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Stat wise who are the most dangerous Primarchs so far?


Emperor's Furor

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We have around half the Primarchs on paper so far but whose the most intimidating do you think? So far the current Primarchs with rules are:

 

Horus

Fulgrim

Mortarion

Ferrus Manus

Lorgar

Konrad Curze

Vulkan

Corax

Alpharius

Dorn

Perturabo

Angry Ron

 

There's at least two categories for most dangerous however, Primarch vs Primarch and Primarch vs Army. Which Primarchs are the most deadly vs other Primarchs and which Primarchs bring the most to the table for an army.

 

What do you think?

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Not sure against other Primachs, but I've had Mortarion completely rip through an enemy arm consisting of Iron Warriors and Tau. Once he hit the lines, he soaked up something like 40 LasCannon shots, 12 Plasma Cannons, a bunch of Pulse Rifles, and still had a few wounds. Ended up mopping up half of the enemy deployment area. Resilience itself is a dangerous thing.

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Horus with his hamstring rule or whatever it is called destroys Primarchs. Angron otherwise with his 8 (IIRC) attacks, while Fulgrims 2+/3++ with his 7ish attacks against the slowest Primarchs are reasonably capable provided he doesn't get concussed or fail a vital blind.

 

Because of Hit and Run, Corax and Curze are the best against Primarchs (although Horus makes them worse)

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Does Alpharius have any chance against any of them?

 

 

If he used all of his underhanded tactics and special rules against his fellow primarch, Alpharius has a good chance of dishing out some pain. He might not win, but he will leave some sore wounds. In a straight up fight however, particularly if he's the one being charged... I think the odds aren't in his favour.

 

Alpharius's strength is his ability to change the dynamic of the battlefield. If he's dueling primarchs, something has horrificly gone wrong.

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Attack profiles, listed as on the charge. Primarchs are assumed to have their normal rules granted by Primarch special rule unless stated.

 

Horus; 7 WS8 S7 I6 Shred AP2 attacks with Disabling Strike; or 7 S10 I1 Master Crafted AP2 Concussive (Against T6, Talon has slightly better chance to wound than Worldbreaker, T7 or higher, Worldbreaker is better. Disabling Strike is -1WS and -1S if it suffers one or more wounds. Saves of 2+/3++ with 6 T6 wounds and a 3+ Save against Blind, Concussive type effects, and Psychic Attacks etc. If fighting a Primarch reduced by his Talon to WS4, he deals +d3 attacks against them; this affects best case scenario Fulgrim (2W remaining), Mortarion (4W remaining), Ferrus Manus (3W remaining), Curze (2W remaining), Vulkan (3W remaining), Lorgar (both versions; 4W remaining), Perturabo (2W remaining), Alpharius (3W remaining), Dorn (2W remaining), Corax (3W remaining, 2W if Deadly Prey Corax is taken). I'll leave it up to you whether that affects the higher remaining wounds more or the lower. Mortarion, Perturabo with Forgebreaker (also immune to Concussive), and Rogal Dorn are all equipped with Unwieldly weapons making it less useful for Concussive, while Ferrus and Vulkan also have I5 meaning that they hit after his Claw anyway. The opponents most susceptible to his Worldbreaker are Angron, Fulgrim (gains bonus attacks based on positive Initiative difference), Curze and Corax (both with Hit and Run) who also have higher Initiative than Horus. Lorgar (both versions) and Alpharius share his Initiative value. He must choose whether to attack with either Claw or Worldbreaker. 

 

Angron; 8 WS9 I7 S7 AP2 Attacks with Hatred rerolling misses and Furious Charge for +1 Strength; these would cause Instant Death on a 6, but irrelevant dealing with Primarchs, as is Armourbane. These attacks are higher if he's already killed enemies (not that although he gets +1 attack from the axes, he also gets +1 attack from The Spite Furnace). Saves of 3+/4++ with 5 T6 wounds and a 6+ Feel No Pain makes him reasonably fragile - although the 3+ save doesn't matter as all Primarchs have AP2 as standard regardless. His Initiative means that he is only at risk of being outsped by Fulgrim, while Corax and Curze share Initiative with him. Everyone else is outsped by him. The 4++ and only 5 wounds with a near negligible FNP makes him as the most vulnerable (even Corax has Hit and Run to keep him alive) Primarch stat wise. If he's in combat with other models he can challenge, he may however be able to win combat by stacking attacks onto the none Primarch and having those additional wounds placed onto the Primarch - although causing wounds was never really Angrons problem. Yes, because of the game mechanics, Angron can hurt a Primarch more by not attacking a Primarch.

 

Fulgrim; Between 6 and 9 WS8 S7 I8 AP2 Attacks (Murderous Strike as above has no effect against Primarchs) in a challenge. Using the Fireblade as opposed to a Blade of the Laer as Rending has no effect on Primarchs and the Fireblade as a Paragon Blade has +1 S. Defences are 6 T6 wounds with a 2+/3++ in a challenge. As he must always challenge this can work in his favour as slower Primarchs might not want to challenge him, and a 3++ Invulnerable is pretty tough. For sheer damage, is roughly level with Angron; although Angrons higher WS and I make him better when he faces Fulgrim than he may fair against other Primarchs. However, Fulgrim is particularly susceptable to Strikedown or Concussive due to his rules benefitting from high Initiative.

 

Mortarion; 6 WS7 S7 I1 AP2 attacks with no added benefits (unless there happens to be 6+ models in base contact for Sweep). His damage output is pretty terrible for a Primarch. His defences are 2+/4++ with 7 T7 Wounds, and gets to reroll IWND (55% chance of success rather than 33%). The longer a battle goes on the better he does, although against Horus, he is likely to come off worse as Disabling Strike hurts Mortarion's already meager damage output.

 

Ferrus

 

Curze

 

Vulkan

 

Lorgar

 

Perturabo

 

Alpharius

 

Dorn

 

Corax

 

will update tomorrow

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In straight up brawls between the primarchs with nothing else on the table my rolling results were:

(Not all of these primarchs beat everyone under them, I ranked based on who beat the most other primarchs)

Horus (disabling strike combo'ed with his armor wins it for him)

Angron (high amount of High Strength attacks at WS9)

Curze (Hit and Run allowing for more charge attacks+HOW hits and his Knives surprisingly put him in the top 3)

Mortarion (while his offense is mediocre, the fact that he can regenerate faster than some primarchs can hurt him makes him good)

Fulgrim w/ Fireblade (with his large amount of attacks at S7 he brings the pain)

Perturabo w/ Forgebreaker (WS8 and his 3++ helps him out)

Ferrus Manus (it was neck and neck between him and Vulkan, and the extra attack from the servo arm beat out Vulkan's IWND bonus)

Vulkan (his Hammer is stupid good, but he only has 4 attacks which hurts him

Corax (powerful on offense, but a 5++ kills him. Textbook definition of glass hammer)

Alpharius (not really meant for combat, but his Preferred Enemy helps him out)

Lorgar (this is normal Lorgar, not upgraded Lorgar, who I didn't rank because his powers are so variable)

Dorn (why the Devs gave him an unwieldy sword but Ferrus and Vulkan have at initiative Thunder Hammers is beyond me...)

 

As for what Primarch is deadliest in an army, depends on what your qualification is. Alpharius might not be the best fighter but giving his entire army Preferred Enemy is a game changer.

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The total beat stick Primarches like Angron don't really buff their armies that much. Whereas Dorn may not be the best combat primarch but buffs the crap out of his army... And he has a sweet ride!
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The one thing I realised when i faced Horus and his Justaerin with my Vulkan and his Firedrakes; does disabling strike affect him? Sure, his WS will be decreased, but As his hammer gives him an outright S10 as opposed to just doubling it like most Thunder Hammers and its his own S (not the Hammers) that is affected...tbh, I rolled quite poorly in combat with Vulkan. Those 4 hits do hurt. Fortunately, Justaerin are pants so the fire drakes beat them up and proceeded to kill Horus whilst the Big V held him up
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