Raven Guard: Paints you need. (Updated: added P3 Frostbite)

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I just thought I'd post my beginner experience with RG and painting.  Don't take it as the gospel but just some dudes opinions.

 

Ok so what paints are good for RG?

 

1. Black

Obviously you can't strike from the shadows dressed in vibrant blue or blood red!  Once you go black...

 

The best:

Vallejo Model Color Black. 70.950

 

Coverage: A+ when is black not A+ for coverage??

Smoothness: A. Requires thinning.  Water or fancy thinner stuff works fine.  

Shine: Matte as heck!

 

This stuff brushes on easily and even a beginner would have a hard time messing up with this paint.  It is the mattest(sp?) unshiniestestes black I've seen.  This black is THE black for Raven Guard since it gives off no shine whatsoever.  The enemy will never us coming!

 

Alternative:

Vallejo Game Air Black. 72.751

 

Coverage: A  This paint is a tad thin since it requires a bit more to get great coverage but overall it good stuff.

 

Smoothness: A+ Works straight out of the bottle.  I like this stuff for gangster priming on practice sprues.  Dries quick and is plenty black enough.

Shine:  Matte.

 

Overall good stuff but it does give off some shine.  Not much shine but more than VMC black. Second best but great.  

 

Vallejo Model Color German Grey. 70.995

 

Coverage: A+ the same as VMC black.

Smoothness: A.  Requires thinning but really smooth.

Shine: Matte.

 

Ok this color is your alt dark color you use for tires, belts, boots, gloves,weapon handles, cloaks and anything you dont want to be colorful but also want to be dark/blackish without being black.  It is an auxiliary to black.  You can mix this with metallics and darken them or reds/blues to produce off very dark grey off colors.  I like it best for tires.

 

2. White

 

Vallejo Model Color Light Grey. 70.990

 

Coverage: A+

Smoothness. A.  Thin it or die.

Shine: Matte.

 

Since RG is going to be primed black, you need something to make life easy when painting white basecoats.  This is your answer.  This color is straight from the sacred armory of the Ravenspire and is the basis for all white portions of your models.  It has the best coverage of any light color I've used and only takes about 2 coats over black to obscure it completely.  

 

Vallejo Model Color White 70.951 and Offwhite 70.820

 

Coverage: D  Painting these over anything other than Light Grey will have you considering turning to the dark gods for answers.  The more ambitious painters out there will likely fall to Tzeentch or Slaanesh whilst the more impulsive painters such as myself will likely fly into a Khornate rage after struggling to paint whites onto a black primed model.  

Smoothness. A.  Same as above

Shine: Matte.  

 

Raven Guard marines generally feature strong white model sections such as helmets, shoulder pads, trim, weapon casings, various bling and crests.  I prefer just straight white as a focal point for a lot of these but offwhite with pure white highlights probably look better.  Of course whites never cover well so build up with Light Grey first.

 

P3 Frostbite

So this stuff is pure white with a hint of blue.  I'd say it is a mix between white scar and fenrisian grey.  You can edge highlight Frostbite with pure whites and it pops nicely.  

 

Coverage: D This stuff requires two coats over grey and maybe 3 over black.  It is about the same as most whites 

Smoothness: A.  Same as Vallejo white.

Shine: Satin/Matte.  This has a slight shine to it but is certainly not pure satin.     

 

3. Metallics

 

Vallejo Model Air Silver 71.063 and Vallejo Model Air Gun Metal 71.072

Vallejo Model Air Copper 71.068. *UPDATED 

 

Coverage: A++.  When you absolutely positively must kill every last heretic in the room, accept no substitutes.

Smoothness. A+.  Usable straight out of the pot but thinning can be useful.

Shine: B+.  Bright metallic but doesn't require blacksun  filters to view safely.

 

These are the twin-linked vulcan mega bolters of metallics.  You can use all three just like Light Grey for building up metallics overtop of black primer in 2 coats.  The pigment sticks well and doesn't pool into small areas.  Praise the emperor for these three paints.

 

Update:  I just tried VMA Copper and it has the same coverage as the silver and gun metal and works great as a basecoat for gold.  Why does the VMA gold not have the same coverage as the copper?? 

 

 

4. Primer!

 

Vallejo Surface Primer German Panzer Grey.

 

Coverage: A.

Smoothness: A+.  Usable straight out of the pot if you want.

Utility:  A+

 

Ok this stuff is ironically terrific for non air brushers.  It brushes on very easily with great coverage and dries thin.  The smell is slightly funky but non toxic and faint.  If you live on Fenris or other areas that are cold in winter and cannot spray indoors, get this primer.  The dark gods and xeno filth don't take winters off.

 

Tamiya Metallic Grey XF-56.  

 

Coverage: A+

Smoothness: B-.  Must be thinned constantly with water or Isopropyl alcohol.

Utility: C-.  Must be thinned often since it dries much faster than water based paints.  Much stickier than water paints and chips less easily.  Flammable and fumes are potentially toxic.  Using this stuff safely is a bit tricky.  I wear disposable rubber gloves and wash my hands thoroughly after using it.  

 

This paint is great for very real looking gritty steal.  It has good coverage but requires patience when using.  I like for Raven Guard because it gives a used or worn metal look that Vallejo metallics do not.  Use this paint if you want a very realistic looking metal with more shine.  Avoid this paint if cancerous fumes and flammable substances concern you.  Improper use of this stuff could likely turn someone into a mindless plague zombie or force a few Gets Hot! rolls.  

 

Paint Combos!  What do you guys use for RG painting?  

 

Something I like...

 

VMC Light Grey 70.990 + VMC Basic Skin Tone 70.815 + Citadel Drakenhof Nightshade.

 

This is a nice pale bluish combo for RG faces/skin.  If you sarge lost his beakie helmet whilst delivering the emperor's judgement, then you need to use this combo.  Just basecoat the face over anything including black.  Wash it when go back in for raised highlights with your original grey+skin tone combo.  

 

Anything else know any more of these combos?

 

 

Also... what is a good matte varnish?  Anyone that suggests vallejo is guilty of the gravest heresy and should be put to the chain sword immediately.  That stuff is shiny as heck!

What gold doesn't suck?  I put my faith in Vallejo Model Air gold hoping it would be as awesome as the silver and gun metal but it is really sucks for coverage. You could do like 15 coats over any other color and still have the basecoat bleed through.  *wrists* 

 

Ok... that's all I got.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MithrilForge]

Testors - Dulcote is the best matte Varnish ever

Vallejo - Glorious Gold bottle (Standard not Air) is Awesomesauce, if your really having trouble laying it down(which you shouldn't) try basing with the new GW gold for Sigmarines it's called "Retributor Gold" one coat is enough for a great base...

Cheers, Mithril

[NiceGuyAdi]

Thanks for taking the time to write this up, Guardsman. I use GW paints if only because the local store is only a 5 min bike ride from me and I enjoy popping in there. I love most of the range but I hear Abaddon Black is very shiny by comparison so I may take a look at VMC Black down the line.

 

A year into painting Raven Guard, and I've lost count of how many times I've changed my black recipe. At the moment I'm trying a base of Abaddon Black/Eshin Grey/Dark Reaper mix (2:2:1), followed by blacklining Abaddon Black and line highlighting in Administratum Grey, then glazing down with Nuln Oil and glazing up with Dawnstone. I think it should give a very dark grey with a bit of tonal variation that drops into black. I also think it's going to be very time consuming!

 

I'td be cool to see some pics of how your getting on with your recipe.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Thanks for taking the time to write this up, Guardsman. I use GW paints if only because the local store is only a 5 min bike ride from me and I enjoy popping in there. I love most of the range but I hear Abaddon Black is very shiny by comparison so I may take a look at VMC Black down the line.

 

A year into painting Raven Guard, and I've lost count of how many times I've changed my black recipe. At the moment I'm trying a base of Abaddon Black/Eshin Grey/Dark Reaper mix (2:2:1), followed by blacklining Abaddon Black and line highlighting in Administratum Grey, then glazing down with Nuln Oil and glazing up with Dawnstone. I think it should give a very dark grey with a bit of tonal variation that drops into black. I also think it's going to be very time consuming!

 

I'td be cool to see some pics of how your getting on with your recipe.

I actually have another threat called Starting Out with Raven Guard with some of my stuff.  It is stuff I'm chugging away on right now.  I wasn't man enough to post pics of the first models I painted a year ago.  Daemon primarchs would cower in fear before the spectacle of horror that those models are.  

 

Glazing is something I'm not good enough to make much use of yet.  I tried with a few power swords and cloaks with mixed results.  I'm workin' on it.  

 

Is dark reaper a really dark green?  

[MithrilForge]

Dark Reaper is a very Dark Grey Layer paint (being a Layer paint it is more Translucent? as it has less pigment than a Base Paint i.e. Mechanicus Standard Grey.)

 

Cheers Mithril

[Race Bannon]

"Glazed" over this and wanted to quickly say that another alternative to black is P3 "Thamar Black" has a medium coat that dries real smooth.

 

Frankly, I'm using P3 paints for my white too.

 

^_^

[Claws and Effect]

I'm super lazy about my painting, and also broke.

 

Recommendation: Don't be tempted by the cheap acrylic paint you can get at Walmart for less than a buck. You WILL tear your hair out in frustration trying to work with that junk. Some of them are OK, but others are awful, and there is no consistency in the quality at all. Got 2 of the same color and they are totally different. The whites are the worst, 9 layers to cover black undercoat.

 

Just learned the Hobby Lobby near me carries Vallejo, so I'll be slowly switching over. The price and terrible new jars of Citadel paints turned me off them, so I'll probably just use their washes and ignore the rest unless I find I need a specific shade for something. I'm still jealously clinging to my jars of Deadly Nightshade and Hawk Turquoise from around 1996 or so (still usable!), since they discontinued those colors.

[Biscuittzz]

A great thread . Only recently posted about painting so this one is helping me tremendously already.

I've gone with the Citadel basics to start painting as I don't know much about the range of brands on offer. With regards Dark Reaper, I bought it recently but found it in the GW purple colour section. It does seem to have a slight purple/green twinge to it.

[NiceGuyAdi]

Dark Reaper is a very Dark Grey Layer paint (being a Layer paint it is more Translucent? as it has less pigment than a Base Paint i.e. Mechanicus Standard Grey.)

I've gone with the Citadel basics to start painting as I don't know much about the range of brands on offer. With regards Dark Reaper, I bought it recently but found it in the GW purple colour section. It does seem to have a slight purple/green twinge to it.

I'd say Dark Reaper is more of a dark blue/grey. Mixing a little with black just helps bring some cold tone into black armour so you don't end up with monochrome marines, though there's nothing wrong with monochrome if that's what you like

The Layer paints are thinner than the Base, but not a great deal more translucent. I find I end up thinning it anyway; just less than the base paints.

[Furiyen]

I think Dark Reaper will be the secret to my Raven Guard as well, and I agree its a very dark Blue Grey that's perfect for Raven Guard armour.

 

I did find this little gem while trawling around the internetz:

 

 

.... Which is what put me onto Dark Reaper in the first place. On its own its ok, but when I added the Administratum Grey fine highlights as well, it really pops.

 

Its gonna need some fine line brush work, but I think I can pull this off. 1 Artificer Brush - Sold!

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I think Dark Reaper will be the secret to my Raven Guard as well, and I agree its a very dark Blue Grey that's perfect for Raven Guard armour.

 

I did find this little gem while trawling around the internetz:

 

 

.... Which is what put me onto Dark Reaper in the first place. On its own its ok, but when I added the Administratum Grey fine highlights as well, it really pops.

 

Its gonna need some fine line brush work, but I think I can pull this off. 1 Artificer Brush - Sold!

That scheme would look fierce with really sharp blood red edge highlights.  Damn.  For some reason it just hit me when looking at that pic.  Might be too close to death company though.  

[Furiyen]

 

That scheme would look fierce with really sharp blood red edge highlights.  Damn.  For some reason it just hit me when looking at that pic.  Might be too close to death company though.  

 

 

I'm doing Red lenses on helmets....

[NiceGuyAdi]

I think Dark Reaper will be the secret to my Raven Guard as well, and I agree its a very dark Blue Grey that's perfect for Raven Guard armour.

 

I did find this little gem while trawling around the internetz:

 

 

 

 

 

 

.... Which is what put me onto Dark Reaper in the first place. On its own its ok, but when I added the Administratum Grey fine highlights as well, it really pops.

 

Its gonna need some fine line brush work, but I think I can pull this off. 1 Artificer Brush - Sold!

 

 

This scheme is almost the same but worth a gander:

 

[Shadow Captain Vyper]

I wanted to pop into this thread to talk about testor's dullcote. In almost every painting related thread, when questions come out asking for the best varnish/sealer, Testor's Dullcote is touted as one of the best solutions. My current Raven Guard army (which I finished painting back in '01-'02) is all sealed in Dullcote, and I found that it added a muted look to the black armor. Its hard to describe really, but a lot of the black paints in question in this thread have a great intensity to them, and after hitting them with a Dullcote varnish, I found that it almost frosted/fogged it up a bit, and really muted the color. When it comes to color paints, I found the effect minimalized, but with black in particular, I was quite disappointed. I of course varnished my entire army in virtually one go as well, so the damage is wide spread.

 

I was just curious if anyone else had experienced the same thing? Maybe I had issues with the two cans I used, maybe I didn't shake enough, humidity was too high, etc? I'm familiar with all the perils of a rattle can, and what traditional chalking/frosting looks like (when confronted with temp/humidity issues), this doesn't look like that, it just looks like a ever-so-slightly translucent layer on top that mutes the sharpness of the black.

 

As to the OP, very helpful. I haven't explored the full range of Vallejo colors, and most of the Vallejo paints I have are primers/thinners/mediums with a handful of light greys/blues/creams, so this thread has been very enlightening when it comes to blacks.

[NiceGuyAdi]

Itvyper, I've got a can of Winsor & Newton Matte Varnish waiting until I've finished painting my Chaplain. The Abaddon Black (and Lahmian Medium I've used to glaze with) has such a shine to it I feel I need to knock it back once I'm done as under light all I can see is reflections off the model, not the paint job. I'm hoping I don't experience the fogging you're talking about. If I remember, I'll take a before/after and post back here, assuming SanguinaryGuardsman's cool with that?

 

I'm also thinking I'll be getting hold of some VMC/P3 black based on this thread for the matteness.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Itvyper, I've got a can of Winsor & Newton Matte Varnish waiting until I've finished painting my Chaplain. The Abaddon Black (and Lahmian Medium I've used to glaze with) has such a shine to it I feel I need to knock it back once I'm done as under light all I can see is reflections off the model, not the paint job. I'm hoping I don't experience the fogging you're talking about. If I remember, I'll take a before/after and post back here, assuming SanguinaryGuardsman's cool with that?

 

I'm also thinking I'll be getting hold of some VMC/P3 black based on this thread for the matteness.

Pics are good! Do it.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I think I'm going to just bite the bullet and use vallejo's brush on matte varnish.  It isnt matte at all but the shine is tolerable.  It is too cold to do any spraying where I live and won't be warm enough for months.  I have a bunch of unvarnished models and probably chip if handled in games.  

[NattyMac]

Here's a few more references from different sources for those still looking for Raven Guard paint combinations. I'm going with Abaddon Black, Eshin Grey, Dawnstone for black armor and Ulthuan Grey, Drakenhoff Nightshade, White Scar for white armor.

 

Does anyone have a good recipe for trim from companies other than 3rd Company?

 

From "How to Paint Space Marines"

 

From the Space Marines Tactical Squad assembly guide.

 

The back of the "Shadow Force Solaq" box.

 

From "How to Paint Space Marines"

 

Last one, also from "How to Paint Space Marines"

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Just used P3's frostbite... excellent stuff.  It has finish of citadel paints.  I'd say it is a cross between fenrisian grey and a pure white.  It is really good for basing white surfaces you want to edge highlight with pure white.  

[Bedouin2]

---- Edit For Update on Scale 75 Paint ----

Finally got my paints in yesterday... and I love them! One note is that they are really thick, so I suggest putting agitators in the bottles to help mix it... plus they come completely sealed so you have to poke a hole through the top. Don't be dumb like me and look stupid

Black Metal is a wonderful metallic. Finishes as more of a dark iron but a very unique color.

White Alchemy turned out differently than expected. Kind of has a marble look to it, but creamy like. Hard to explain. Defiantly has to have a white undercoat to work.

Emerald Alchemy turned out differently as well. More of an Aqua green with a mix of Turquoise. Again you have to have a white or light color back ground for it to work.

Inktense Violet. I got this to mix with the Druchii Violet wash to make it a more deep purple... and it does the job wonderfully. Need to thin down the mixture to make it wash like again, but it's great.

Will be getting more Scale 75 paint for sure... but through a different source. It took the paint two weeks and a day for it to get to me from Spain. Pics will be coming soon to my WIP thread to show off the paint.