade, forged in defiance of fate,
Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind

#6
Malicth

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Well you would still have 3 dreadknights and from my own experiences having 2 ravens would be useful in situations. I say do a play test with each but I'm for 2 ravens.

#7
Brom MKIV

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iirc you have mentioned your meta being flyer heavy. If so then its hard to pass up double ravens since they also deliver purifiers and you would still have 3 NDKs.

 

That said NDKs deal with imperial knights and wave serpents better. So basically the big 3. I would base the decision on which ones you anticipate more. 


..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#8
Gentlemanloser

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I'd be tempted to see if you can drop the Bunker (Ravens don't benefit from the NSF anyway), and maybe drop the Puri's to 5 to fit the second Raven in without losing an NDK.

 

Basic;

 

NSF1

HQ: Libby (110)

Troop: Strike x5, Incinerator (115)

Fast: Raven (200)

Heavy: NDK, PT, Sword, H Psy (205)

Heavy: NDK, PT, Hammer, H Psy (200)

 

NSF2

HQ: Libby (110)

Troop: Strike x5, Incinerator (115)

Fast: Raven (200)

Heavy: NDK, PT, Hammer, H Psy (200)

Heavy: NDK, PT, Hammer, H Psy (200)

 

Total: 1,655

 

Almost 200 left for Purifiers.


Edited by Gentlemanloser, 23 October 2014 - 11:48 PM.

QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#9
Brom MKIV

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I have done that with only 1 raven and mostly shunting/goi but 2 ravens 20 meqs and libbys in reserve is way too risky. Besides the bunker scores objectives with av14 while also providing reserve manip.


..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#10
Gentlemanloser

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How does the bunker score?

Also is only a loss of 5 Marines if that. That's not worth a extra raven?
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#11
Quozzo

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I prefer GL's list. The NSFD is only benefiting the two librarians and two strike squads. What was the plan for the libbies? Deep strike them into the oppositions deployment zone to buff the dreadknights that shunt up the table? 70 points to better almost guarantee a libby turn one is not as good as another raven. With GL's list you need to wonder if dropping a raven/NDK for 5 purifiers is worth it? I think not. The NDK will be there turn one whereas the purifiers in the raven won't. So you don't have as much in reserve hoping to come on.

#12
Brom MKIV

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How does the bunker score?
Also is only a loss of 5 Marines if that. That's not worth a extra raven?

Ah my mistake I missed the 200 pts left over. Add 5 purifiers and the bunker and I might prefer that list too.

The bunker scores unless the TO rules otherwise because pg 134 says it can. It can actually operate the comms independently if there's nothing that can threaten av14 by your turn 2..

..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#13
IndigoJack

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I thought buildings could only score if occupied? I'll check my BRB went I get home but I'm almost certain this is the case
"Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position. But certainty is an absurd one." -Voltaire

"You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else." -Einstein

#14
Brom MKIV

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Actually they score when *claimed*. Its just risky if your facing deep strikers teleporters etc. But it works I've seen it and used it myself. 


..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#15
Ushtarador

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Pretty sure one of your units must be inside the bunker for it to score and operate the comms relay.



#16
Brom MKIV

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Buildings purchased as part of an army start out claimed. Claimed buildings score. This is clearly stated in the rules. The risk is that unoccupied buildings can be claimed by the other side simply by landing on them or entering them. However if your opponent cannot do that then the option is viable. Think empty rhinos.. similar concept.

..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#17
Ushtarador

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Hmm interesting, yay 7th edition :o (empty rhinos is not really a good comparison though, as a Rhino is always a unit in my army, whereas a building is neutral and can change sides).

Would an empty bastion also be able to operate a comms relay then?



#18
Reclusiarch Darius

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Okay I've been thinking and I've changed the list a bit. Strikes just don't do enough work IMO for my Troops slots. Termies are more expensive but they provide even more psycannon, melee threat, plus they draw AP2 off the DK's. 

 

What do you guys think? Worth dropping a DK to upgrade my Strikes to Termies? I've got a Strike combat squad still in the list to fulfill mandatory, but that's only to give me the option of combat-squadding both Termie psycannons into the same unit. I could always drop that for some upgrades instead. 


"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
Victory is nothing more than survival. It carries no weight of honour or worth beyond what we ascribe to it.
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers."

Grand Master Khyron, Eighth Brotherhood

"One unbreakable shield against the coming darkness, One last blade, forged in defiance of fate,
Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind

#19
Brom MKIV

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Hmm interesting, yay 7th edition :o (empty rhinos is not really a good comparison though, as a Rhino is always a unit in my army, whereas a building is neutral and can change sides).
Would an empty bastion also be able to operate a comms relay then?

Yes the bastion would score too. The concept I was speaking of is that rides and buildings aren't empty per se, just that those making them are dedicated.. thus empty dudes and buildings score. At least that's how I see it.

RD- More NDKs are probably just better when going for a competitive list. Alternately I think you would be well served with some allies to bring some msu aspect.

..All Space Marine legions and chapters, loyal and traitor, cast a shadow that resembles the Dark Angels.
-FerociousBeast

The only reason that Bjorn is in a dreadnought is that he fought Chuck Norris and won but the backlash of that much awesome mortally wounded him.....
-Emptyedens
 

"My IG infantry would kill for bolters... but they have lasguns, so they can't" -stripeydave

 


#20
Reclusiarch Darius

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RD- More NDKs are probably just better when going for a competitive list. Alternately I think you would be well served with some allies to bring some msu aspect. 

 

Mkay. I'm thinking of dropping the Purifiers entirely, and just going for Terminator Troops backed up with DK's. I'll edit the OP, see what you think.


"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
Victory is nothing more than survival. It carries no weight of honour or worth beyond what we ascribe to it.
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers."

Grand Master Khyron, Eighth Brotherhood

"One unbreakable shield against the coming darkness, One last blade, forged in defiance of fate,
Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind

#21
Ezeakiel

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I like your idea gentlemanloser. However I would replace the strike squads with termies justicar w/d-hammer 1×psy and 3×falchions. With use of hammerhand the now have 6str with 3 attacks. 4 on the charge proving fairly deadly still with ap 3. And you have the justicar to deal with bigger threats like vehicles or walkers

#22
DorkLeprechaun

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[quote name="Reclusiarch Darius" post="3845566"
I've got a Strike combat squad still in the list to fulfill mandatory, but that's only to give me the option of combat-squadding both Termie psycannons into the same unit. I could always drop that for some upgrades instead. [/quote]

To my understanding, new player. Combat squading would mean you'd have to adhere to the rules of a 5 man squad? Quoting from memory "serves as its own unit for all game purposes". Therefore leaving it so you can only have one special weapon per 5 man?

Edited by DorkLeprechaun, 02 January 2015 - 06:17 PM.


#23
Wrath of Humanity

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Btw, you said its a double nemesis strike force, but you only have 1 HQ...



#24
Gaz1858

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Assuming theres actually two libbies as theres 115 points left from his list....
QUOTE
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#25
Reclusiarch Darius

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To my understanding, new player. Combat squading would mean you'd have to adhere to the rules of a 5 man squad? Quoting from memory "serves as its own unit for all game purposes". Therefore leaving it so you can only have one special weapon per 5 man?

 

Nah you can split them up any way you want. All that is required is that both units are equal in size (ie 2x 5-man squads). So its perfectly fine to put the two psycannons in a single unit. 

 

Btw, you said its a double nemesis strike force, but you only have 1 HQ...

Assuming theres actually two libbies as theres 115 points left from his list.... 

 

Yeah sorry guys I forgot to add the little '(2)' next to the Librarian. They're both just carrying hammers. 

"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
Victory is nothing more than survival. It carries no weight of honour or worth beyond what we ascribe to it.
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers."

Grand Master Khyron, Eighth Brotherhood

"One unbreakable shield against the coming darkness, One last blade, forged in defiance of fate,
Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind