++From Hatred We Were Born, Creation of a 7.5 Chaos Codex++

[Teetengee]

reverted arch-heretics to just crusader+hatred, as it was too strong in such a close combat oriented army as it was, so much so that it didn't make much sense to choose any other close combat oriented warp legacy

[Teetengee]

removed the force org shifting for thousand sons from traitors and heretics, and replaced the change cult with the fire cult

[Teetengee]

removed the baleflamer arms options from fiends as more than one such shot seems particularly dangerous to allow on the chassis.

[Khornestar]

I think one is good enough. I can see why 3 could be sorta ridiculous. One template is usually enough to kill most of a 3+ armor save unit. With 3 I bet 2 clumped up units would be done for.

 

Mouthflamer + 2 fists is how I'd run them, anyhow. Versatile, threatens anything on the ground.

[Teetengee]

My thoughts exactly.

[Teetengee]

removed the ability to take more than one baleflamer in a unit of helbrutes or preds
This restricts baleflamers so they can only get one in a force org slot.

EDIT: Made it so that baleful aberration won't work on models locked in close combat, since the tzeentch dex allows a nonvehicle model to potentially get this rule.

[Teetengee]

as I create the god specific dexes, I have decided to remove the god specific special characters from the codex and replace them with one each from the undivided/undecided/unaffiliated legions
These will be
Exodus

Hidden Content

HQ: Exodus

 

Exodus________________160 Points

WS 6

BS 8

S 4

T 4

W 3

I 4

A 2

Ld 10

Sv 3+

Unit Composition: 1 Exodus (Infantry, Character, Unique)

Wargear:
Power Armour

Exitus Rifle

Exitus Pistol

Frag Grenades

Krak Grenades

Melta-bomb
Aura of Dark Glory
 

Special Rules:

Warp Legacy (Tongues of the Serpent)

Independent Character

Stubborn
Veterans of the Long War (already added in)
Shrouded
Scout
Infiltrate

Deadshot

Move Through Cover

No Escape

 

Exitus Rifle: S: X; AP: 2; Range: 72”; Heavy 1, Sniper, Exitus Ammunition, Ignores Cover

Exitus Pistol: S: X; AP: 2; Range: 12”; Pistol, Sniper, Exitus Ammunition, Ignores Cover

Exitus Ammunition: Each time this weapon is fired you choose one ammunition type from the following list for it to fire:
Hellfire Round: Fleshbane

Shieldbreaker Round: Ignores Invulnerable saves.

Turbo-penetrator Round: S: 10 against vehicles and any unsaved wound it deals is multiplied into D3 wounds.

 

Deadshot: All successful To Hit rolls made by this model except for Snap Shots, have the Precision Shots special rule.

No Escape: Enemy characters suffer a -2 penalty on their Look Out, Sir tests against any wounds inflicted by a model with this special rule.

Erebus

Hidden Content

HQ: Erebus

Erebus___________________250 Points

WS 7

BS 5

S 4

T 4

W 4

I 5

A 4

Ld 10

Sv 2+

Unit Composition: 1 Erebus (Infantry, Character, Unique)

Wargear:
Daemon Armour

Plasma Pistol

Master-crafted Power Maul

Sigil of Corruption

Personal Icon

Frag Grenades

Krak Grenades
 

Special Rules:

Warp Legacy (Heralds of the Dark Gods)

Stubborn

Independent Character

Beseech the Dark Gods (Counts as Black Chaplain)

Demagogue (Counts as Black Chaplain)

Zealot

Fear

Harbinger of Chaos

Adamantium Will

Veterans of the Long War (already added in)
Psyker Level 1 (Must roll on Biomancy or Telepathy)
 

Harbinger of Chaos: A detachment containing Erebus may take up to one Troops unit it could normally take as a unit of Horrors, Bloodletters, Plague Bearers, or Daemonettes instead.

[iron Warriors Warsmith]
[Night Lords Jump Lord]

[Khornestar]

as I create the god specific dexes, I have decided to remove the god specific special characters from the codex and replace them with one each from the undivided/undecided/unaffiliated legions

These will be

Exodus

Hidden Content

HQ: Exodus

 

Exodus________________140 Points

WS 6

BS 8

S 4

T 4

W 2

I 4

A 2

Ld 10

Sv 3+

Unit Composition: 1 Exodus (Infantry, Character, Unique)

Wargear:

Power Armour

Exitus Rifle

Exitus Pistol

Frag Grenades

Krak Grenades

Melta-bomb

 

Special Rules:

Warp Legacy (Tongues of the Serpent)

Independent Character

Stubborn

Veterans of the Long War (already added in)

Shrouded

Scout

Infiltrate

Deadshot

Move Through Cover

No Escape

 

Exitus Rifle: S: X; AP: 2; Range: 72”; Heavy 1, Sniper, Exitus Ammunition, Ignores Cover

Exitus Pistol: S: X; AP: 2; Range: 12”; Pistol, Sniper, Exitus Ammunition, Ignores Cover

Exitus Ammunition: Each time this weapon is fired you choose one ammunition type from the following list for it to fire:

Hellfire Round: Fleshbane

Shieldbreaker Round: Ignores Invulnerable saves.

Turbo-penetrator Round: S: 10 against vehicles and any unsaved wound it deals is multiplied into D3 wounds.

 

Deadshot: All successful To Hit rolls made by this model except for Snap Shots, have the Precision Shots special rule.

No Escape: Enemy characters suffer a -2 penalty on their Look Out, Sir tests against any wounds inflicted by a model with this special rule.

Erebus

Hidden Content

HQ: Erebus

Erebus___________________250 Points

WS 7

BS 5

S 4

T 4

W 4

I 5

A 4

Ld 10

Sv 2+

Unit Composition: 1 Erebus (Infantry, Character, Unique)

Wargear:

Daemon Armour

Plasma Pistol

Master-crafted Power Maul

Sigil of Corruption

Personal Icon

Frag Grenades

Krak Grenades

 

Special Rules:

Warp Legacy (Heralds of the Dark Gods)

Stubborn

Independent Character

Beseech the Dark Gods (Counts as Black Chaplain)

Demagogue (Counts as Black Chaplain)

Zealot

Fear

Harbinger of Chaos

Adamantium Will

Veterans of the Long War (already added in)

Psyker Level 1 (Must roll on Biomancy or Telepathy)

 

Harbinger of Chaos: A detachment containing Erebus may take up to one Troops unit it could normally take as a unit of Horrors, Bloodletters, Plague Bearers, or Daemonettes instead.

[iron Warriors Warsmith]

[Night Lords Jump Lord]

 

Neato, I like 'em. I'm of the mind that some sort of anti-psyker is still called for, assassin-style or otherwise, but what you have so far is an awesome start. Chaos assassins ftw.

[Teetengee]

I figured the Helm of Martial Disdain and Brass Collars from the Khorne Book were good enough for anti-psyker. Especially since you can always come the apoc a culexus in if you really need it.

Eventually their may be a heretek constucted assassin type deal for chaos, but I will have to think on that one.

[Lagrath]

Since the KDK and Tau codexes make me worry that CSM won't get the across-the-board points reductions we badly need (unlike Eldar, lolz balance), I am wondering what formations you could use to make the units viable despite the steep costs. Especially for Plague Marines.

 

I think it would be cool to do a formation where you get better bonuses the more units of PMs you take, as the corruption and infection they bring to the battlefield becomes more potent the more PMs there are.

 

For example:

 

Virulent Senses: Those loyal to the Lord of Decay can sense the myriad diseases and viruses imbedded within their foes. If this formation fields two or more units of Plague Marines, all Plague Marine units in this formation gain Acute Senses.

 

Cloud of Flies: The skies become darkened as tiny daemonic insects congregate around Nurgle's mortal followers. If this formation fields three or more units of Plague Marines, all Plague Marine units in this formation gain Shrouded.

 

Rites of Decay: The weapons of Nurgle's followers have been infused with sorcery of the most corrupt kind. If this formation fields four or more units of Plague Marines, all Plague Marine units in this formation gain Poison for their bolters and all Plague Knives in this formation wound even Gargantuan Monstrous Creatures on a 4+ (instead of the regular 6+).

[Teetengee]

I like the ideas, although at least the Acute Senses one might need a little work (unless you are paying for them to get outflank separately.).

[Lagrath]

Most GW formations have at least 1 special rule that is of mediocre or situational benefit! I am just trying to be authentic haha.

[Teetengee]

Entertaining I suppose, but keep in mind I am completely rewriting the codices (and will eventually move on to the other dexes once chaos is more or less complete) so I don't necessarily have to keep to all GWs traditions (particularly since they don't themselves!).

[Teetengee]

I have added an icon to the front page of each codex to ease identification. I don't think any of you will need explanation as to which is which ;)

[Teetengee]

Teaser:

FORTIFICATION: Plague Forest: 35 points.

Unit Composition: 1 Plague Forest (Battlefield Debris)

Terrain Type: Difficult Terrain approximately 5” in diameter

Wargear:
None

Access Points & Fire Points:

None

Special Rules:

Chaos Faction(Nurgle)

Dense Thicket

Plague-Ridden

Coat In Slime

Options:

May take up to 2 additional sections of Plague Forest at +25 points each. Each piece of the set after the first must be placed within 6” of a piece that has already been set up.

The entire set may take items from the Obstacles and Battlements & Battlefield lists from Stronghold Assault as if a single piece of terrain.

Dense Thicket: Models on the base of a Plague Forest receive a 5+ cover save, regardless of whether or not they are 25% obscured.

Plague-Ridden: The Plague Forest counts as dangerous terrain, and if any model takes an unsaved wound from a dangerous terrain test caused by a Plague Forest, then that model’s unit counts as having taken an unsaved wound from a weapon with the Rad Contamination rule.

Coat In Slime: Any model in a Plague Forest during the movement phase of any turn may treat all close combat weapons as Poisoned(4+) for the remainder of the turn. Additionally, any emplaced weapon inside a Plague Forest treats all of its shots as having the Rad Contamination and Poisoned(4+) rules.

[Khornestar]

No immunity for Nurgle units using it as cover?

[Teetengee]

No immunity for Nurgle units using it as cover?

maybe, I haven't decided yet

[Khornestar]

I forget what rad contamination does. -1T?

 

Depending on whether or not you have gun emplacement options in addition to quad guns and icarus lascannons that could be a good rule. Even a heavy bolter with poison 4+ could be decent. On AA guns those rules will only matter against 'nids and daemons (and now the coldstar) but at S7 and S9 poisoned doesn't matter.

 

I think otherwise ruins will end up being better for non-vehicle nurgle daemons since they'll get a 2+. Of course, you can't really guarantee ruins will be where you want them to be and 3+ is still great. And then if cultists are camping an objective in the nurgle woods are getting charged by anything t4 or better their attacks will kick ass with poisoned. But still, dangerous terrain makes the whole thing kinda iffy. Of course an ADL gives a better cover save, should that be the only concern.

 

Stationary vehicles could benefit, but then they may as well use an ADL and get a 4+ since vehicles wouldn't get any benefits aside from a cover save with this fortification.

 

Maybe a rule called "poisoned arsenal/cache/whatever" which grants any unit occupying the fortification poisoned 4+ for ranged and melee weapons and gives them defensive grenades would make it a little better given the reduced movement distance and chance to take wounds. Then even against T8 GMC stuff like bolters have a chance at putting in some work, but with 6 to wound, 3+ saves, and FNP that is in no way an overpowered buff. It's sort of a rule with limited uses even at 4+.

 

Perhaps have a "rotten cauldron catapult" gun emplacement option with small blast poisoned 2+ ignores cover would be neat.

 

I dunno, just some ideas.

[darkseren1ty]

Have you guys created a couple units that are absolutely useless and/or overpriced? It won't be a proper codex until we have at least 2-3 units like that.

[Teetengee]

Have you guys created a couple units that are absolutely useless and/or overpriced? It won't be a proper codex until we have at least 2-3 units like that.

Um... that would defeat the whole purpose, although if you throw all the available upgrades on a unit of chosen it will be way too expensive.

 

Alllllthoooouugh: Part of me wants to charge half cost for the weapons upgrades for skullcrushers as they get *realllly* expensive really quickly. Although maybe the answer is just throw a darkaxe and a darkmaul in the unit with two-three stormshields and just be sad that chainaxes are 8 each on them. idk, thoughts?

 

As for the plague forest, I will do some more thinking on it, but I figured they are more to be used as board control/deepstrike deterrent in their current form. I am worried poisoned on ranged attacks might be too powerful.

[Khornestar]

I think in general poisoned is scarier on paper than in gameplay. That's in my experience, anyhow. Plague Marines wounding my bikers/spawn on 4's instead of 5's, Dark Eldar wounding my Daemon Prince on 4's instead of 6's - and that one is only strong as the result of nearly the entire enemy army having poisoned shots, though the prince still survived.

 

Something like autogun cultist spam could be powerful, but considering the player still has to pay for the fortification and any possible upgrades to it, it is perhaps equivalent to the amount of points spent on additional units in place of the fortification. Maybe, can't say for sure, depends on many factors obviously. Anyway, just my musings. 

[Teetengee]

I added some mark of tzeentch tokens to the tzeentch book so that it makes it easier to keep track of those rerolls.

Just flip them all to the colour side at the beginning of your turn, and flip them to the grey side when you use the reroll.

[Teetengee]

Dropped the seize the initiative bonus from Forbidden Knowledge as it was too much on an already powerful warp legacy.
Increased Pink Horrors by 2ppm due to playtesting having them come out just a bit too efficient.
Changed rampant mutation's third ability to only give a 5++ or +2 to an existing invuln save in light of the Mutant Rabble formation.

[Warsmith Demetrios]

Love what you guys are doing with this project, definitely going to be the rules I use once my Iron Warriors are complete. Keep up the good work!

[Teetengee]

Thank you, that means a lot to me to know the work is really appreciated.

 

Also, some pretty big changes. Dropped torrent from baleflamer, decreased cost of it all over, decreased some other costs of predator weapons. Additionally, added equipment fuel relay, which turns template weapons into torrent. Gave fuel relay to the baleflamer on drakes, hellcrawlers, and land raiders. (also the scorpion's twin linked baleflamer.
Also reduced phosphor cannons to one shot and removed torrent, but gave vindicators who select them two of them with fuel relays