[HH1.0] Thousand Sons tactica

[sturguard]

 

Again, what we are failing to realize is a different writer is handling each faction in the book so that is why there are always issues with consistency in wording. For all we know as Black Orange states, the Cabana boy might have actually written the rules. We can't have it both ways, GW pushing material out every week and expecting that top writers are doing all their content, I wouldnt be surprised at all to find out there are new guys and less experienced guys writing stuff all the time. However, the rules have always been inconsistent and poorly written since the early 1990's when I first started, nothing has changed in that regard (even when they produced content every few months instead of every few weeks).

 

The FW team is small enough that we actually have a good idea of who did what. That and they're pretty accessible at events, so, y'know, you could just ask who wrote what, or have someone ask for you if you can't make it. But the rules do tend to come down to Alan Bligh for the most part, and until recently Andy Hoare, before he started working on Adeptus Titanicus.

 

Were the various fluff sections of Inferno written by different authors? Yes. But also still by the same core writers that are involved with most FW stuff (so Alan Bligh, Neil Wylie, now John French and previously Andy Hoare). Again, FW is a small, tight team. Billy the Intern doesn't come in to the meeting room and start scrawling all over the whiteboard with his crazy ideas. There is no intern even submitting draft pages. It's a tiny team of people who are probably a little overworked between writing fluff and rules testing a complex system, and who probably need an editor. 

 

 

I think you would be surprised. Ideas may come from Alan, but I would suspect the implementation is left to plenty of others otherwise you wouldn't get the contradictions and language issues the way we do (as the alternative would be one guy is doing most of the work and doesn't really care about consistency at all). Although I was joking about Billy the intern, I do think there are more peoples hands in the soup than probably should be- even hiring an editor wouldnt make a difference in most cases unless he knows what ever writer is thinking/meaning.

 

Again, I dont think it was FWs intent to let Sekhmet terminators choose their power in the sense that you actually pick. I think the intent of the word choose is that they are selected (and when I say selected I mean generated) from the Telekinesis/Pyromancy powers. Now, as far as  I know there are no grammatical issues with that section of the rules that an editor would fix and most likely they aren't going to know what the author meant rules wise. So really unless one guy writes all the rules you are always going to have these issues and since FW and GW have had these issues since the beginning of time, its unlikely it will ever change.

[sturguard]

 

Me, I am going to go with the FAQ's, I wouldnt even say I am a good player, I just dont need the crutch of having my termies have levitation every game.

You seem miffed enough about Sekhmet to post this in multiple threads and pump your fists in victory, so, huh...

 

Well go with the FAQs if it makes you happy, just make sure to inform your opponent that their Magnus can be literally immortal and that they should be some Chaos Spawn kits to model their Sekhmet's three arms

 

 

Let me ask you this, in all of 40k/30k rules, how many non IC units can choose their psychic powers? I can't think of any. Some may have powers chosen for them, some may gain an additional power, some may gain a reroll but I can't think of a single unit that can choose them (since GW has moved over to the rolling for psychic powers). Now it could certainly be that I am wrong, I am not up to date in all the newest formations but I think the answer would be zero.

 

Maybe I am totally off, but GW has set the policy that they want the randomness, and FW with its terminator rules have been adamant that Cataphractii terminators are supposed to be slow. So those two major rules points makes me believe that the intent was not for 1K Sons Cataphractii terminators to all be jump troops. I think people are just biased and want their armies to be as good as possible. Would losing the ability to chose your powers be so crucial to making the terminators good? Heck no, they would still be a top 5 terminator.

[Withershadow]

Those disciplines are awful, so while Zardu can select his,

I will choose mine. They are the most capable combat psykers of the Thousand Sons, who serve as Magnus' personal guard, they are not your average joe shmo psyker unit.

 

I think the general consensus to not use invisibility or novas with Magnus, or that they only get one CCW shows that people aren't just trying to reach for every advantage. But go ahead and continue to try to smear people who don't agree with you. At the end of the day, what is written is how I'm going to play it, and if you don't like it you can sit in the corner feeling smug moral superiority about it.

 

And while they will still be good, it will shut down several alternate builds, leaving you just with Raptora Cataphract spam.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Withershadow

[Mango Polo]

 

 

Me, I am going to go with the FAQ's, I wouldnt even say I am a good player, I just dont need the crutch of having my termies have levitation every game.

You seem miffed enough about Sekhmet to post this in multiple threads and pump your fists in victory, so, huh...

 

Well go with the FAQs if it makes you happy, just make sure to inform your opponent that their Magnus can be literally immortal and that they should be some Chaos Spawn kits to model their Sekhmet's three arms

 

 

Let me ask you this, in all of 40k/30k rules, how many non IC units can choose their psychic powers? I can't think of any. Some may have powers chosen for them, some may gain an additional power, some may gain a reroll but I can't think of a single unit that can choose them (since GW has moved over to the rolling for psychic powers). Now it could certainly be that I am wrong, I am not up to date in all the newest formations but I think the answer would be zero.

 

Maybe I am totally off, but GW has set the policy that they want the randomness, and FW with its terminator rules have been adamant that Cataphractii terminators are supposed to be slow. So those two major rules points makes me believe that the intent was not for 1K Sons Cataphractii terminators to all be jump troops. I think people are just biased and want their armies to be as good as possible. Would losing the ability to chose your powers be so crucial to making the terminators good? Heck no, they would still be a top 5 terminator.

 

You entirely missed the point.

 

The point being that FW customer support has never been a reliable source for rules interpretations and clarifications, that multiple answers provided are nonsensical and completely aberrant, and that if you take specific answers at face value you take all of them or none.

 

So let me ask: Triple-armed Sekhmet and Magnus wiggling his butt across the battlefield naked because there's nothing anyone can do about it, is that cool too? Because that's what you seem to want. Unless of course we've now come to the point where we cherry pick our answers? Delicious cherry picking, where we pick only what favors our world view.

 

As for design intent, we're talking about unique units. Unique units tend to have... unique rules that sometimes break existing rules. For example... harnessing on a 3+ or triggering perils on triple 6's. It's not up to the players to start double guessing design intent to then formulate rules adjustments and then try to pass it off as gospel.

 

"I think people are just biased and want their armies to be as good as possible."

I think people want their rules to be properly dealt with by the authors in an official FAQ and errata, not by someone on his lunch break who's primary job is dealing with store issues.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Mango Polo

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

sturguard the best thing to do is let it go... you aren't making any inroads here. You can play how you wish but don't expect others to follow suit.

[Marshal Loss]

How is it that every time FW drop an email bombshell like this, people take it seriously? I'm more than happy to dig up emails from a couple of years ago where a friend and I emailed about Zardu's powers on the same day and both received completely different verdicts. :P

 

 

Magnus wiggling his butt across the battlefield naked

 

 

I think this single line encapsulates the sheer power and majesty of the Crimson King better than anything I've ever read in BL fiction.

[Athrawes]

And this is why answers from FW email responses are meaningless, they contradict each other.

 

http://i1088.photobucket.com/albums/i327/nickfayette1/17361802_10154514023904001_6638120772818383122_n.jpg

 

http://i1088.photobucket.com/albums/i327/nickfayette1/17264717_10154514023909001_4323747755367376025_n.jpg

 

+++++

 

Please note, this is not me saying that Sekhmet getting to choose their powers is gospel, I'm using this response to show that FW rules email responses are nothing more than a helpful interpretation from the guy responding. Not indicative of a a FAQ inbound, and certainly not the final ruling. 

 

This is just another in a long line of contradictions from FW, because it's never the rules department responding. It is always just the guy answering emails trying to help by giving his impression of the answer to your question.

 

So please, leave your biases at the door, and just accept that these email "answers" are pretty much equivalent to some groups house rules.

[Charlo]

 

 

Magnus wiggling his butt across the battlefield naked

 

 

I believe this is how he finally approached Russ at the climax of Prospero... It's what got him so mad.

[Excessus]

 

What do you think, meltabombs still worth it on vets? They're pretty expensive and the vets are pretty expensive from the start with all those upgrades...

Edited March 21, 2017 by Slipstreams

[Withershadow]

 

25 points for a whole squad is at least worth some level of consideration, even if you only toss one per turn. It would definitely be an area where I trim points first if I needed them elsewhere however.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Slipstreams

[Angmarred]

I'd take a fist on the Sgt instead

[depthcharge12]

Has anyone considered running bikes/jetbikes with an arcana?

 

Command jetbike squad would be cool and you could pop on raptora with your combat shields for 4++/5++ or utilize Pavoni to help sweep units. Would make for a mobile killy unit.

[Charlo]

Yeah, having mobile Cataphracti would be pretty nice....

[Excessus]

Hmm, veterans in rhinos...Divination or Biomancy? Divination and they can buff people all over the place when they get out. Biomancy and they can shoot from within the vehicle...

[Angmarred]

Hmm, veterans in rhinos...Divination or Biomancy? Divination and they can buff people all over the place when they get out. Biomancy and they can shoot from within the vehicle...

I'd probably do Divination or Telepathy on shooty vets. Divination likely matches your cult and has a good primaris. Telepathy has a great primaris and if you rollI Invis, bonus

[NemoVonUtopia]

With the Achean-castelax being released soon, what is a good size for the unit? I was thinking 2, but I have doubts how effective just 2 would be but more seems overly expensive.

[Charlo]

With the Achean-castelax being released soon, what is a good size for the unit? I was thinking 2, but I have doubts how effective just 2 would be but more seems overly expensive.

 

They look bloody amazing too...

 

They seem to have beefed up the Force Weapon a little bit on the Osirion Dread too...!

 

[Mango Polo]

Nah, it's the exact same one we saw at the weekender (and was shown on the WHC blog). The picture's of better quality and now we can see the details on the blade.

 

For the Castellax-Achea, I'll pick up two of them but most likely they'll be fielded as regular ones with a Praevian. I really wish FW would come out with their damn FAQ already. If the Achea CCW are power fists as Alan told me, then they very much have a role. Otherwise Praevian ho!

[Withershadow]

Praevians should really be hanging out with darkfire Castellax, so using Achean models for them seems like a waste of those cool weapon bits. I was actually going to use my Mauler Castellax to represent them, but the Achaen are too sexy not to pick up a few. Anyone want to buy some vanilla Castellax? :D

 

I am thinking a unit of 3, with 1 plasma cannon in there to take care of the artificer Sgt and let the pinning, shredding maulers do their job. A divination buff bot nearby would be ideal. With re-rolls to hit and to wound, even the basic wrist bolters are doing solid damage.

[Sonoftherubric21]

Random thought I had regarding a Thousand Sons 30k list; 

 

Was tempted to go for a "seige company" type of list. Medusa, 2-3 Castellax Achea, Heavy weapons teams, Shredding Rotor Cannon team, decent amount of foot infantry, and several dreadnoughts. 

I was debating around several dreadnoughts, a couple of Achea walkers, a Leviathan, Medusa, lots of Corvidae heavy weapon / tac support teams, and a couple of elite contemptor dreadnoughts for some more Dakka in the list. 

 

Toss in the HQ psyker dread with 2 more decent HQ choices, with the Praetor being Corvidae or Raptora, and I think the list could do well on the table with lots of shooting, several dreadnoughts, and some terminators in the midfield for melee capability. always liked the "seige company" idea and the Order of Ruin may be in my future. 

[Excessus]

Soon...very soon...

 

[Alpharius164]

Wow he looks good. Interested to see what his blade looks like. Edited April 17, 2017 by Alpharius164

[ShadowCore67]

Sorry if this has already been brought up, but I have a question:

 

In the Guard of the Crimson King RoW, it says on the turn Independent Characters and Terminators deepstrike, they gain fear and reroll invuln saves of 1. Now go to the Sanctic discipline and look at Gate of Infinity, which lets the caster deep strike.

 

If Magnus were to have Gate of Infinity and use it every turn, would he be rerolling invuln saves of 1 every turn?

[Caillum]

I reckon that you're right - it probably does apply when you use Gate of Infinity too.

 

But Magnus doesn't exactly need any more benefits, so use it wih restraint.

[Spiritual Liege]

As someone may have noticed, I'm trying to come up with a Ninth Fellowship recon company with Magistus Amon. Its quite thematic and differs from the usual Praetor + 20 sekhmet + Magnus + AT :cuss. Recon company is a tough one to run, Recon marines are damn expensive, but I still want to try. Anyone else have been thinking about the same?

 

I'm trying to come up with a list that would be both fluffy and it could do something. Currently looking at something like Amon, 3x recon squad, 10 Ammitara, a couple of Land speeders, some fliers and seekers/outriders (can't afford jetbikes ), but it just never feels good. Send help.