New 7th codex and box-sets discussion

[Emicus]

Hey all,

With the current break-neck release schedule at GW there is only 5 major codexes left from 6th edition unless I've counted wrong, and 1 of those is heavily rumoured to come next week. The esteemed Imperial Guard is one of the four left from last edition even if it was written with 7th in mind. So place your bets guardsmen, throw out some ideas and wish-listing:

- Do you reckon there might be a new guard book before the end of the year?

- What would the changes be? Buffs, nerfs, points cost adjustments to units

- New kit? What would it be?
​- Re-doing some of the old boxes?

- Formations/decurions, what would they consist of and what special rules would they get?

 

[WarriorFish]

There is nothing to go on, we didn't even get anything more than the Sciondex (which came out first...) as supplements so it feels a bit rubbish not to get anything. That said it's likely at the stage that GW will want to wait for a new codex anyway. Even so I don't think the Guard codex will be updated too soon, likely towards the end of the cycle so I doubt anything this year. Our codex is fine so not a big deal to wait.

 

New models would be nice of course. Rough Rider plastics anyone? The trooper kits are getting a bit old (very old for Catachan!) so they are surely ripe for an update? Personally I'd be happy with just this (as I'm long banging on about - 3 kits makes an entirely new Guard range...) but I'm sure GW would rather sell a shiny new kit to everyone too. Vehicle wise our kits are fine, though the Valk kit could do with an improvement it's not high priority.

 

For rules that's hard to predict as you'd expect. Overall I think our codex is quite balanced in this regard. Expect to see the Wyvern changed in some way, either more expensive or losing some rules (latter seems more plausible?). I'd love for HWTs to get something (e.g. Eternal Warrior...) so HWSs are more viable. Something to represent the vast difference in regiments would be nice like Marines get, even if it's only a small bonus.

 

 

The Guard codex didn't change massively last update so it's hard to imagine anything different happening on a codex that doesn't need too much, but who knows what GW is planning?

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

I don't believe that the guard are really in need of a rules update, however the model range could use an update. Given what's happened with the new 7E codecies, an update would likely just be points adjustment and rules tweaking. I personally think it would be wasteful, they should wait until 8th edition comes out...

[Nicodemus Doloroso]

I don't believe that the guard are really in need of a rules update, however the model range could use an update. Given what's happened with the new 7E codecies, an update would likely just be points adjustment and rules tweaking. I personally think it would be wasteful, they should wait until 8th edition comes out...

 

I agree with this, our rules are fine, although I wouldn't mind a supplement or two as WarriorFish mentioned. Or at least some White Dwarf formations or somesuch! My other army is Blood Angels and they have tons of formations to choose from between Shield of Baal and White Dwarf, it seems wrong that Guard don't have even one.

 

One thing I miss from the 6th edition codex is my Penal Legionnaires. They were much-maligned but I found them to be decent and above all a very fun unit. I'd be real happy if they brought out a Penal Legion dataslate, but they would probably only do that if they made a kit and I don't see them doing that. Plus if they are to do new infantry kits I agree that, while they've aged fairly well, Cadians and Catachans could also use a facelift. Instead of continuing the pewter lines (surely they won't be kept around much longer anyway), I don't see why they don't do upgrade kits like they have for Black Templar and various other marines, so that you can turn Cadian kits into Mordians (peaked cap heads), Steel Legion (gas mask heads and great coat legs), Tallarn (turban heads).

[Jacinda]

Space Marines

Dark Angels

Chaos SM

Chaos Daemons

Eldar

Tau

Tyranids

Sisters of Battle

Guard

 

I wouldn't get too excited about a new codex yet.  It is more likely the guard will be included in a new campaign set first.

[Nicodemus Doloroso]

Jacinda, that's a list of armies with 6th edition or older codices, right? Not a list of what order anyone anticipates their release?

 

Guard being in a campaign set is what I'd like to see versus a new codex. Get some cool formations, maybe a special character or unit or two.

[Jacinda]

Right.  No order at all.

 

[eta]

we could start a rumor here ...

 

That's the defined order.  The will be released ever 3.76 weeks starting yesterday.  Space Marines will be the first non-Saturday release of the new schedule.

 

And Sisters of Battle are ready to go.  GW had to build new storage facilities to hold all the production they already have.  Apparently they just need new photos for the box art.  The photographers they hired forgot to  take the lens cap off and now they are stuck in this prolonged legal argument to get out of the contract before new art can be produced.  New plastic sisters are just 18 months away. 

[WarriorFish]

You forgot the monkeys with typewriters doing the new fluff, it won't be plausible without that :P

 

Guard can definitely wait, so that's what I hope happens. Give other armies more in need the injection they need (and us more time with our codex ;) ). The return of the penal legion would be nice too as Nico said!

[Vel'Cona]

Seconded on the Formations. The IG codex is actually pretty solid as is, especially with all the fun allies we can "borrow". I would like to have access to a cleaned-up Formation list which includes something to reflect the individual regiments, ie. a Tallarn Raiders Veterans/Rough Riders detachment, a Valhallans Infantry Swarm with some Conscript/Mortar buffs, and perhaps an actual Catachan Devils Formation (that buffs poor Harker!). Maybe even (dare I say it), an Armored Formation that isn't full of FW nonsense?

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

Right.  No order at all.

 

[eta]

we could start a rumor here ...

 

That's the defined order.  The will be released ever 3.76 weeks starting yesterday.  Space Marines will be the first non-Saturday release of the new schedule.

 

And Sisters of Battle are ready to go.  GW had to build new storage facilities to hold all the production they already have.  Apparently they just need new photos for the box art.  The photographers they hired forgot to  take the lens cap off and now they are stuck in this prolonged legal argument to get out of the contract before new art can be produced.  New plastic sisters are just 18 months away. 

Oh you...

[Lord Lee]

Wow wow wow easy guys, I like this codex let's not give GW any reason to muck it up.

 

Lord Lee.

[Gunmonkey88]

I agree with the above comments wanting new models over new rules. It'd be cool to see the different IG distinct regiments (Cadian, Mordian, Talarn, etc) get their own traits like they used to have which made a lot more sense with the models they were given. For instance, I recall that all Cadians had carapace armor, Catachans had a 6+ armor save but +1 to cover save. It'd also be cool if they brought the custom traits back, something similar to what the 4th ed Space Marines had which was a fantastic way to customize the character of an army and really make it unique.

 

Models-wise, I'd love to see revamped lines of all of the distinct regiments (some of which are from 2nd edition) and update the look of the Chimera and Leman Russ. Also, maybe even HWTs with an option to fire from the prone position?

[wulfgar hammerfist]

Formations would be a good thing but other than that I think the current codex is fine. One thing I would like, and this is just wishful thinking, is something like a forward observer to adjust indirect fires. Maybe something like, "If the FO can see the intended target then scatter is reduced to 1D6" or something like that.

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

Honestly, all we need for a 7th edition book, is a reformat, and some supplement books (Tempestus, Tallarn, Catachan, Steel Legion, Mordian, Attilan, and I'd say Elysians and DKoK). You might be able to condense some of those into one, say the Tempestus get a supp, and then you have the Regiments of the Astra Militarum. 

 

Before anyone says it, I know that Elysians and DKoK are forge world, it was just a bit of wishful thinking...

[Bionicman]

I like the current codex, it flies under the radar but has enough options and builds to be fun to play. So I'm fine with not having a new codex for a year or two.

 

Things that need change:

* Heavy Weapon Squads. So iconic for guard and yet so fragile. Give them a stealth or shrouding for example. Not going to happen I know.

* Wyvern. Its OP at least for the cost. What is a real pain are the rules. Mostly I leave my at home an take something less capable, more fun to play.

* Ogryns/Bullgryns. Hey, even my grey knight terminator got cheaper. Why are they so damn pricey?

* Hellhound, Rough Rider  & such. Still too expensive.

* Commisars. But I guess they will nerf priests anyway :(

* Hydra. Common. Its crap. Noone takes it.

* Mortars. In a world of tau we can't even have pinning?

[CyderPirate]

I'd quite like to see a 'Chapter Tactics' kind of thing brought in for the main guard regiments and maybe the addition of Baneblades and their variants as LoW.

 

I expect we won't get either of those, though, but we will get some silly  formations. And Pask will probably get tuned down a bit.

[Jolemai]

Perhaps a new Codex: Catachans?

 

Space Marines

Dark Angels

Chaos SM

Chaos Daemons

Eldar

Tau

Tyranids

Sisters of Battle

Guard

 

I wouldn't get too excited about a new codex yet.  It is more likely the guard will be included in a new campaign set first.

Inquisition too.

[Jacinda]

Emicus said "major codices." I was just counting those with full CAD options. 

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

I'd quite like to see a 'Chapter Tactics' kind of thing brought in for the main guard regiments and maybe the addition of Baneblades and their variants as LoW.

 

I expect we won't get either of those, though, but we will get some silly  formations. And Pask will probably get tuned down a bit.

 

I didn't think about that option, have regimental tactics in the main book, the big ones, Steel Legion, Catachans, Tallarn, Attillan, and Cadian. Then have a Supplement book for running the tempestus focused armies, and maybe an armored column type supplement.

 

Include the Baneblade variants in the LoW section of the main book. 

 

Condense the fluff sections with the army list section, as is the standard in the new 7e codecies, and do some points adjusting on some things, ogryns/bullgryns a bit cheaper, jump the Wyvern up a bit, and maybe give us something more like the Vulture that is dedicated CAS, and maybe give us static artillery pieces (I don't want big expensive tanks to do my artillery, I just want some barrage emplacements). Give the HWT's the ability to take camo nets, and I thought the mortars had pinning, but give it to them if they don't. 

[Kontakt]

Since both guard books (yes, I consider scions to be guard) were written just before the release of 7th edition, and since their rules were written with 7th edition in mind, we can reasonably conclude that the guard books are at least a year or more away from any update.

As mush as I'd like to see an actual use for heavy weapons teams, regimental tactics and just about anything for scions, I will openly admit that some other army books are in dire need of some changes (like the cost of terminators...) or rebalances (beating the eldar to death with the nerfbat ) and that these issues are more important to GW than making plastic steel legion for me .

[Vel'Cona]

Yes please, Baneblade variants in codex.  Maybe a plastic conversion kit for the Vendetta, too?

[WarriorFish]

Better to retweak the Valk kit and make it a double as it could do with improvement. As said though I'd much rather they look to the infantry range first!

[Father Mehman]

I think from now on our Codex is going to be pretty much stable. I say this because look at the last few iterations of it. What really changed? Not a lot. We got some new stuff, lost some old things, and the points were more-or-less evened-out. There is always the possibility of re-tweaking points but I highly doubt we'd ever get Doctrines like the Space Marines, as much as that would be a cool addition, or that we'll see new versions of the Steel Legion, Mordians, or Catachans. Look at what they did to the Catachan line of models this time around: they made most of them Direct Order only. To me, that doesn't bode well for our Vietnam-era macho men.

This seems to be the Codex and Army that most people have as a secondary force or as an Allies Force. I just don't see anything major happening to us as we're not power armoured.

That being said, I'd go giddy if they gave us reworked Company Squads. The game is moving to be more customizable with options almost clogging-up the drain but I don't think we'll get very much of that love. Well, we got Scions !

[WarriorFish]

True enough, but just because things haven't changed much recently doesn't mean that will always be the case. Change always comes in some form and who's to say GW won't fancy a big one this time?

 

Perhaps if GW graced the noble corridors of the barracks and picked up a few neat ideas (plastic Rough Riders, new trooper kits...), but they are a strange and fickle beast so nobody quite knows what they're thinking or if such machinations could even be understood by mortal men.

[Emicus]

Some very interesting discussion here! Part of the reason I ask is because I'd like to get in with the guard and since six months is barely anything in the hobby, holding off and saving up isn't a big deal. And there's nothing like the feeling of buying, building and painting up a whole force just a few months before a new codex and possibly updated models are shipped. That very thing has happened twice before with me and I'd like to avoid it happening again if I can.

​I'm very happy to read that the guard forum feels you have a solid book at the moment though, it's just this nagging feeling I have about the crazy fast release schedule and everything getting formations too.. Necrons Decurion looks very strong, and the upcoming Eldar changes just seem mental. Not the biggest issue for foot lists but tanks are going to get pummeled into the muck.