Noctem Cultor Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Hi all, This is just a speculation /discussion topic off the back of a post on Bell of lost souls today showing the new Harlequins fluff hinting and a End game from the laughing god to destroy Slaanesh. First up facts and hints! GW is enjoying Fantasy End Times success and this would work well to reshape the 40k verse. Recently no love has been shown for Slaanesh (End times Nurgle and Khorne and Tzeentch rumours but nothing Slaanesh) GW has removed Chaos gods before GWs new direction of more kid friendly models has been dimming down Slaanesh models like Daemonettes for a while. Harlequins are now poised fluff wise to do the damage. Being the newest of the Four Powers and less focussed on power plays like the other 3 a move from the other Gods to rid themselves of Slaanesh would be likely. What would Slaanesh death mean? Unified Eldar. Continued direction of the race and a chance to rebuild as one similar to fantasy elves. Forces of Good look to have finally won something making Chaos well Chaos. A chance to have 3 Cult codexs and a Undivided/unmarked codex to mirror the 4 loyalist codexs. Emperors children left in a wierd position. Slaanesh being down graded to aspects of the god into his main Daemons? So Pride keeping Slaanesh players around but toning down the boobs and other aspects. More focus on the other 3 Gods and their Daemons. Thoughts? As I said this is just Speculation and discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castellan Cato Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I don't see this happening. If it was just the game mechanics we were talking about it might be possible. However, they've gone to a lot of trouble to set up the two-way rivalry of the gods and then the rivalry of all four. IMO Slaanesh is the least defined of the gods, but that spot still needs to be filled by something. Not to mention Slaanesh is well represented in their satellite games (aka pretty much anything from Fantasy Flight). It would be too hard to explain to fans that he just went *poof* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I'll restrain my views on this. As it is said "if you have nothing nice to say". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctem Cultor Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 Full understand that this would be a massive kick in the teeth for some fans. As is said its more of a what if discussion. I mean Lizardmen players probally thought their race was safe unto recently. Personally I think it would be a simple way of making an End Times esc chain of events in 40k. When a Chaos God dies do all of its followers vanish? Or could Fulgrim and others still fight and even make a power play as aspects of Slaanesh? Id love the idea of Lucius realising when he dies it will stick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vile Siren Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 As much as I would hate to see Slaanesh go it would be interesting to see Fulgrim or another daemon try filling the gap maybe as a new god. Doubt it would happen but it would maybe be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skallagoose Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 I would imagine them to tone down the sexuality of Slaanesh if they want to make it more open to kids. I strongly doubt they will end slaanesh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 I would imagine them to tone down the sexuality of Slaanesh if they want to make it more open to kids. I strongly doubt they will end slaanesh. See, this is a common misconception with Slaanesh. There's more sexuality involved with WFB Witch Elves. Slaanesh is all about excess and pushing boundaries. The boobs look went years ago but that was a bit tacky and tunnel visioned anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 I guess it depends if Slaanesh survives The End Times in WFB... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomulusPrime Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 I rather thought that the Harlequin fluff meant more along the lines that Cegorach and Ynnead will change Slaanesh's hold on all Eldar souls, thus freeing the Eldar from their fate, and leaving Slaanesh a bit hungrier then before, but more-or-less intact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradigm Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Ynnead will never come to be. The eldar belong to Slaanesh. Like She who thirsts, Ynnead, being a warp entity, will exist in the warp now if it ever exists. Slaanesh might be the youngest of the powers but by its very nature, now has always existed. As time has no meaning in the warp, and the chaos gods have reach without regard to time, if Ynnead doesn't exist now, it's always going to be a pipe dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinyRhino Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I'm not sure the "reaching for the kid audience" reasoning holds up to any real scrutiny. How is Khorne, for whom people slaughter innocents and harvest bloody skulls any more "kid friendly" than Slaanesh? How is Nurgle, bringer of pestilence and models with seeping, rotting, cadaverous wounds any more "kid friendly" then Slaanesh. Chaos is not "kid friendly" in any way, shape, or form. If you're referring to Malal when you say "they've removed Chaos gods before," remember that that was purely a legal trademark situation. Malal was expunged from GW canon and materials because the writer who thought it up retained copyright to the character and GW wasn't going to pay royalties to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiringchaoschampion Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I agree with Forte Slaanesh was never about sex its all about obsession excess perfection pushing boundries etc. There was never anything sexual about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkangilos Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Ynnead will never come to be. The eldar belong to Slaanesh. Like She who thirsts, Ynnead, being a warp entity, will exist in the warp now if it ever exists. Slaanesh might be the youngest of the powers but by its very nature, now has always existed. As time has no meaning in the warp, and the chaos gods have reach without regard to time, if Ynnead doesn't exist now, it's always going to be a pipe dream. What? You'll need some sources to back up that Slaanesh has always existed because he exists now. Warp Powers are more like the ancient gods of man that weren't omnipotent. They are *near omnipotent, but the fact that the other Eldar gods were slain by the chaos gods is proof that warp entities aren't what you said. Just as Slaanesh was born (and he was born, he was not always around), Ynnead will be born (maybe it will even be the Emperor when he dies). Slaanesh did not retroactively change all of history as if he had always existed. Neither will Ynnead. Also, don't forget that the Eldar that are predicting Ynnead are the same Eldar that predicted Slaanesh. With a track record like that, I'd believe it's likely to happen. Basically, as the Emperor put it during the Great Crusade, warp entities are simply aliens that live in another dimension, and feed off of our emotions. I agree with Forte Slaanesh was never about sex its all about obsession excess perfection pushing boundries etc. There was never anything sexual about it Well, true. I agree. However, there is something deeply sexual about Slaanesh. Slaanesh isn't all about it, but that's a pretty big drive for a lot of excess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I agree with Forte Slaanesh was never about sex its all about obsession excess perfection pushing boundries etc. There was never anything sexual about it Not strictly true. Originally in Realms of Chaos (yes, I'm that old) there was lots of sexuality but also the excess too. Over time the sexual part has been lessened as the audience became younger and GW went on the stock market. Now it's hinted at but not the be all and end all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiringchaoschampion Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Weird ive never seen it as sexual but thats just me ive always seen it as Slaanesh takes your deepest desires/obsessions and makes them reality but in doing so makes you crave more for example a man seeks to perfect his swordsmen ship. This obsession with perfection attracts the gaze of slaanesh who in turn drives the man to greater acts turning his drive for perfection into a thirst for the screams of the innocent as he kills them in the most horrific ways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Ynnead will never come to be. The eldar belong to Slaanesh. Like She who thirsts, Ynnead, being a warp entity, will exist in the warp now if it ever exists. Slaanesh might be the youngest of the powers but by its very nature, now has always existed. As time has no meaning in the warp, and the chaos gods have reach without regard to time, if Ynnead doesn't exist now, it's always going to be a pipe dream. What? You'll need some sources to back up that Slaanesh has always existed because he exists now. Warp Powers are more like the ancient gods of man that weren't omnipotent. They are *near omnipotent, but the fact that the other Eldar gods were slain by the chaos gods is proof that warp entities aren't what you said. Just as Slaanesh was born (and he was born, he was not always around), Ynnead will be born (maybe it will even be the Emperor when he dies). Slaanesh did not retroactively change all of history as if he had always existed. Neither will Ynnead. Also, don't forget that the Eldar that are predicting Ynnead are the same Eldar that predicted Slaanesh. With a track record like that, I'd believe it's likely to happen. Basically, as the Emperor put it during the Great Crusade, warp entities are simply aliens that live in another dimension, and feed off of our emotions. I agree with Forte Slaanesh was never about sex its all about obsession excess perfection pushing boundries etc. There was never anything sexual about it Well, true. I agree. However, there is something deeply sexual about Slaanesh. Slaanesh isn't all about it, but that's a pretty big drive for a lot of excess. So, I cannot find the source right now, but it basically boils down to the way the warp functions. Time doesn't flow linearly in the warp, so Slaanesh's birth does not predate Slaanesh's influence. That being said, from what I can tell, 40k time travel seems to work in a continuously rewriting manner, therefore Slaanesh has had significant impact throughout the entirety of history. However, there was definitely a defining moment when Slaanesh was born, and its actions radiated out from that time point in both space and time. This means that just because Ynnead is not yet a god, doesn't mean that it won't become one and then act on previous times rewriting history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradigm Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 While slaanesh was born, due to the nature of the warp, the chaos God slaanesh has always existed. If Ynnead is ever born it will have always existed. That's kind of the greater tradgedy of the eldar, they are dying off, and their dream will never come true. That's how you also know the emperor will never leave the golden throne, and manifest a warp God of himself. I can't find you places where the canon explicitly states these things, but it's implied by the fluff about the warp itself. What will be has always been in the warp as time has no meaning, and flows in all directions. As far as continuously rewriting history goes, this could in fact be the case. However based on the latest Ahriman book, there is certainly an argument either way. In the end this is certainly a vague portion of the fluff and these are my opinions based on what I understand of it. I don't want to spoil the book, because it's actually a great read for those interested, and it's a major plot point I refer to. If you want to know pm me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkangilos Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 While slaanesh was born, due to the nature of the warp, the chaos God slaanesh has always existed. If Ynnead is ever born it will have always existed. That's kind of the greater tradgedy of the eldar, they are dying off, and their dream will never come true. That's how you also know the emperor will never leave the golden throne, and manifest a warp God of himself. I can't find you places where the canon explicitly states these things, but it's implied by the fluff about the warp itself. What will be has always been in the warp as time has no meaning, and flows in all directions. As far as continuously rewriting history goes, this could in fact be the case. However based on the latest Ahriman book, there is certainly an argument either way. In the end this is certainly a vague portion of the fluff and these are my opinions based on what I understand of it. I don't want to spoil the book, because it's actually a great read for those interested, and it's a major plot point I refer to. If you want to know pm me. If the nature of the warp allowed Slaanesh to be born the way he was, then it allows Ynnead to be born in the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted March 4, 2015 Share Posted March 4, 2015 In WFB all factions are still in tact and pretty much the same, bar a few new ways of combining them. All changes were strictly territorial, like the loss of Ulthuan, Lustria and Middenheim. Should a 40k equivalent of End Times come to be, I suppose the changes will be of similar nature, for example the fall of Cadia and something similar. However, it did not say that Cegorath could kill Slaanesh. It said he wants to trick Slaanesh into saving the Eldar race. Trick into saving is not the same as dying. So it would very well be possible to break the link between Eldar and Slaanesh without killing him/her/it. However, too much background and game mechanics are bound to this. As has been mentioned the rivalry between gods, and also the need to wear Soulstones (for CWE) or torture others to replenish ones soul (for DE). As for GW having killed a god before, I suppose you are talking about Malal. This wasn't a fluff move. It was done because GW did not own the copyright for that figure and thus needed to get rid of it. Completely different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucien Eilam Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 If I was writing an (uncharacteristically positive for 40k) resolution to the various Eldar plot strands, the plan would involve orchestrating one final, apocalyptic battle, with a grand alliance of all the remaining Craftworld Eldar, Dark Eldar and Harlequins descending into the Eye of Terror to face the forces of Slaanesh, while Cegorach duels Slaanesh in the Warp. A battle the Eldar would comprehensively lose. The last Eldar falls and the Laughing God drops his guard (mirroring that codex story of a Solitaire's self-sacrifice). As a seemingly victorious Slaanesh prepares to feast on countless Eldar souls, the Infinity Circuits release their contents into the Warp, the gestalt of an entire race reaches critical mass, and s/he catches the birth of Ynnead right in the face. Slaanesh's hold on the Eldar is broken, roll credits on an idyllic Maiden World with the Exodites under the protection of a benevolent new god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellios Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 While slaanesh was born, due to the nature of the warp, the chaos God slaanesh has always existed. If Ynnead is ever born it will have always existed. That's kind of the greater tradgedy of the eldar, they are dying off, and their dream will never come true. That's how you also know the emperor will never leave the golden throne, and manifest a warp God of himself. I can't find you places where the canon explicitly states these things, but it's implied by the fluff about the warp itself. What will be has always been in the warp as time has no meaning, and flows in all directions. As far as continuously rewriting history goes, this could in fact be the case. However based on the latest Ahriman book, there is certainly an argument either way. In the end this is certainly a vague portion of the fluff and these are my opinions based on what I understand of it. I don't want to spoil the book, because it's actually a great read for those interested, and it's a major plot point I refer to. If you want to know pm me. You can rewrite history, and cause stupid stuff to happen in 40k. I can't be the only one who likes the story where the Ork warboss goes back in time and declares war on his younger self so that he can get a spare of his favourite gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctem Cultor Posted March 5, 2015 Author Share Posted March 5, 2015 40k Time travel is something id leave to the simple minded Orks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctem Cultor Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 And its back on topic at BoLs. 40k Deep Thought – Should GW Kill Slaanesh? Some interesting points but still nothing solid on if it will happen. At the moment im listening for rumours of anything new Slaanesh related as mentioned on BoLs its more the lack of Slaanesh produced by Games Workshop directly that is worrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Remember kids, murder, bloodlust, mutilation, xenophopia, racism, war, psychopathic disorders, torture, experiments on life humans, genocide, fascism, corruption, greed, slavery and blind faith is all good, but anything sexual is a big no-no ;) Slaanesh is an interesting god, even if you take all the perverted things out. Removing him/her/it will not do them a favour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctem Cultor Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 It is a wierd one as I'm sure in films its considered the lesser evil over the list just mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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