robofish7591 Posted May 12, 2017 Share Posted May 12, 2017 Its a shame they stopped selling the deathwatch landraider. Having all the options to magnetize sure is nice With the new twinlinking rules, the crusader should be hilarious against characters trying to hide in the middle of units. Just blast the unit away with bolters and assault cannons, then pop the character with the multi melta! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irbis Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 I am pretty sure you can't "save" any guns to wait and see how you do, it's all or nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobius0288 Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 I am pretty sure you can't "save" any guns to wait and see how you do, it's all or nothing. It's not a matter of "saving" your guns. A character has to be the closest enemy for you to be able to shoot at it, hence the reason he said blast away the other units first. The only problem is now you'd be targeting a different unit... so that land raider doesn't shoot again unless they bring back split fire for some of the units. Still, it's going to be wonderful in killing off high wound characters or big squads. I wounder if they will have any kind of advantage for trying to take the bigger squads of units. With the morale thing, seems like we'll just see 5 models per unit all the way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Avoghai Posted May 14, 2017 Share Posted May 14, 2017 It's not a crusader Prot but a prometheus from FW. 24 shot of Twinlinked HB goodness I understand that, but I think forgeworld really has to get their act together for Deathwatch. We've had entire threads dedicated to the subject and FW has been completely unresponsive to requests for 'official' rules on their product for DW. I actually think the only reason They did not include deathwatch is because they released the imperial armour book before the DW codex and then didn't update because they knew v8 was in preparation... I'm fully optimistic concerning tanks avaibility for DW ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted May 15, 2017 Author Share Posted May 15, 2017 We need some hard examples of how all this will work now some of the stuff looks like it could be good but some of the stuff looks way odd the Multi-Melta at 27 points for instance its only 24" range and needing to be 12" to get the bonus 2d6 take the highest We have in our group Tau players licking their lips at the thought of Missile Broadside spam as they used to be twin linked as did a lot of the drones if that translates into double shot -1 for moving + they get split fire & they keep marker lights as well as interceptor then broadsides will be pushing out so much spam we'll be back to square 1 as we were with 7th unable to move anywhere or do anything tactical. Its gotten so if I get 1st turn against Tau I don't shoot just turbo all my Rhino's across the board as I only get to use them the 1 turn and if I don't have 1st turn I may as well pack my models away all in all V Tau the games have been rubbish win or loose. We saw with the Riptide wing how abusive smart missile spam was pushing everyone away from anything that didn't get a 3+ save On the one hand GW are saying you cant target characters yet in the other breath apparently snipers can and given the fact a lot of bread and butter characters such as Librarians & Chaplains only have a 3+ save and 2 wounds their not going to last on the battlefield 5 minutes. This tinkering goes on we now have he who charges goes 1st then a way of turning the tables using command points so how does that work you charge eat a boatfull of overwatch only to get dumped on by command points? Can you re-turn the tables by using your own command point to block it? Hopefully everything will get costed appropriately unfortunately its going to take a while to trust anyone with the casual play system given the formation madness we have at the moment. I just get this nagging itch that says GW can't stop tinkering and going ooo that's fluffy even though we've had confirmation that anything spawned has to be paid for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyadventurer Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Dudes. Behold the dawn of the age of the combi-weapon. Unlimited shots Fire both parts of weapon at same time with -1 to hit, so fire plasma gun and some special issue ammo too just to make sure. Artemis is back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted May 15, 2017 Author Share Posted May 15, 2017 Dudes. Behold the dawn of the age of the combi-weapon. Unlimited shots Fire both parts of weapon at same time with -1 to hit, so fire plasma gun and some special issue ammo too just to make sure. Artemis is back! Tried playing him the other day he got out of his Rhino with a squad to clear out some Marines then got smashed by Stormraven after the squad suffered a direct hit with a Thunderfire cannon. I know its a 1 in 3 chance of a hit but the guy rolled a direct hit 5 turns in a row with it completely overloading squads with wounds 3+ armour on a 145 point model is pants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leth Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 They have basically said twinlinking is just a double shot profile so we can extrapolate that outwards. However for the other weapons we have no idea how they will work going forward. SMS will probably keep a similar profile but its special rules might be different and it is only wounding +3 on 3+ instead of 2+. So Str 5 is not as much of a huge advantage like it used to be. Still useful but not so universally better than everything else. Outside of knowing how this will be on the d3/d6 schedule we can guess most profiles for weapons(unless once again they get rejiggered). I am just glad that I MIGHT be able to play a land raider again, it is sad that I was always more worried about the terrain taking me out of the fight than the actual enemy....... As we saw from the reaper chain sword, A Ex D weapon, that it does a fixed 6 wounds. From that I will reasonably guess that no weapon will do more than 6 wounds with any attack. So no vehicle we have seen to date can be one shot(maybe things like land speeders and sentinels will probably have 5 wounds or so, but that is fine). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irbis Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 As we saw from the reaper chain sword, A Ex D weapon, that it does a fixed 6 wounds. From that I will reasonably guess that no weapon will do more than 6 wounds with any attack. So no vehicle we have seen to date can be one shot(maybe things like land speeders and sentinels will probably have 5 wounds or so, but that is fine). I really wouldn't bet on that. Titan guns and CCW weapons will probably do 12+. Then, there is Kelly who will find the way to make Eldar broken somehow. Watch out for distort guns now doing 20 wounds Then there is the thing I was imagining this morning, Paskisher. 20 shots on main gun, 9 more in 3x HB, 3 more in top Heavy Stubber. 32 shots hitting on 3+, wounding everything lighter than T10 on 5+, and if he keeps rending, 5-6 wounds will be at -4 save, so pretty much oneshotting everything we saw so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted May 20, 2017 Author Share Posted May 20, 2017 I'm optimistic that things should start OK but it will depend on how stuff is pointed Also the ability to take multiple spam units through formations and ditch troops entierly doesn't help. Things like LOW are supposed to be rare but comps seem fixated with allowing knight formations multi Surge lists etc.. Anyways for normal games we will see how it pans out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted May 30, 2017 Author Share Posted May 30, 2017 Just seen the points for Sternguard there 16 & Vanguard are the same (except +2 for Jump Packs), normal marines are 13 Special Issue Boltgun is +3 & stats are 30" rapid fire S4 -2 Chainsword is 0 points Power swords are 4pts and a combi-plasma is 15 with the melta version costing 19 You only get shred for 2 Lightning claws (sigh will have to start remodelling already) Storm shields are only 5pts though Captains have come down while Librarians seem to have gone up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macabre Slanneshi Prince Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 Those are the normal marine rules, apparently Deathwatch get different ammo. Lightning Claws always have shred, 2 gives extra attack IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vel'Cona Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 Yup, that's exactly right on LC. Interesting that they have Power Axe AP, which means they're not necessarily better than a Power Sword or Maul outright. As for the Special Issue Bolter, I'd be interested to see if DW really will get a different flavour. Combi-weapons are definitely far more expensive, though, while PWs and variants have all universally had a massive point decrease. The Power Axe in particular is an insanely good bargain for the killing power it brings, though I'm excited to see what the Heavy Thunder Hammer does given how mighty the one-handed version is now! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macabre Slanneshi Prince Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 It does mean that Lightning Claws are going to be better than Axes, typically. A reroll is almost always better than +1 to wound, except when you're at a 6+ to wound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vel'Cona Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 It does mean that Lightning Claws are going to be better than Axes, typically. A reroll is almost always better than +1 to wound, except when you're at a 6+ to wound. That's true. Probably why they priced them nearly twice as much! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irbis Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Eh, I think the pricing is the fault of new points system, which is kinda dumb. Price claws low enough to be viable on sarges and every single vanguard and terminator will have them. Price them to balance them for assault units, it's going to be dead plastic for everyone else. Why they couldn't go back to 5th edition way of pricing? It was perfect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vel'Cona Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 Eh, I think the pricing is the fault of new points system, which is kinda dumb. Price claws low enough to be viable on sarges and every single vanguard and terminator will have them. Price them to balance them for assault units, it's going to be dead plastic for everyone else. Why they couldn't go back to 5th edition way of pricing? It was perfect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanewatts Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 Anyone notice that power fists and thunder hammers cost the same amount of points now? D3 damage vs 3 damage Looks like its time to rip off some power fists. Unless I am missing something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moostick Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 Yeah, I noticed the same and chalked it down to "not everyone can take TH"...except us DW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanewatts Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 Kinda glad I didn't model any grav guns on my vets, since grav is so outclassed now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irbis Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 Snarky pics aside, I do really love how 5th edition books were laid out. No dumb armoury page requiring you to flip back and forth, points of everything were on unit's entry, and the costs were tailored to unit (why librarian pays same costs for wargear as chapter master with twice the WS, BS, W and A, again?). How the hell GW managed to get this backwards and wrong for three editions now after they hit gold everyone liked is beyond me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vel'Cona Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 The community is actively working to create supplementary materials to ease army creation. I'm not saying it's a perfect workaround but the fact that GW has implied that "sharing" the rules is OK means we're open to build whatever we need to meet the demands of competitive play and army building. I do agree that list building was easier in 5th edition, but there were also far less units back then and there were many options not available that had entries in codexes. So I'd say what we have now is a pretty significant improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leth Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 For me personally I think it is just that we are required to re-learn a bunch of stuff. I know in my head plasma pistols are 15, lascannons are 25, missiles are 15, etc. Once I have started learning the points costs of upgrades the new system is actually pretty easy. Much less flipping back and forth is necessary and once I build a list I can just print off the unit pages for the models I am using and bring that with my list instead of having to carry around everything else. Seriously considering getting a lamination kit so I can laminate certain pages at home and just put them on a ring when I bring them to a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kargrym Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 So... Cyclone Missile Launch is OBSCENELY expensive. Better to have a missile launcher on a Vet. I can't think of a single reason to have CML on a Terminator. Which sucks cause I have to cut 3 off the Terminators I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted June 5, 2017 Author Share Posted June 5, 2017 So... Cyclone Missile Launch is OBSCENELY expensive. Better to have a missile launcher on a Vet. I can't think of a single reason to have CML on a Terminator. Which sucks cause I have to cut 3 off the Terminators I have. Put them with a Stalker squad 2 shots range and minus to the AP they are really good and D6 wounds is a real harsh thing, a Rhino has 10 wounds so a these sort of weapons are clutch. Don't forget unlimited split fire is now a thing and Marines in cover get +1 to their save Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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