Aethyran Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Hey guys I was looking into some Admech (don't hurt me) to add to my Guard as allies but came across this: http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Battlegroup-HammerblowSo us Mech players can rejoice?! Can't quite make out what it says...need higher resolution lolFrom another source the formation is: Restrictions: Infantry PLT must consist of 1 PCS and 2-5 squads. The CCS and all units in the Infantry PLT must be given a Chimera as a DT. Advance and Hold: infantry units in the battlegroup have Objective Secured and Stubborn. Close Range Fire Support: the Baneblade and LR Squadron have the twin-linked special rule as long as the targeted unit is within 12" of friendly models from the formation. Rapid Response: Scions must/may begin game embarked on Valkyrie. Instead of making Reserve rolls... (can't read)... Deep Strike will not scatter within 12" of the Battlegroup's Scout Sentinel Squad. Tough to make out but it sounds like a turn-of-your-choosing and/or no-scatter mechanic for reserves and DS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
librisrouge Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 That actually isn't that bad and is very tempting. Four, or more, chimeras worth of units gives a lot of TL action to four, or more, tanks. All of these are things I'd be tempted to take anyway and gives me a reason to field scout sentinels, which I've shied away from recently. Plus, it retains ObSec, even though I'm not in a CAD, so I'm not suffering any real lose by taking the formation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommissarHughes Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 The lack of veterans disappoints me, but yes. All the yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emicus Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Oh. 1 down 9 formations to go, I hope the other ones are better than this piece of #$%! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
librisrouge Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Oh. 1 down 9 formations to go, I hope the other ones are better than this piece of #$%! Nope. This isn't in Montka, it's Pay For Play from the GW webstore. We're still 0/10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emicus Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Ah I see. Thanks for clearing that up! I do not see any appeal for this formation. You give Chimeras to a bunch of regular guardsmen in order to hand them obsec (which you could get anyway) and stubborn. But for single Guardman units they're going to cave regardless of stubborn or not. And it wont be a decent mobile bunker as with Veterans because you get diddly for useful special weapons.As for the twin-linking of tanks, you need to have models within 12". 12"!!! And the tanks are bleeding squadroned!On top of everything else the formation is so bloated it's an army unto itself and nothing you can slot in/add to/work with.______________________________________________________________________________________Compare this to the skyhammer pay2win formation... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Hilarious that this is already sold out. Whatever, bring on the next Campaign book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emicus Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Maybe they only made five :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Does it give a saving over buying individually? A good selection of models for any fledgling Guard army but while it has some nice rules I agree that as a formation it doesn't seem amazing. I suppose the Platoon can stick near the tanks to protect them and give them that TL, but it's a large formation that eats points like there's no tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phubar Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Infantry chimeras have the purpose of getting close (12") to enemy valuable targets so Bane and LR can TL against them. Enemy has to waste shoots of 2 units per chimera in order to erase that threat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emicus Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 If it works for you, I works for you:) to me driving anything that close to the enemy just means I give it away for free. Sure I get 1 turn of twin-linking but I've still given away 200 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phubar Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 I think about inf squads as neat shields or target dummies, i play them in this way. If enemy shoots at platoons it doesnt shoot at LR or wiverns or ccs :) Four obj sec units close to enemy points are not bad even if they survive only a turn. TLing Bane and a couple of LR (bt ir vanqui) could remove a lot of enemy offensive power. I have to try thus formation but i think it can work. Oh and dont forget sentinels outflanking and scions not scattering near them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 The issue there is guns that want to shoot at infantry usually can't touch a Russ so is doesn't quite work. Escorting infantry protect the tanks by shooting down closing enemies or preventing their assault by either getting in the way or counter assaulting themselves so they're still useful, just won't be diluting the enemy's AT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emicus Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 And giving the opponent free movement by allowing him to charge :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 Hmm...does it have to be a baneblade, or can it be a variant? Shadowsword with all the lickies and chewies FTMFW...and if I can get those four lascannons twinlinked, KACHING! I already tend to run chimeras paired with veteran squads with nothing but an autocannon (forward sentries+ruins=a really survivable BS4 autocannon), so making that three BS3 autocannons fired from the hatch isn't too terribly much of a downgrade. I just won't be able to use them as mobile objective scorers (which I routinely do with the veterans' empty chimeras), they'll just have to be sitting back and dumping 8 BS3 shots downrange behind AV12. Acceptable. Tank squadron?...kinda blows...can't think of too many russ variants that I want to be shooting three of at a single target...I wonder if there's room to make it a command squadron so I can split three tanks across two targets? That would be nice...failing that, there's a bit of overkill guaranteed unless you're doing three vanquishers, but they'd stay at long range, rather than serving as the unit providing the 12" service to the baneblade...on the other hand, three twinlinked vanquisher cannons...tasty! Scout sentinels, fine...105 points, and done. Stormtroopers, okay, two meltaguns and done. Valkyrie gets rocket pods, so it's not a waste. The fundamental problem that I have here is that all of the best choices revolve around ways to get some nasty twinlinked long range antitank....and damned little to actually get within 12" of the target to provide the 12" service....until the valk arrives, that is. That valkyrie is basically a flying markerlight, lol. Outflank the sentinels, take four lascannons on the baneblade and take three vanquishers. Keep everything back. No real need for the stormtroopers to get out until and unless you need to engage three targets with twinlinked lascannon/vanquisher fire at the same time... This is a ton of points, but with both sponson sets on the superheavy and three vanquishers with hull lascannons, you potentially have seven godhammers and three twinlinked vanquisher cannons, plus the superheavy's main gun(s). The massive problem here is that it costs like 1700 points, so you're not going to be pairing this with another detachment, except maybe an assassin or a miniature inquisitorial warband. That's 100% attributable to a baneblade eating 1/3 of your points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 This actually doesn't sound too bad, given that it's doing a little bit of everything. It seems more like it's meant to be a core formation, around which you build the rest of your army. I need to use an officer of the fleet more often so I can manipulate my reserves so I can get my Stormies on the board quicker. Based on this information I'd be hesitant to take this because of the points sunk into big toys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted November 24, 2015 Share Posted November 24, 2015 Hmm...Taking the formation as I described it, adding in a culexus...put the culexus in the valkyrie (assuming the stormtroopers are allowed to deepstrike instead, and further assuming that the valk is fast attack, not a dedicated transport), unmask the enemy invisi-star from the safety of the sky, then blast it with seven godhammers, three twinlinked vanquisher cannons, and a volcano cannon (not in that order). Boom, proton torpedo down the thermal exhaust port! /edit/ Overall, I don't think this is a basis for starting a guard army or even list from scratch...but if it's similar to what you're already running, it's worth thinking about adapting your list to this formation in order to gain the special rules. I think the biggest hurdle is the superheavy tank's points cost...As Terminus mentioned in another thread, (especially relative to the cost of a knight), superheavy tanks just cost too many points, and I would add too great a percentage of your points budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted November 24, 2015 Share Posted November 24, 2015 Overall, I don't think this is a basis for starting a guard army or even list from scratch...but if it's similar to what you're already running, it's worth thinking about adapting your list to this formation in order to gain the special rules. I think the biggest hurdle is the superheavy tank's points cost...As Terminus mentioned in another thread, (especially relative to the cost of a knight), superheavy tanks just cost too many points, and I would add too great a percentage of your points budget. I think you're right, but it could be fun to do. Formations seem to be more about fluff than competitive rules, though some formations lend themselves to competition more than others. This seems like it would cost way too many points, and would likely just be your list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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