Spiral Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I've spent several days reading the Codex and BRB getting a handle on all the rules changes since fourth. I think I have a basic grasp on things. As I understand it, using the Deathwing Strike Force will get me tabled automatically, so I need to pair them with a secondary detachment, either Allies or from the Dark Angels Codex. So my question is what are people's recommendations for the "on table" force?The options I have considered so far are: "Ravenwing Attack Squadron" would aid the Teleport assault of my Deathwing, but would not allow me to bring any additional Dreadnoughts to the field. "Battle Demi-Company" which would bulk me up on Tactical Marines (and Dreadnoughts) but gobble up most of my points. What I mostly want from the on table force is to be able to take some Contemptor Dreadnoughts (from Forgeworld) and to make sure SOMETHING is still standing so on Turn 2 I can shock-and-awe with the Deathwing. Is there some other army I could use as allies? Or is the best bet to use Ravenwing and give up on the Dreads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Why not a combined arms detachment?Then you can have ravenwing for scatter mitigation, tacs for some backfield, and contemptors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Or a cad and attack squad? Or even the amazing support squad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I like using a attack squad and a support squad to fill in other gaps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostrael Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I tried an attack squad +Ravenwing strike force + Deathwing strike force. Only the attack squad was there in the first round. So my opponent nearly wiped me out in the first round. I was a bit careless. Both other forces came in the second turn and all went as planed. It can work if you play only with an attack squad, but keep some units out of range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larhendiel Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 5 Landspeeders, naked they cost 250 points plus darkshroud for their reisilience. Benefit: Anti-grav 6" upwash Your enemy has 6 AV10 models with re-rollalbe 3+ jink save turn one. Your enemy has deathwing termies right in front of him but in order to charge them he first must live through 6 heavy bolters overwatching at him, and they also have grim resolve, strafing run and interceptor. The perfect toolbox support for deathwing. But requires buylng lots of speeders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Jink is 2+ for the support squad and ravenshield can only be used for ravenwing units not deathwing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twopounder Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Jink is 2+ for the support squad and ravenshield can only be used for ravenwing units not deathwing At which point it just ravenshields itself but still provides stealth protection and medium range firepower to deathwing units. Plus terminators can assault without being overwatched and a bad fear roll can ruin your opponent's day real fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Still not sure the intention is that support squad can overwatch for itself. All depends on definition of friendly units. I can see both sides of the argument but until it is faqed I'm playing it to my disadvantage. The rest of your points are totally valid and for that reason the support squad is definitely worth taking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twopounder Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Still not sure the intention is that support squad can overwatch for itself. All depends on definition of friendly units. I can see both sides of the argument but until it is faqed I'm playing it to my disadvantage. The rest of your points are totally valid and for that reason the support squad is definitely worth taking If you want to argue intentions I can destroy any army list you want and turn it to ash. Better to follow the rules than worry about intent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 So ya...a single bike squad, a support squad, and the DWSF. I'm actually thinking of adding a vendread for turn 1 drop pod too which would add something else on the table for a distraction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Ravenshield says they can overwatch any Ravenwing unit being assaulted They are a Ravenwing unit If you want the Terminators to get supporting Ravenshield Fire pop Sammael with them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 It says any friendly unit but im not here to argue. To maximise deathwing i started a 2000 point game with just a ravenwing assault squad on the table. Turn one was terrifying! But thanks to jink i only lost two bikes even though I had pulled them forward. 1700 points of dw dropped mostly in the 24" bubble on turn two and the tables were turned. Not a tactic ill be using a lot but was still a lot of fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HandofAnubis Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 It says any friendly unit but im not here to argue. To maximise deathwing i started a 2000 point game with just a ravenwing assault squad on the table. Turn one was terrifying! But thanks to jink i only lost two bikes even though I had pulled them forward. 1700 points of dw dropped mostly in the 24" bubble on turn two and the tables were turned. Not a tactic ill be using a lot but was still a lot of fun That is interesting, why would they be able to overwatch for others and not themselves? I would be curious to see what comes of this, and honestly I had not even thought about them overwatching for themselves. Ravenshield says they can overwatch any Ravenwing unit being assaulted They are a Ravenwing unit If you want the Terminators to get supporting Ravenshield Fire pop Sammael with them This is a very interesting thought. Would be kinda strange getting this set up and would hinder Sammies movement... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HandofAnubis Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I've spent several days reading the Codex and BRB getting a handle on all the rules changes since fourth. I think I have a basic grasp on things. As I understand it, using the Deathwing Strike Force will get me tabled automatically, so I need to pair them with a secondary detachment, either Allies or from the Dark Angels Codex. So my question is what are people's recommendations for the "on table" force? The options I have considered so far are: "Ravenwing Attack Squadron" would aid the Teleport assault of my Deathwing, but would not allow me to bring any additional Dreadnoughts to the field. "Battle Demi-Company" which would bulk me up on Tactical Marines (and Dreadnoughts) but gobble up most of my points. What I mostly want from the on table force is to be able to take some Contemptor Dreadnoughts (from Forgeworld) and to make sure SOMETHING is still standing so on Turn 2 I can shock-and-awe with the Deathwing. Is there some other army I could use as allies? Or is the best bet to use Ravenwing and give up on the Dreads? I have been looking at this as well lately. It would be interesting to have the Hammer of Caliban formation sitting on the field for turn one. Bare bones with whirlwinds is jus above 500 points. Not sure it would work as well as going with RW from a Synergy perspective, but the LR would help to keep the unit alive at least a turn for sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarFromSam Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Blob some ig with a fearless hq. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 It says any friendly unit but im not here to argue. To maximise deathwing i started a 2000 point game with just a ravenwing assault squad on the table. Turn one was terrifying! But thanks to jink i only lost two bikes even though I had pulled them forward. 1700 points of dw dropped mostly in the 24" bubble on turn two and the tables were turned. Not a tactic ill be using a lot but was still a lot of fun That is interesting, why would they be able to overwatch for others and not themselves? I would be curious to see what comes of this, and honestly I had not even thought about them overwatching for themselves. Ravenshield says they can overwatch any Ravenwing unit being assaulted They are a Ravenwing unit If you want the Terminators to get supporting Ravenshield Fire pop Sammael with them This is a very interesting thought. Would be kinda strange getting this set up and would hinder Sammies movement... Why couldn't they overwatch for themselves? I don't know, why can't other vehicles? All im saying is that the wording of the rule isn't clear enough for my liking so rather than argue with my gaming group I'll play it to my disadvantage until we get an faq. I'm not saying I'm right and everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Sam with terminators or knights lets them run and charge further. Definitely worth trying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Other vehicles cannot because vehicles (except walkers) are not allowed to fire overwatch in the BRB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 No, yeah i know why they can't due to the rules but where is the logic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Oh, because it takes too long to bring the weapons to bear because of the mounting systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Agreed . So why would that not apply to the support squad? Look, arguments can be made for both interpretations and everyone will have to follow what works for them until an faq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HandofAnubis Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Agreed . So why would that not apply to the support squad? Look, arguments can be made for both interpretations and everyone will have to follow what works for them until an faq I agree with you Jazz. I was merely pointing out the irony that they can use it for others but not themselves even though most vehicles cannot do it at all. I can understand not being able to bring the weapons to bear for say a LS Typhoon's missle launchers, but what about the heavy bolters and such that are manned by a gunner? Could use an faq for sure. I just find it interesting is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayJ Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 If psychic power that target friendly units can be cast on the psyker or his unit, how is a support squad o erwatching for itself any different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Agreed . So why would that not apply to the support squad? -snip- I have no idea, except maybe ravenwing weaponry is quicker to bring to bear/ ravenwing users are just better at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzhands Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I know you are right about the psychic powers and as I said I can see both sides However... I don't want to spend my time arguing with opponents, i want to play the game. If i play the rule to my disadvantage then when it gets an faq either i lose nothing or gain a huge bonus. If the people you play have house ruled it then its all good either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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