rabid_stoat Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 So you know that one project you've been thinking about and putting off for years? This is mine and its been around quite a while. I think I first planned this out about ten years ago. The thing I found is that there were no Space Marine superheavy tanks. There are now of course, but at the time the Forgeworld IG Baneblades were it. I'd looked up heavy Land Raiders and found only kitbashed monsters made of two or four Land Raiders glued together. I didn't want that. I had in mind a genuine Heavy Land Raider model, scaled up by 150% to 200% over the regular pattern. I hesitated for years because of the work involved in scratch-building the tracks. Happily Blood and Skulls Industries have since produced the Liberator pattern tracks, so I've no excuses left. In fact I should have started this years ago. I almost did when the Spartan Assault Tank came out and I was distracted with the idea of one of those instead. But the Spartan, while cool, isn't quite ambitious enough. So, no more putting this off. I've got tracks, weapons, plasticard, foamboard, rivets. I've even sort of got a plan. What I'm hoping you all can help me with is some support and encouragement, so I don't let this thing linger for years again. Here I go. I have started with the track assembly. I've dusted off an old sketch I made some years back and measured it against the Liberator tracks. I've estimated a scale of around 1.65/1 or "plus two thirds" over the existing Land Raider model. Then it was simply a matter of cutting some foamboard to match the outline. I then tested the fit and discovered that the Liberator tracks fit neatly between the two sheets of foamboard with another two sheets between as spacers. Just as planned! I glue these pieces together and then get to work on the tracks. each track section has a 1mm plasticard strip added to it so the assembly is slightly raised from the hull it is wrapped around. I'm not sure this is necessary, but it felt right. I then break out some PVA/woodworking glue and attach the full track assembly - and waste some time trying to get an idea how big the sponson weapons will be... A quick size comparison - it will be pretty big: I've gotten a good ways further than this, but I have to sleep so I'll post the work I've made on the sides tomorrow. Thanks for your time. PS. I haven't posted much in years. Have I done the images correctly by forum rules? All images should be hosted elsewhere but I've used no img/img codes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearson73 Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Nice start, it's gonna be a monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjorn Firewalker Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Looks promising. The fact the tracks are NOT mounted backwards, makes me optimistic about the design. (WW1 tanks had rhomboid tracks to cross trenches. A common complaint I have with Games Workshop models, e.g., the Land Raider, is the likelihood their reversed tracks will make tanks bury their noses like giant metal ostriches when they attempt to cross a trench, and become immobilized.) In game, does it "counts as" a Spartan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted January 10, 2017 Author Share Posted January 10, 2017 Nice start, it's gonna be a monster. Thanks. I was actually disappointed at first by the likely dimensions. The Liberator tracks are compatible with Baneblades, so are roughly 2/3rds again the size of raider tracks. I thought that was smallish, until I cut the panels out. Looks promising. The fact the tracks are NOT mounted backwards, makes me optimistic about the design. (WW1 tanks had rhomboid tracks to cross trenches. A common complaint I have with Games Workshop models, e.g., the Land Raider, is the likelihood their reversed tracks will make tanks bury their noses like giant metal ostriches when they attempt to cross a trench, and become immobilized.) In game, does it "counts as" a Spartan? I'll be honest, I didn't factor in the size of this thing when I set the design, so the 'prow' of the tracks is probably too high - it could probably climb an obstacle 16 foot high! It should be capable of climbing a standard Land Raider in fact, though I'm worried it would get stuck. Anyway it isn't quite as high as an old MkI as the hull sides stretch higher then the track assembly. I'm not too worried about in game rules as I'm a collector/modeler these days, but I'd say its rather big for a Spartan. The transport capacity might be right, but I have rather bigger weapons in mind. I originally didn't want a front assault ramp either, as I'd think these would weaken the front armour, but its definitely going to have one now. Next I went to work on the side hull pieces. I made these with more foamboard cut to shape and lined with 0.25mm plastic-card. Several plastic strips act as spacers here. At this point I revisited the sketchbook and drew up a new plan for the side detail. I'm looking for detail quite close to the Land Raider to tie this kit into the Space Marine aesthetic. As you can see this kit should have enormous sponsons, mounted on a heavy slab of armour to take the weight. There will be a standard side door behind that. The side panels already add some weight to the machine. I've selected some well matured ten year old 0.5mm plastic-card for the side detail. I am using 1mm card to space out the layers. The 0.5mm plasticard is very easy to cut, but has no strength to it (0.25mm is like paper, its amazing stuff) so I've used lots of 1mm card behind the 0.5mm stuff for this next bit. Then I added more detail - rivets! I cheated here and used Wave rivets sprues, I also cut out the cog-tooth sections (sand channels?) and added extraneous details. Now I just have to finish it off and do the other hull side. *Sigh* I'll leave it here until the next update, which may take a couple of days. I'll see if I can find something more interesting to show too. Engine exhausts? Sponson mountings? Weapons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maarten Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 TRUE SCALE LANDRAIDER! Nah but really man, this thing is cool as all hell. What kind of weaponry are you thinking? You could always use it as a count as Mastodon too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col.hertford Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Dam, that is pretty! Do you have front and rear designs yet? Have you considered a flat plated at the front with a melta array, then two assault ramps either side at around 45 degrees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjorn Firewalker Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Will it mount a cannon in a Leman Russ battle tank turret? In my opinion, the lack of long-range weapons (72" or greater) is a Space Marine army's greatest weakness. With a tank this big, a proper cannon should be feasible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted January 11, 2017 Author Share Posted January 11, 2017 Thanks guys. Right, weaponry seems to be the big question, doesn't it? It certainly COULD fit a couple of Leman Russ turrets. Probably on each corner actually. Something to think about but my thoughts were initially for more iconic Space Marine weapons... Mind you I'm not saying no... My intent for now is to build it as a scaled up LR, with an Assault Ramp on the prow, but I may be able to magnetise things while I go, so it can have several interchangeable front sections (?). Still working that out. It would be GLORIOUS with a huge front plate and a cannon made out of a soup can though . I certainly think I'll magnetize the sponsons. Maybe two en echelon lascannon mounts on the upper hull too. I don't have a front or rear elevation yet, I have a plan in mind but I've learnt not to set it in stone. I'll try to sketch what I have in mind BEFORE I make it. Meanwhile, I think my camera just died. More likely the battery, again. Stuff replacing that again, last time it took a month for the replacement to be ordered in. I think I'm going to have to buy another - more $$$ gone... OK, borrowing a camera now... Here are the weapon bits I currently have/am working on (the marine is for scale): I've been thinking Avenger Bolt cannons in sponsons (with underslung auxiliary quad-linked heavy weapons), and Tri and Quad lascannons as tertiary hull weapons: Primary hull mount will probably be the Blood and Skulls Industries Thermal Cannon or Flame Cannon (they're designed to be interchangeable with magnets): Or the Nova cannon, thusly: Either should fit over the Ramp with plenty of room to spare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Chaplain Posted January 11, 2017 Share Posted January 11, 2017 Can't wait to see this beast finished. Best of luck on this very ambitious project! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monstra Sumus Posted January 11, 2017 Share Posted January 11, 2017 I think I'm in love with this tank already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col.hertford Posted January 11, 2017 Share Posted January 11, 2017 You seem to have not got choom in this list. Please resolve this omission at the earliest opportunity. Looks great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted January 12, 2017 Author Share Posted January 12, 2017 Thanks guys. I seem to be the only one not yet sold on Volkite weaponry - convince me? I have got a couple of the heavy weapon versions but haven't found a use for them yet. I'll definitely magnetise the weapons though. I will probably try to finish it with a standard '40k' weapon fit, and then maybe get more exotic with alternative weapons such as the Volkite range. Not much progress today, work night and all. I think any progress is a good thing though. Today I've gotten the basic 'H' hull piece done, so the dimensions are now more or less locked. I can also start on the engine plate at the rear. I have two Blood and Skulls Industries engines but frankly they are too small so I'm going to have to extend them considerably. I hope to have more tomorrow. Test fitting weapons again. I know what I want, but I don't know if it will look good when its done. Does that make sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW1 Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 Just a quick question about the way your building the panels up. The skin of 0.5 plasticard has spacers of 1mm behind them? How are you covering up the 1mm gaps? Are you going back and adding a shim of 1mm plasticard aroubd the edge on the back and then gluing the sheet in place or filling in the gap with something? Edit: also wondering what glue your using to fix the foamboard (paper card backed?) to the plasticard? I've had issues getting the two materials to stay fixed together without having the foam getting melted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctem Cultor Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 By the Runinous powers I hate talented people like you... This looks awesome I can't wait to see it finished. -Noctem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 Just a quick question about the way your building the panels up. The skin of 0.5 plasticard has spacers of 1mm behind them? How are you covering up the 1mm gaps? Are you going back and adding a shim of 1mm plasticard aroubd the edge on the back and then gluing the sheet in place or filling in the gap with something? Edit: also wondering what glue your using to fix the foamboard (paper card backed?) to the plasticard? I've had issues getting the two materials to stay fixed together without having the foam getting melted. The 'lowest' section is flush against the foamboard, the next has strips of 1mm plasticard around the edges on the back and the third 2x 1mm - probably a better way to do it but so far its working. As a result there are no major gaps, just a few cracks where strips of plasticard backing meet in corners. I intend to smooth these edges out a little with either greenstuff or some modelling putty or even gap filler (if I can find anything appropriate), scraped smooth with a handy piece of plasticard. Even some of the craft glue might work... I'll let you know. The large sponson mount section should have foamboard backing, which is almost exactly 5mm - I'll cut 0.25mm plasticard for the edges of that. As for glue, I've simply glued the plasticard to the foamboard (paper backed) with PVA/Craft/Woodworking glue, Aquadhere IIRC (old bottle ran out and was chucked out). In the past I've also used a sort of household cement used for sticking wood veneer strips to cabinets, that was really good. For edges, tricky bits and extra strength I have some Loctite Super Glue Gel. GET THE GEL. Unlike regular super glue (runny death) it starts off like toothpaste and doesn't melt stuff. Does all that help? I'm hoping the technique I've used is clear so that it should be easy for anyone to make their own. By the Runinous powers I hate talented people like you... This looks awesome I can't wait to see it finished. -Noctem I wish I was talented. Thanks for the sentiment though! If you don't get ambitious straight away you'd be surprised what you can do. The raw materials of a build like this (not counting the tracks and GW bitz) probably only cost $50-100 AUD or whatever so its not too hard to try something. Sketch out a quick design and carve out some 0.5mm plasticard, its easy! Not much obvious progress over the weekend (sooooo hot here) but I've sketched out the top view a bit and that's helped a lot more than I expected. Better try a front view I guess! As I said I intend to magnetize it, and I now think I can probably build a base hull with sides and rear, but leave the entire front section to slot into place, so I can change the design from transport to Self Propelled Gun. This also means less pressure to get the design 'perfect' first time, and now I can get stuck into the engine and upper-rear hull without hesitation. I'm fired up now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW1 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 Cheers for the info. It was exactly what I needed. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 So believe it or not I haven't forgotten about this project. Progress has been very, veeery slow but semi-steady over the year. I've found a lot of time is spent just looking at the thing and trying to picture the next step or three in my head - sort of the old 'measure twice, cut once' approach.(Unsurprisingly this only works up to a point. Eventually you just have to CUT and see what interesting shapes appear.)Anyway, I thought I was further along than I was when I last posted, so here's what's happened. First, I started work on the engine block/centre hull to tie the whole thing together. Foamboard is pretty strong with a little bit of bracing. This is basically the rear of the hull, so the front section should be interchangeable if I want to try a few different setups. Engine mountings are from Blood and Skull Industries. It turns out they are too small (perfect for a Baneblade or Fellblade but too short for the Mycenaean). Still I intend to use them. I extended them Land Raider style with some 1mm plasticard frames and 0.25mm plasticard 'skin'. And got to work making some engine louvres and two more exhaust stacks. Still haven't finished this bit actually... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 At about this point I thought I'd better tackle the weapon sponsons. These things are bigger in proportion to the Mycenaean than the regular land raider patterns, so they will absolutely dominate the finished model. The base sponson brackets were initially easy enough, just a sandwich of plasticard. The mounts themselves were more fun though, modelled on the land Raider ones but scaled up to 200%. The drop pod missile launcher is something I'm currently rethinking, but the forward arm it is mounted on is there for a reason I'll get to eventually (parts just ordered in from UK).A test fit to the tank 'wall' itself confirmed I had the size and layout about right. Now, I hope to make several different weapon layouts once I've completed the 'base' configuration of this tank so I want to keep the weapons replaceable. But what would the base weapon array look like?Well, I wanted official guns to help tie this tank into the GW range, so that limited my options. I went through the FW catalogue with great interest, but settled on...Plasma. As much as would fit on the sponson. Which is quite a lot. The parts are from the Dark Angels four engine landspeeder. They might be a fraction smaller than those on a Leman Russ Executioner, but there's not much in it. By my math each sponson now has almost as much firepower as two Astra Militarum battle tanks. I had intended to magnetise the lower mounts so they can be swapped out and independently rotated, but they're not quite cooperating, so will likely just be superglued in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Desultor Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 Your attention to detail is simply staggering. Truly inspirational - keep it up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 Your attention to detail is simply staggering. Truly inspirational - keep it up!! Thanks. Its a big clumsy beast but it (along with my 30K Guilliman and my 40K Guilliman) is the centrepiece of my 40K collection - I can't afford to slouch on detail! Still hoping it all comes together in the end... I set out to make the front half of the central hull interchangeable. I thought about magnets and sliding tabs, but it turns out the foamboard H section you see here actually holds itself in place perfectly! The foamboard has some give so the track sections have just moved a millimetre or so and are now holding the hull in place. Might stop working if I add too much weight later. Also got started on the upper hull detail. I promised myself I would NOT build an assault ramp because it would obviously weaken the prow armour of the tank (plus I'd have to detail an interior troop bay). Well. I had some plans for the prow that didn't quite work (so far). The problem is that the lower prow armour is big (twice the height of a marine) and angled (at about the same angle as a Rhino rear hatch). It is hard to imagine what else to put there. So, a three part hatch with interlocking armour plates about 2 foot thick. This is just a test fit. Some more work (on both sides although I seem to have only photographed the left) on the hull detail. The large square will obviously mount the sponson. The chamfer on the upper hull edge will be detailed further with some 0.5mm or 0.25mm plasticard. This bit could be tricky, but thin plasticard is pretty easy to work with so I'm optimistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovidius Incertus Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 This is staggeringly awesome and I have no idea how I missed it until just now. How much plasticard, etc. do you use in a project like this? And what panoply of tools is required to undertake this kind of project? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 This is staggeringly awesome and I have no idea how I missed it until just now. How much plasticard, etc. do you use in a project like this? And what panoply of tools is required to undertake this kind of project? Thanks! You haven't really missed it though. It's been dormant for months and I've just made several posts to catch everyone up because I've neglected the thread for a long time while I just quietly worked away at it with none of the promised updates. Sorry! I've used a bunch of 0.25mm, .5mm and 1mm plasticard, but really only the equivalent of a couple of A4/Foolscap sheets. The foamboard took me a while to find (eBay, should have looked there in the first place) but I have 5 sheets almost the size of a car door (cost was minimal) and only needed one for this. My intent here in large part is to show how easy this sort of project is. Final update for now: A close up of one of the light arrays. Lights courtesy of Blood and Skulls Industries. These are actually the smaller light and are about the same size as a Land Raiders (perhaps a mil or so bigger). Remember these track links are designed for the Plastic Baneblade, and are roughly 150% the size of Land Raider tracks. I'm just using blutack to test fit the doors. I know I can make them open and shut, but I;m not sure yet if they'll stay shut on their own. Another case of building it first to see if it works... I decided to change up the sponson design slightly, after the Repulsor came out. The Repulsor is a mixed bag in my opinion - decent hull but daft GI Joe turret (VERY low tech for a Astartes tank) - but the mini turret above the doors got my attention. I really don't know that the HBolters are the final choice for these slots.but they'll do for now. And that's where we stand at present. I will probably get the sponsons completed and attached next, but I have ideas for the ramp too. The problem is the upper hull. I really want to try a helicopter gunship style arrangement for the offset crew area, with a pilot and gunner sitting fighter style in a raised fuselage, above a nose mounted sensor pod and a chin turret (with quad lascannons) directly above the ramp. I dare to hope it will look like a Thunderhawk Gunship tried to merge with the tank. Unfortunately I suspect it won't work. I mean, I know I can build it, complete with driver and gunner in semi open cockpits if I want, like Bigglesworth (or Snoopy) versus the Red Baron. The problem is I bet it looks awful when I'm done. I just can't shake the feeling. However the alternative is a Land Raider clone upper hull, which will be step too far I think. This tank has very strong visual links to the LR, but I don't really want it to be identical, like I just scaled up a template (too much like that already). So I'm going to mock a few bits up and I'll let you know how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Desultor Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 This is turning out to be quite a behemoth!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabid_stoat Posted November 10, 2017 Author Share Posted November 10, 2017 This is turning out to be quite a behemoth!! It's physically pretty big - about 1.6 times the Land Raider in each dimension, but I'm finding it a strange combination of too big and too small. I have heaps of room but the things I want to squeeze in often don't fit. For example I could probably fit in a Vulcan Megabolter or Plasma Blastgun, but that would be it! And there's something I want to do with the sponsons and I'm just not sure it will fit. Yesterday I started on the cockpit area as I always imagined it, on the basis that if it doesn't look good on this tank I can always recycle it for an Astartes gunship of some sort. So first I built a basic shape. This looks unfortunately like the drivers's cab of a German Minenraumer : Still it does put the quad lascannons in a nice position. The tank still has sufficient clearance for almost any obstacle, and room for the ramp to open, and the marines can disembark under the cover of a lot of firepower. So it seems to work as I hoped. Also it leaves plenty of room for the prow guns (Whatever I decide goes there - Plasma, Melta, Flamers or some kind of twin Avenger bolt cannon). So I will keep going with this. If it really doesn't work I can always replace it - its not glued the the main full sections yet. I removed the upper walls as they just look blocky - the sides will angle in instead. A quick test fit confirms a marine fits between the cockpit walls with a couple of mils of clearance. The resin in back is just a counterweight. So the cockpit detail - this doesn't need to be complex as the marine himself will mostly get in the way. I went to the trouble of foot pedals only to realise you'll never see them under the consoles. So below is a final test fit with consoles and such. The quad las has a spotlight above and a remote sight from the command tank sprue behind. This is the driver's primary forward sight as there are no vision slits up there to provide a weak spot in the prow amour. I think I'll move both crew pits further back an inch or so. Leave some room for the avionics or whatever tanks have instead. The driver sits forward with fighter style HOTAS. The gunner is behind with a PS4 Dual Shock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Dog Studios Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 The amount of work you are putting into this is phenomenal, I think it has to be one of the best scratch-builds I've seen so far. Can't wait to see it finished! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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