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The state of B&C members and our responces to posts


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#51
Marshal Rohr

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Warning, ranting of a madman ahead.

Simply, the entire year has been awful for many people with an awful election season spilling over into everything else in multiple countries, many deaths both familial and celebrity angering many, and GW continues to behave in a bipolar manner despite its new CEO. The ghost of Fantasy also haunts all of us, making many of us behave like an alert Jackrabbit, jumping at the slightest sound and heading from the hills as they anticipate the worse, because GW has still given us zero reason to assume of anything good. There is no reason for optimism when the trend is only just improving, and that other fandom you might had had stepped a toe into just got blammed only a couple years ago yet, and you're worried you might be next.

Then there's the game itself, and 40K is frankly, objectively, a terrible game. It is in desperate need of being fixed or even completely done, but I am completely terrified of the result of such a fix if done by GW because I have absolutely zero faith in them. And, at least for me, these new "toys" are actually the problem itself, because the constant increase in game scale and models just piles further imbalance and money on top of what is just supposed to be a skirmish game, running on skirmish rules. It's why I haven't painted or even assembled much yet (although partially out of fear of ruining absurdly expensive models and indecision of where to go). Like the whole new Fall of Cadia bollocks. I now have to go back to the drawing board with my Chapter to make sure they don't end up in the middle of the damn warp.

People talk about how change is good and inevitable, but here's the thing. The change we're getting? We don't need. We don't need Primarchs, we don't need new demi-titans, we don't need new baneblades, space marines, or chaos space marines. What we need is new rules, and nothing else. What we need is so that every single unit is just as viable as the next. What we need is there to be no "bad" army. What we we need is balance, and GW sure as hell ain't giving it to us. While 8th Edition might herald a dramatic shift in the rules, m faith in GW accomplishing this with every single army is nonexistent. If they can pull it off, that'll be grand, but hope is the first step on the road to disappointment, as Dawn of War says. And I've fooled enough to know that the next time is on me.


That's just it though. Much of what you're mentioning is related to the people in your club and not GW and certainly not the BnC. The army list subs are where those things should be discussed and hashed out. Not every news and rumor thread. Letting bad rules pollute the board poisons the well for everyone not interested in rules.
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#52
Brother Chaplain Kage

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but hope is the first step on the road to disappointment to despair, as Dawn of War BCK says.

 

Fixed that for ya.

 

I wish you luck with the balance thing, Volt. I haven't seen it in nearly 20 years and it was one of the things that pushed me away from playing the game.


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dVIGLrG.png TMRPHVx.pngQiZFXmD.png

 

 

 

Hope is the first step to despair.


#53
HCMistborn

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I've begun considering taking a hold off on Warhammer until 8th edition comes around. I mean, I'll still be on here annoying you guys daily, but I think the 1000 points of marines I own will be it for now. I have friends who play magic casually, and I've been meaning to get into Imperial Assault and Armada again. I have even been thinking about picking up BoP to actually play BoP with the S.O. It's really cool having new stuff coming out, and I'm happy with how things are going, I just think smaller commitments might be in order.
What I mean is, I love the lore coming out, I think about 70% of it is cool, and that's awesome, but it's moving too much for me to anchor myself. I personally think 40k and 30k will be around for a long time, and that GW has improved a lot over the past two years. Ultimately it's personal reasons why I'm stepping away from the plastic crack right now, but I can honestly say that my love of the setting is only about half of the reason I love this IP. You guys here, even when I watch Dante burn heretics to the ground or Charlo get annoyed when people question his every dang opinion, we have a strong universal acceptance that I may hate your guts for being a secret xenos player, but dang it we are part of this niche community. Not to mention the amazing experiences of actually communicating in a casual way with an incredibly talented author(ADB) and all the awesome projects we have here at B&C, I've also found solid entertainment from youtubers who come here, or ones recommended to me through here such as Geeks40k and Miniwargaming.

I think that a lot of IPs are going through these sort of renaissance, Star Wars, Star Trek, and 40k seems to be as well, and for all these things that I've grown up loving I have sort of grabbed hold and held on for the ride. If we can get content and models even half as cool as Rogue One, then I'll be happy.
But, I'm 26 this year, been reading 40k stuff for about 13-14 years, maybe, and I think the recent stuff is cool. The supplements have wicked stories that sometimes feel a little to episodic bad guy to me, but still wicked having Magnus show up and burn it to the ground(just flavorful language).

#54
the jeske

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That's just it though. Much of what you're mentioning is related to the people in your club and not GW and certainly not the BnC. The army list subs are where those things should be discussed and hashed out. Not every news and rumor thread. Letting bad rules pollute the board poisons the well for everyone not interested in rules.

Only the list formus are realy active for good armies with lots of options. If you have an army where you can ponder using this or that unit set up [for example do I want to use 2 landspeeders as support or 1 flyer],then you can get very intersting topics in the list forums. Thing is those talks mostly happen in the faction sub sections for easier access. But what about bad  army books? There will be no talk about it in the list subforums[what for if the lists are bad], sub faction talk will be at best full of "why did they do that?". thing is the sub sections are offten read only by those faction players. Not everyone[probably no one]  reads everything on the forum. So the rumors section is more or less the only section where you can get interaction with other faction players.

Ah there is also another thing. If a book ends up being good, there will be "how to deal with X.." threads poping up, so the knowladge of a the state of a faction will be more global. If a book is bad, well if it is bad, there will be no "how to deal with X" and again the faction players would be left to brew in their own souce, if they did not point out stuff in the rumor/amicus section.


Matt Ward returns to W40k.
Roboute Guilliman practically becomes new Emperor.

Business as usual.


#55
Marshal Rohr

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That's the way the cookie crumbles. Bad books and bad lists belong in specific subs for lists and factions. Not Amicus and N&R. If people want to discuss what they read in N&R about rules or army lists, create a new thread and link to it in the N&R thread. You don't see people posting their own fanfic or modeling in N&R, rules and army lists shouldn't be any different. there shouldn't be two sets of standards.

The fall of Cadia thread is incomprehensible right now because of people fighting about rules and fluff. This perfectly illustrates my point.

Edited by Marshal Rohr, 11 January 2017 - 02:21 PM.

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#56
Arkangilos

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Yeah, I actually understand why they did that rule thing last year (that long post that a lot of us argued with about the acceptable posts). Lol.

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#57
the jeske

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The fall of Cadia thread is incomprehensible right now because of people fighting about rules and fluff. This perfectly illustrates my point.

huh.png Wait, I have read most of the thread and it seems like people are having fun.

 

 

Not Amicus and N&R. If people want to discuss what they read in N&R about rules or army lists, create a new thread and link to it in the N&R thread

 

 

Ok, but your created an echo chamber there. If only people saying "good" stuff are allowed to post in amicus or news, then your more or less locking everyone out. Plus you also have people who are not happy or question why GW did this or that, who are not playing the faction, where are those suppose to make threads? On the other faction sub forum[then they will be accused of trolling or inciting people], on their own sub forum[where it can be classed as being off topic etc]. May as well ban people from writing that they are unhappy about anything.


Matt Ward returns to W40k.
Roboute Guilliman practically becomes new Emperor.

Business as usual.


#58
Brother Antipodes

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I feel the increase in jittery, snarky posting comes down to a combination of two things (to use 40K imagery); the continuing shock wave from Hivefleet AoS devouring WFB and nervousness over the ever approaching Hivefleet 8th Edition.

While I still think B&C is an oasis of calm compared to most other W40K sites out there, there has been a noticeable tension, reflected in snarkier posts, as we edge closer to the rumoured mid-year release of the new edition. Few people love change. Add to that the possibility of "your" faction being squatted in the shuffle and feelings run high. This is only exacerbated by the fate of WFB being fresh in people's minds.

#59
Marshal Rohr

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The fall of Cadia thread is incomprehensible right now because of people fighting about rules and fluff. This perfectly illustrates my point.

:huh: Wait, I have read most of the thread and it seems like people are having fun.
 

 
Not Amicus and N&R. If people want to discuss what they read in N&R about rules or army lists, create a new thread and link to it in the N&R thread

 
Ok, but your created an echo chamber there. If only people saying "good" stuff are allowed to post in amicus or news, then your more or less locking everyone out. Plus you also have people who are not happy or question why GW did this or that, who are not playing the faction, where are those suppose to make threads? On the other faction sub forum[then they will be accused of trolling or inciting people], on their own sub forum[where it can be classed as being off topic etc]. May as well ban people from writing that they are unhappy about anything.

Any detailed discussions of fluff or rules should be in the appropriate sub. N&R should be rumors and comments. Not arguments and internet genital measuring.

#60
Venomlust

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Rare forays into Dakka territory make the comparison to B&C like night and day, to my perception. I think there are very few frater here who are habitually unpleasant, especially when they're disagreeing with people or when their "expertise" of the fluff (makes me roll my eyes so hard) isn't even drawn into question, but the opportunity to show it off is present while simultaneously telling someone why they're wrong. Even here, as I've said in the past, I believe it comes down to lack of social skills in the sense that some people don't consider how their words will affect others, as opposed to deliberately bringing other people down.

 

Anyway, the negative reactions don't really bother me at all, except in situations where certain now-banned CSM-playing frater had to poison every new release thread with whining about CSM. If someone likes what GW's putting out and voices their feelings, cool. If they don't like what GW is doing and voices their feelings, cool. I appreciate most points of view, and the concepts of a negative echo chamber and fanboyism are two sides of the same coin, as far as I'm concerned. In reality, I think reactions fall somewhere in the middle. Most people like some stuff, and don't like other stuff. Wow, what an earth-shattering revelation. Most can voice their opinions in a way that isn't obnoxious.

 

And those that can't, I just roll my eyes and move on. I realize that everyone is different. Some people rely more on the reactions and emotions of others to maintain their own optimism, excitement, etc. Personally, if I don't like something, I do my best to move past it without letting it get to me. I don't always succeed, but that's the goal. Especially on a forum dedicated to a game (which isn't to say I don't value the obscene amount of time I spend browsing here). I recommend doing the same, though I admit if the negativity were truly pervasive as it is in certain sections of Dakka, I just wouldn't visit at all. We all have to draw the line somewhere.

 

I hope that stream of consciousness made sense, and that someone out there can identify with it.


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#61
Volt

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Rare forays into Dakka territory make the comparison to B&C like night and day, to my perception. I think there are very few frater here who are habitually unpleasant, especially when they're disagreeing with people or when their "expertise" of the fluff (makes me roll my eyes so hard) isn't even drawn into question, but the opportunity to show it off is present while simultaneously telling someone why they're wrong. Even here, as I've said in the past, I believe it comes down to lack of social skills in the sense that some people don't consider how their words will affect others, as opposed to deliberately bringing other people down.

 

Anyway, the negative reactions don't really bother me at all, except in situations where certain now-banned CSM-playing frater had to poison every new release thread with whining about CSM. If someone likes what GW's putting out and voices their feelings, cool. If they don't like what GW is doing and voices their feelings, cool. I appreciate most points of view, and the concepts of a negative echo chamber and fanboyism are two sides of the same coin, as far as I'm concerned. In reality, I think reactions fall somewhere in the middle. Most people like some stuff, and don't like other stuff. Wow, what an earth-shattering revelation. Most can voice their opinions in a way that isn't obnoxious.

 

And those that can't, I just roll my eyes and move on. I realize that everyone is different. Some people rely more on the reactions and emotions of others to maintain their own optimism, excitement, etc. Personally, if I don't like something, I do my best to move past it without letting it get to me. I don't always succeed, but that's the goal. Especially on a forum dedicated to a game (which isn't to say I don't value the obscene amount of time I spend browsing here). I recommend doing the same, though I admit if the negativity were truly pervasive as it is in certain sections of Dakka, I just wouldn't visit at all. We all have to draw the line somewhere.

 

I hope that stream of consciousness made sense, and that someone out there can identify with it.

I made to move to B&C as my primary 40k forum from Dakka for the exact same reasons.


Edited by Volt, 12 January 2017 - 10:43 PM.

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#62
Ishagu

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I've noticed that discussions seem more charged, but I also think the hobby is in a more exciting place that has the side effect of making people both anxious and impatient.

I certainly feel that I'm disagreeing with people more, and they with me, though I also feel that things will soon become more positive once 8th edition drops in June :-)

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