Fangbanger Posted May 7, 2015 Author Share Posted May 7, 2015 What are your thoughts on the deredeo compared to the venator? I know the venator is hands down anti tank,but with all the Lascanons, would I benfit more from a deredeo for the luxury of interceptor and skyfire? It also has the handy roll for sunder..... I would have to shave some points though if I wanted the carapace mounted launcher also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Looking at both rule sets, I'd have to say the dread seems like it has more of a use, and serves more of a purpose. The fact that it can fire at two different targets, and has the ability to fire a variety of powerful weapons, in addition, it's an amazing anti-air machine...the power of the other is something, but it only has one shot and can only target one thing, so i'd say gauge what you plan for it to do ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 7, 2015 Author Share Posted May 7, 2015 It has 2 ordenece shots which should be brutal for vehicles also for ring it to fire snap shots next turn if it takes a pen and can cause concussion so good for sniping primarchs. It is though, totally one dimensional. The dread has sunder which sounds ace, more shots (however lower strength and ap) as well as like you say, multiple target options though would need to shave some points elsewhere for this. I would happily take a fire raptor although I don't like the idea of waiting for it Does anyone have any gaming experience with any of them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Flint had some really good points on the fire raptor and its worth, I changed my list around, dropping the red butchers in my list for a fire raptor, and a deredeo. The shift really seems to balance out the list, just a thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 Hmmmmm....that is a thought actually.... But a squad of butchers on the charge are 25 attacks and have 2 wounds, fnp and generally going to be hitting in 3's. That just seems way to good to pass up for a list revolving around cc. Definatley going to have a little play around with list ideas again though with your advice in mind How has your list played so far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 As of now I have had to proxy most of the list, as I wait for the orders to come in, and as I test things left right and center lol. The thing I have found with the butchers is that, once you get them into combat, most of the time they destroy the unit they charge then are shot to hell before they have a chance to attack again...When I tried a recent test with a fire raptor it did a lot more damage than the butchers in the long run...then again my list has three 20 man close combat squads charging up the board while I shoot with the raptor and dread and the spartan...so they have a lot of targets to take care of and all are serving different purposes depending on how far in the game I am...most of the time people attack the dread and the spartan then my troops reach theirs and I destroy them...not too bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 Yours is a 3k list yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Mine is a 2k list, planning on moving up once I have it all assembled...But at that point i might consider to move on to taking butchers and another spartan...maybe lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 And you find foot slogging works? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 When you have a fire raptor, a deredeo, a spartan with Khârn in it, and two more foot sloggin units most of my opponents ignore the foot troops till they land in combat...my friends most of the time sacrifice a unit to try and kill my troops after combat, most of the time with the games ive been seeing recently people are hell bent to take out the spartan then the dread and ignore the foots till they arrive, which is epic lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 The problem with that tactic is pie plates I guess. Especially at 2250 Id be worried about seeing typhons with foot sloggers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 Will say I have seen that a few times, I spread out and use cover where I can, but one of our local players is all iron hands and pie plates me, but "normally" I can destroy or pre occupy the tank before it does tooooo much damage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 Just remember to put your footsloggers behind LOS blocking terrain since a typhon has ignores cover on its gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 I don't think I could bring myself to march them up the board. I think I'm going to keep the threat of the Spartans to deliver them and just smash them through. After they drop them off, I'm thinking they can act as a shield after the tacs whipe out a unit to keep them safe... I'm leaning towards the venator too, although I love the raptor, I think I have enough anti infantry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 I mean i'd say proxy test it and see what comes of it, I do like the idea of two spartans too...issue for me is the money hahahaha they're expensive...however so are raptors lol...and troops...and my whole army lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 Curse Forgeworld and there beutiful yet expensive toys! I think it just comes down to what I will be up against and as I have no idea, it's just a bit of a gamble. I feel with the venator though that if I have a tank to deal with, I can and the Lascanons can be anti air if needed or just ignore it all together. Having only 4 models on the board with 3 units is a bit of a worry but hey, no guts, no glory! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 Yeah exactly, damn forgeworld lol, but yeah I mean thats why I went with so many units, to increase opponents options...cause the only thing i worrry about with your list that I can see is if someone is really shooty heavy they take out the two tanks and youre in serious trouble lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flint13 Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 I don't think I could bring myself to march them up the board. I think I'm going to keep the threat of the Spartans to deliver them and just smash them through. After they drop them off, I'm thinking they can act as a shield after the tacs whipe out a unit to keep them safe... I'm leaning towards the venator too, although I love the raptor, I think I have enough anti infantry Much like Night Lords, the XII rarely wants for anti-infantry. A venator would do you a lot of good. It is invaluable in stun-locking super heavies, especially those with super pie plates that are exactly the type of thing that gives the XII infantry waves trouble. In the Australian Heresy championship event from a couple weeks back, I believe it was 3 of the top 5 of the list-roster included a single Venator if that sways you any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 Was that the Anzac cup yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 Yeah exactly, damn forgeworld lol, but yeah I mean thats why I went with so many units, to increase opponents options...cause the only thing i worrry about with your list that I can see is if someone is really shooty heavy they take out the two tanks and youre in serious trouble lol I think I would have to be pretty damn unlucky to have 2 Spartans taken out before reaching the front lines. Not saying it can't happen, but very difficult to do. Also a standard raider is tough to shift in its own right. Thanks for the comments thus far guys, helps a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nookie Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 Yeah exactly, damn forgeworld lol, but yeah I mean thats why I went with so many units, to increase opponents options...cause the only thing i worrry about with your list that I can see is if someone is really shooty heavy they take out the two tanks and youre in serious trouble lol I think I would have to be pretty damn unlucky to have 2 Spartans taken out before reaching the front lines. Not saying it can't happen, but very difficult to do. Also a standard raider is tough to shift in its own right. Thanks for the comments thus far guys, helps a lot Oh absolutely agree on both dying before they at least see some combat, just saying is something to watch out for when there are only three targets...just a thought lol But Flint thats a really good idea as to ideas of lists, love the suggestion there, anywhere that has the lists? Or coverage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flint13 Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 That was indeed the Anzac cup. I'll see if I can find a record of army lists. In the mean time, here's the army gallery http://imgur.com/gallery/mM1Rk and just for fun, the game gallery. http://imgur.com/a/WeUAm It just came up on Episode 10 of the Eye of Horus podcast. One of the EoH bros even mentions that he thought Typhons were just going to poo all over everything but he saw a bunch of Venators just locking everything super heavy down. *EDIT* Yep, four armies had Venators that I can see. A ton of Iron Warriors too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 10, 2015 Author Share Posted May 10, 2015 Yeah I listened to that also, great and light hearted yet the guys know what they are talking about. And lots of swearing which is a big bonus! No world eaters at the Anzac which is a shame....I guess we are just not competative enough! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triacom Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 This is just my two cents but I don't think you should write of World Eaters so quickly, I think they could be very competitive as a shooting army that has the option of falling back on close combat, rather than an army that relies on it. I used to play Black Templars (still do, but with the older rulebook and less often) and I've generally found that getting the enemy to come to you in some way (wipe out transports, deepstrike next to objectives) worked out really well even when my BT's were FAQ'd to get rage, much like what the current World Eaters have and I still won the majority of games I played with them because people really weren't expecting mid-long ranged units to also be good at close combat. Let's look at this another way, if you have a 20 man tactical squad with extra close combat weapons, they can move up the board to objectives, firing away at far off enemies, when anybody comes close you use Fury of the Legion with your Bolt Pistols then charge into close combat giving you +2 Attacks on the enemy (+3 attacks on them if they don't have two close combat weapons), quite a huge advantage especially if your enemy is distracted by Heavy Support Squads blowing up their Medusa's (or just a distraction Vindicator, people love to focus on those things) to care about the tactical squad that can also dish out the pain as if it was a dedicated close combat squad. Even if somebody deepstrikes/infiltrates next to your Heavy Support Squads you could just charge anyway as you'll still receive a pretty big boost to your attacks (set up the Sergeant right and he'll have 5 attacks with a power axe), and if you wanted to you could even try baiting this sort of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 13, 2015 Author Share Posted May 13, 2015 i think theres some good points you have made. turn up with a WE army people are expecting you to come at them but surprise! you have plenty of dakka to deal with instead! thing is, the reason i choose the eaters was to get up in someones grill with a load of chain axes, combat buffs and multiple attacks in a raged frenzy......;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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