Jump to content

Welcome to The Bolter and Chainsword
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

So... the Grand Crusade


  • Please log in to reply
29 replies to this topic

#1
Immersturm

Immersturm

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,310 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany

For those who are yet unaware of the new detachments: http://imgur.com/a/4ypvF

 

Looks like you can now run a full-on Crusade. Both Crusade Detachments seem to be reasonably playable at 1850 points. Wrathful Crusade might be iffy, because no one liked to be led by a Witch (I do accept the Saint though, but I am as bias as one can be when it comes to Living Saints), but the re-roll of charges might be cool.

 

The Castellan Detachment seems more like it. Forget Zealot. Taking the full selection and have a coherent army will not be possible below 3000pts. However, you can freely mix Imperial Guard and Templars with potentially respawning Troops choices. Go for Drop Pod assault supported by Scion strike teams and flyers or go for the good ol' rush le bum with Crusaders and an Imperial Tank line. So many combinations are possible and open really fun new lists that weren't possible with allies due to the tax involved.

Troops returning on a 5+ seems more of a nice-to-have bonus than a real strategy. However, there is a decent chance, that a Land Raider Crusader or a Crusader blob will return and the odd Veteran Squad or Chimera is bound to pop up again here or there.

 

So, what do you guys think. I think it is super cool to be able to run a coherent crusade. It might not crush tournaments in a consistent manner, but it might just be the most fun thing ever, so who cares :D

 


  • Gendo likes this

Be excellent to one another, and lean on your brothers and sisters when your patience grows slim

 


#2
Sete

Sete

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 6,116 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars/Grey Talons
I'm sure as hell I won't be taking a witch.

Self hating or not.

Castellans tho I will roll.

#3
Immersturm

Immersturm

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,310 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany

Castellans is just so fun and flexible. Take your Wyvern and Baneblades, take your respawning Land Raiders, take your Veterans and Vendettas and go to town :D


Be excellent to one another, and lean on your brothers and sisters when your patience grows slim

 


#4
Sete

Sete

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 6,116 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars/Grey Talons
Man I can take my Ordo Xenos Inq and add whatever I want in the same detachment.
It's awesome.
Also in the Castellans we have the Only SM IC that can be taken.
We can truly reanact Helsreach now.
Tempestus, Sisters and Grimaldus

Edited by Sete, 11 January 2017 - 09:49 AM.

  • Honda likes this

#5
Sete

Sete

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 6,116 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars/Grey Talons
Double post my bad.

Edited by Sete, 11 January 2017 - 09:48 AM.


#6
Marshal_Roujakis

Marshal_Roujakis

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 3,504 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Australia
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars Chapter

Double post my bad.

 

In my opinion, worth posting twice...

 

Those are some sweet rules... but Chaplains get the useless bat yet again... I mean you could field Grimaldus, but apart from the Cenobyte, there's only but a minimal difference (and a lot of points) between him and a Chaplain with a Plasma Pistol... but FnP + Relic which gives 6+ Invulnerable Save sort of reminds me of Uphold the Honour of the Emperor...


'No matter the laurels of victory, no matter the glories others may seek. We are Space Marines, the Adeptus Astartes, the Angels of Death! And more than this.' he said, his voice dropping quiet. 

'We are Black Templars. Victory is its own reward.' - High Marshal Helbrecht - 'The Crusader' - Crusade to the Ghoul Stars -

 

Spoiler

 

The Vengeance Crusade Thread


#7
Immersturm

Immersturm

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,310 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany

You can join Celestine with Grimaldus and his Cenobite Kids Club for extra tankiness and holiness overload while a hoard of raging Crusader run up the board support by Imperial big guns.


  • Honda likes this

Be excellent to one another, and lean on your brothers and sisters when your patience grows slim

 


#8
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

Well, here's how I'd deal with the Castellan special rule : don't destroy the drop pod.

 

You have 5 marines in a drop pod on an objective, they are not "objective secured". Kill the marines, move in with your own obsec unit, ignore the pod, win. Same applies to a rhino. For an LRC, it is arguably a bit more complicated, but if you can cripple it...


And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#9
Immersturm

Immersturm

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,310 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany

Well, here's how I'd deal with the Castellan special rule : don't destroy the drop pod.

 

You have 5 marines in a drop pod on an objective, they are not "objective secured". Kill the marines, move in with your own obsec unit, ignore the pod, win. Same applies to a rhino. For an LRC, it is arguably a bit more complicated, but if you can cripple it...

 

That won't work. The rule says whenever a Troops unit dies, not Troops choice or slot. So when the unit from the Pod dies, that is a unit to roll for and if the dedicated Pod gets destroyed, you roll as well. They are two separate units, just occupying the same slot. Hence, if the Pod comes back, it will drop down empty and the contents of the Pod would need to walk on.


Be excellent to one another, and lean on your brothers and sisters when your patience grows slim

 


#10
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

I guess that's fair enough. But in that case, you better hope for some good "Run" rolls (the crusader rule will help) to get that unit back where it may be needed. 


And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#11
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

On the plus side, the inquisition relic sword is pretty sweet, almost as good as the Burning Blade for half the cost.


And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#12
SydonianDragoon404

SydonianDragoon404

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 253 posts

On the plus side, the inquisition relic sword is pretty sweet, almost as good as the Burning Blade for half the cost.

Actually I would say it's better than the burning blade, no chance to hurt yourself and IIRC the burning blade is strength 5. 

 

Also we're gonna need an official ruling/FAQ on the respawning troops/transports rule. Every power gamer at my local will try to lawyer me out of getting my LRC back. 

 

Another note- The Castellans of the Imperium calls itself a Detachment, but it doesn't allow you take formations within it. All other "Detachments" as seen before were basically a benefit for taking certain formations together. Why abandon that formula now? I would have liked this to be a detachment in the classic sense so I could give formation units Hatred. 


Edited by SydonianDragoon404, 11 January 2017 - 03:07 PM.


#13
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

 

On the plus side, the inquisition relic sword is pretty sweet, almost as good as the Burning Blade for half the cost.

Actually I would say it's better than the burning blade, no chance to hurt yourself and IIRC the burning blade is strength 5.

 

Nope, it's S+3 (therefore S7 in most cases)


And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#14
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

One other thing I hadn't noticed at first glance : in the castellans of the imperium detachment, the only SPace Marines named HQ allowed are templars. Generic HQs (captain, chaplain, techmarine, librarian) are available, but no Lysander, Kantor, etc... 


And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#15
Link2edition

Link2edition

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 491 posts

@Ciler I was sort of hoping that Tactical Squads were not allowed out of spite.


  • Honda and Gendo like this

#16
Arthanor

Arthanor

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,454 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Subsector Laurentia
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

That castellan detachment is pretty cool. Needs two factions, but with an inquisitor + BT you've got that for an almost exclusively BT force. As for it giving a hit to chaplains, well that is true, but hatred on everyone is pretty much like a chaplain in every squad. As for the lovely models, they fit as captains/CM, honour guards or vanguards with power maces.
 
One thing I'm not sure: Can you take two chapters of SM (say.. BT + IF) and have that count as the two factions? Would be neat for things like BT + Celestial Lions, or BT + IFs at Cadia.
 

Another note- The Castellans of the Imperium calls itself a Detachment, but it doesn't allow you take formations within it. All other "Detachments" as seen before were basically a benefit for taking certain formations together. Why abandon that formula now? I would have liked this to be a detachment in the classic sense so I could give formation units Hatred.


Err... what? Have you forgotten the good ol' Combined Arms Detachment, or the Allied Detachment (and I think there's the inquisitorial detachment as well, the 1+ inquisitor and 0+ elites). None of those are made up of formations. The detachments of formations are a rather funky thing and I'd much rather a return to detachments of units only. Many of the recent formations, with their variable composition, are pretty much that too so could be transferred over easily and we could go back to games with detachments and units instead of the current mess of Formations of units, Detachments of Formations of units and Detachments of units.


Marshal of the Laurentia Crusade - Recruitment (WIP)         My DIY: The Radiant Light
Want to know what to expect of your dice? Join us in Arthanor's Mathhammer corner!

gallery_45662_7420_40448.jpg
Life is the Emperor's currency, spend it well.


#17
Vaughn

Vaughn

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 262 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars and Dark Angels
I'd take the castellan's formation with sisters as the other faction. I'd then pepper a handful of ministorium priests from the imperial agents book as allies to buff the kills potential of the Templar

Terminator assault squads with rerollable saves is lethal.
  • Honda likes this

"Trust in the Emperor at the hour of battle.
Trust to him to intercede, and protect his warriors true as they deal death on alien soil.
Turn their seas to red with the blood of their slain.
Crush their hopes, their dreams
And turn their songs into cries of lamentation."
- "Uphold the honour of the Emperor", vow of the Black Templars


#18
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars

I'd take the castellan's formation with sisters as the other faction. I'd then pepper a handful of ministorium priests from the imperial agents book as allies to buff the kills potential of the Templar

Terminator assault squads with rerollable saves is lethal.

Actually that's a good point. This detachment allows for a perfectly legitimate 1 BT Marshal + 3 priests + 4 crusader squads without any allied detachment tax. However, the hatred bonus gets wasted since it's provided in a better form by the priests anyway...


And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#19
Link2edition

Link2edition

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 491 posts

I disagree, my las-plas and heavy weapon squads need that hatred buff for when they charge into close combat too!



#20
Immersturm

Immersturm

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,310 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany

I disagree, my las-plas and heavy weapon squads need that hatred buff for when they charge into close combat too!

 

Good point. The Razorback needs Hatred. The driver wants to hit them with his sword :D


  • Honda and Link2edition like this

Be excellent to one another, and lean on your brothers and sisters when your patience grows slim

 


#21
Bastian

Bastian

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 10 posts
  • Gender:Male
Based on this Force Org, would we be able to use other vehicles transport capacity to embark? Technically the armies are no longer Allies, but share a common list, and some units offer transport capacity from their respective slots.

I.e. Troop Guard squad in HS Land Raider, Troop Crusaders in FA Taurox

Thoughts?

#22
_Dalion_

_Dalion_

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 26 posts

Based on this Force Org, would we be able to use other vehicles transport capacity to embark? Technically the armies are no longer Allies, but share a common list, and some units offer transport capacity from their respective slots.
I.e. Troop Guard squad in HS Land Raider, Troop Crusaders in FA Taurox
Thoughts?


I guess you are r right. Or do i miss something as it is the same detachment?

#23
Ciler

Ciler

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Chapter Name: Black Templars
To be honest, I don't think there ever was a problem with that. The only issue is with doing that during deployment (which if I read the FAQ right you can't do).
And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. Revelations 6:8
Album link, Thread on the BT subforum

#24
Bastian

Bastian

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 10 posts
  • Gender:Male

To be honest, I don't think there ever was a problem with that. The only issue is with doing that during deployment (which if I read the FAQ right you can't do).

In this regard, what about vehicles that start in reserves?
We see a case where SM players put Centurions in a Pod and thats legal being from the same Codex. So with this Detachment could cross transports with the restriction that they would be embarked after the deployment phase?

And double checking the FAQ states: "Can units that are Battle Brothers embark in each other’s Transport vehicles during deployment?
A: No."

So in this case would the "Battle Brothers" ally classification exist since units are from one universal detachment?

Edited by Bastian, 11 January 2017 - 06:10 PM.


#25
Link2edition

Link2edition

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 491 posts

All I know is this next round of crusaders will be painted while listening to the "DOOM" soundtrack to enhance their deamonslaying capabilities.


  • Gendo and varg_vikernes like this




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users