Thousand Sons in Shadow War Armageddon

[bozo69pd]

So I have a Shadow War Armageddon tourney in a few weeks. I would like to bring my Thousand Sons since they never get play, but I am not sure if 5 marines with inferno bolters and ther 5+ invuln are going to be any good. I have yet to play a game of shadow war or necromunda even though I own the books.

 

Was going to give the champion a powersword to try to actually get a melee kill, but maybe I should not, and bring 1 less rubricae for 2 autogun cultists instead?

 

Or I could just go nurgle champ supported by like 10 cultists. What are other people doing?

[Prot]

Well I am planning on running Thousand Sons for this week too. And I just want that invulnerable save wherever I can get it. I planned on maybe 2 Bolter marines with inferno bolts but I wanted cultists in there for certain. I don't even know what legally constitutes a list yet but I like the idea of spawn too, especially if they can take the mark.

 

For cheap meat I planned on Tzaangors counting as vanilla cultists with combat blades. One traditional cultist with flamer and maybe a shotgun if it fits into 1000 points. Again I really don't know the legal requirements yet to field them.

[Plaguecaster]

Here is the rules/ armylist for fielding a chaos team

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Faction_Support_CSM.pdf

Unfortunately cultist can't take any of the special weapons (no Flamers or stubbers :( ) they can take shotguns though :D spawn are operatives too so none of those to start with unless you use the caches you unlock whilst playing a campaign

[bozo69pd]

Tzangors is a great idea for cultists, I should paint mine and do that. Inferno bolt bolters look like they are pretty strong, that's why I was hoping 4 inferno bolter tzeentch marines + a powersword tzeentch champion would be awesome. I still have 5 points left over, maybe camogear? Not sure what that does. If it turns out having more bodies is more important than I wonder if an army of just cultists is superior lol.

[Prot]

Ah I just read the rules for chaos and was really disappointed to see that only specialists can even take a mark. Bummer.

[bozo69pd]

Ah I just read the rules for chaos and was really disappointed to see that only specialists can even take a mark. Bummer.

? wut?

 

It says marks apply to all Chaos marines and not cultists, on the left side there.

[Panzer]

Ah I just read the rules for chaos and was really disappointed to see that only specialists can even take a mark. Bummer.

Seriously now, that rumour has to die. It's wrong lol.

EVERYONE except for cultists can take a mark. It's your kill teams special rule. The only reason it's mentioned seperately for the Special Operators is because they aren't regular members of your kill team in the first place.

Also please say Special Operator, Spec-Ops, Mercenary or whatever if you talk about those but not Specialist. Specialists are the ones who can take the big guns in our kill team.

[Prot]

I had no idea it was a rumour. I just read the sidebar that refers to a special rule called mark of chaos. Then I noticed no one has that rule until you get to the Specialists which have specific references to Mark of Chaos special rule.

 

It's not a rumour. It's as plain as day. I kept looking for the other units to have it and thought I was going crazy but I can't find it under any other chaos unit heading.

 

Please correct me if I've missed something.

[Panzer]

It's not very clear but very easy actually. It's your factions rule. Everyone has that rule. There wouldn't be a need to exclude Cultists if they had to mention it seperately for every unit entry in the first place.

What's written on that left half of that page counts for the whole page as it is with every other SWA kill team (or else no one would have ATSKNF, Synapse, Supporting Fire, etc. etc.)

[Prot]

It's not very clear but very easy actually. It's your factions rule. Everyone has that rule. There wouldn't be a need to exclude Cultists if they had to mention it seperately for every unit entry in the first place.

What's written on that left half of that page counts for the whole page as it is with every other SWA kill team (or else no one would have ATSKNF, Synapse, Supporting Fire, etc. etc.)

 

Okay then that's weird they chose to mention it just on a few entries, but I see what you mean. (It seems redundant to have "Mark of Chaos" put on some of them, but then I see some people arguing they aren't "Chaos Space Marines" so maybe that's why it's done like that.)

 

So this also means while it applies to the 'faction' it does seem specific to 'marines' and doesn't include Cultists.

[Panzer]

Yeah it's not worded very well. Just one more thing that indicates for me that those are just temporary rules until GW releases an expansion eventually....hopefully. :D

[Lord Abaia]

Okay so the rule Marks of Chaos "applies to all members of a Chaos Space Marines kill team, other than cultists." This includes the Kill Team Leader (aspiring champion), Troopers (chaos space marines, but not promoted cultists) and Specialists (chaos gunners).

 

In addition all of the Special Operatives (raptor, chaos terminator, and spawn) have "pick a mark of chaos" listed as part of their wargear. This does not invalidate the Mark of Chaos rule just because the kill team members I listed above do not have it in their wargear list. I believe the reason that they added marks of chaos to the wargear of the Special Operatives is that it is doubtful if they count as "members of a Chaos Space Marines kill team."

 

It would be really stupid otherwise as none of the Special Operatives have access to ammunition or grenades lists so Inferno Bolts and Blight Grenades would be unusable by anyone.

[Panzer]

That's pretty much what I said, yeah. ^^

[Lord Abaia]

Well I didn't pick the name Magpie because I don't steal people's stuff. ;)

[Lucio]

I'm torn between Thousand Sons and Nurgle for my team of Power Armoured wearing "Chaos" Space Marines that were inspired by Vulkgoff...
 

[Aasfresser]

I'm really desperate to get something tzeentchy for SWA. But like in 40K everything TS is so expensive. And I can't assess how well CSM in general will fare in SWA. The lack of magics bums me out a bit, too. 

 

Have any of you already played a game with TS?

[Panzer]

I'm really desperate to get something tzeentchy for SWA. But like in 40K everything TS is so expensive. And I can't assess how well CSM in general will fare in SWA. The lack of magics bums me out a bit, too. 

 

Have any of you already played a game with TS?

Well it's really more generic Tzeentch CSM than TS anyway.

I don't think the 5++ will get used all that often. It takes a -3 modifier to make your armor worse than your invulnerable save.

 

And about them being more expensive? Not really. Considering that you'd have to buy a Pistol + Chainsword/Assault Blade to build a proper melee guy then a Bolter+Inferno ammunition Tzeentch guy costs about the same. PA Marines are quite expensive in SW:A no matter what and that's a good thing imo. ;)

 

I just barely fit in 5 CSM in my team and for that I had to give up on a heavy weapon. So my plan is to buy one asap. While a Flamer Nurgle guy is cool&fun, i really want that Autocannon Nurgle guy. :P

[bozo69pd]

I'm really desperate to get something tzeentchy for SWA. But like in 40K everything TS is so expensive. And I can't assess how well CSM in general will fare in SWA. The lack of magics bums me out a bit, too.

Have any of you already played a game with TS?

Well it's really more generic Tzeentch CSM than TS anyway.

I don't think the 5++ will get used all that often. It takes a -3 modifier to make your armor worse than your invulnerable save.

And about them being more expensive? Not really. Considering that you'd have to buy a Pistol + Chainsword/Assault Blade to build a proper melee guy then a Bolter+Inferno ammunition Tzeentch guy costs about the same. PA Marines are quite expensive in SW:A no matter what and that's a good thing imo.

I just barely fit in 5 CSM in my team and for that I had to give up on a heavy weapon. So my plan is to buy one asap. While a Flamer Nurgle guy is cool&fun, i really want that Autocannon Nurgle guy.

My nurgle gunner is a Heavy Bolter guy

I think the 5++ could get used considering autocannon and powersword are -3? I live in an Eldar and SM meta.

However in my experience with daemons... when your life is hanging on to a 5++ save, then make sure your affairs are all in order.

[Panzer]

I'm really desperate to get something tzeentchy for SWA. But like in 40K everything TS is so expensive. And I can't assess how well CSM in general will fare in SWA. The lack of magics bums me out a bit, too.

Have any of you already played a game with TS?

Well it's really more generic Tzeentch CSM than TS anyway.

I don't think the 5++ will get used all that often. It takes a -3 modifier to make your armor worse than your invulnerable save.

And about them being more expensive? Not really. Considering that you'd have to buy a Pistol + Chainsword/Assault Blade to build a proper melee guy then a Bolter+Inferno ammunition Tzeentch guy costs about the same. PA Marines are quite expensive in SW:A no matter what and that's a good thing imo.

I just barely fit in 5 CSM in my team and for that I had to give up on a heavy weapon. So my plan is to buy one asap. While a Flamer Nurgle guy is cool&fun, i really want that Autocannon Nurgle guy.

My nurgle gunner is a Heavy Bolter guy

I think the 5++ could get used considering autocannon and powersword are -3? I live in an Eldar and SM meta.

However in my experience with daemons... when your life is hanging on to a 5++ save, then make sure your affairs are all in order.

Yeah there are some -3 weapons in every faction list iirc so it might come in handy in a full Tzeentch list.

In my case with a mixed list however those weapons would probably just not shoot at the Tzeentch guy unless I force him to do so by outpositioning him...which is a lot of efford for a 5+ save over a 6+ save. :D

[Prot]

I wanted to stick to Thousand Sons but I may not.

 

I was going to use a Rubric Sorc as 'leader' with power weapon/bolter. Rubric with Soulreaper as Heavy Bolter. Rubric with Bolter with Psyshots. And some Cultists I have no idea what to do with.*Unmarked

 

But I think Nurgle is the way to go with some Slaanesh sprinkled in. I'll see... I'm not too inspired by the Thousand Sons right now.

[Lucio]

For more traditional CSM forces, I can't help but think that the CSM Cultist Assault box is an ideal starting point

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/CSM-Cultists-Assault

 

A CSM Leader, with a bunch of Cultists seems an ideal fluffy force to descend into the Promethium stacks. The cultists screening their master from the enemy guns. Over time, maybe add in a Heavy Weapons trooper with a plasma gun or meltagun to provide some additional support.

[Excessus]

Yeah it's not worded very well. 

 

Business as usual... :D

 

I think the extra save modifier will do a lot more than people think, opponents will be more wary of open ground and will feel the need to skulk around behind cover and thereby limiting themselves of line of sight and stuff.

[Raven1]

For more traditional CSM forces, I can't help but think that the CSM Cultist Assault box is an ideal starting point

 

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/CSM-Cultists-Assault

 

A CSM Leader, with a bunch of Cultists seems an ideal fluffy force to descend into the Promethium stacks. The cultists screening their master from the enemy guns. Over time, maybe add in a Heavy Weapons trooper with a plasma gun or meltagun to provide some additional support.

Not really, cultists count as recruits and cant make up more than 50% of the kill team. You end up buying as many csm as you can and then adding cultists as your campaign goes on.

[Prot]

I think you're right Lucio but like Raven says, I don't think you want to start out like that. But it is a great box set to create a good heal of your team from. Even the appearance of some of the cultists for loadout is good. Stuff like axes, auto pistols etc.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

So just had a game, leader with bolt pistol, two marines with boltguns, inferno bolts and camo gear and one gunner with heavy bolter, photo zisor and camo gear, was against Grey knights, one with staff, 2 with swords and one with Psylancer.
Won handily, my heavy bolter suppressed my opponents movement as he was terrified of exposing his men to it, whilst the inferno bolts allowed the two bolter marines to cut knock out two of his guys quickly, meaning when he did expose his gunner to try and take on my heavy bolter and was put down the game ended.
managed to get a skill roll for my gunner and ended up with marksmen on him.

camo gear didn't do anything at all so tempted to drop it.
Now trying to decide what to get, as I ended up with three promethium cathes, I'm thinking of spending two to get either another rubric marine with inferno bolter, photo visor and camo gear, a gunner with flamer and photo visors for both the marines with bolt guns, or maybe go crazy and spend all three and get a gunner with either an autocannon (soulreaper) wiith photo visor and camo gear or plasma or melta gun and splurge on upgrades for every one else.