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8th Edition: Close Combat Weapons


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#1
Imeran

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Let’s take a look at some close combat weapons, shall we?

We’ve seen already that shooting weapons in the new Warhammer 40,000 use a Strength, AP, Damage system, and melee kit is much the same. The main differences being that there is no range on them, and a lot of them will use the user’s Strength as their basis.

Let’s look at some examples – we’ll start with the classic power weapon lineup.

New40kCCWPowerWeapons.jpg

In the current edition of Warhammer 40,000, the axe is the go-to weapon for a lot of folks. Players gladly took the unwieldy rule in exchange for AP2 and a bonus to Strength. Now, the obvious choice is far from obvious, as they clearly all have their uses. That sword, for example, is looking pretty deadly against most things, with the AP-3 helping it against every type of foe. Even with no bonus to Strength, using the new wounding chart shows that a Strength 4 Space Marine is wounding everything up to Toughness 7 on 5s (which is good,  because a lot of our models have swords).

Even the humble chainsword gets a boost. No longer just a standard combat weapon, the iconic combat weapon wielded by the Adeptus Astartes and many other forces, now gives its bearer more attacks in combat. Perfect for grinding through hordes of low armoured troops, the chainsword now functions on the battlefield how it always has in your head. This change also helps differentiate dedicated combat troops from those just wielding improvised or side-arm weapons.

New40kCCWChainsword.jpg

We can see that all of the above still only do 1 Damage, meaning that while they can chip wounds off bigger stuff, they are primarily infantry killers.

What about some anti-armour stuff though? Check out the power fist:

New40kCCWPowerfist.jpg

At the cost of being more cumbersome to swing, it’s dishing out multiple damage with every hit, and at a Strength that will find it easy to wound anything in the game.

Another high damage option is Force weapons. Take a Grey Knight squad of any sort: every guy in there has a blade that, as well as having all the benefits of the equivalent Power weapon, also dishes out D3 damage on every wound! Those guys are going to be phenomenal up-close killers, as they should be.

New40kCCWNemesis.jpgD3 Damage is good, but if you really want to kill something, try the reaper chainsword. This deals a flat 6 Damage to whatever it wounds. That’s enough to carve a Chaos Lord in half, and a couple of hits will wreck most small and medium vehicles in a single Fight phase.

New40kCCWReaper.jpg

Make no mistake, when facing a dedicated melee unit, stuff is going to die in combat really, really fast.


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#2
Interrogator-Chaplain Ezra

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The wording on the chainsword. It's like music to a rules lawyer.

 

But considering said wording, can we expect to have to split attacks between weapons if the model has several?


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#3
Damo1701

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Well, that's underwhelming for Fists and Reaper Chain Swords, which, rather than destroying lighter vehicles with ease, now needs to attempts, Fists are hitting on 4's or more, so that's a nerf, no AP on a chain sword, but +1 attack...  

 

Look out Vanguard, you are all going to be ripped apart and lose your iconic weapons for Chainswords and pistols.

 

Axe, Maul, and Sword?  Pretty standard.


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#4
Raven1

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Why? You make one additional attack. The owning player removes at his choice, and you have to be within 1" of the enenmy to make attacks.

I expected chainswords to be rend -1 though.
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#5
Valerian

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As expected, the Power weapons are just like the Force weapons we saw on the Rubric data slate, but with D1 instead of D3.

 

V



#6
Damo1701

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Why? You make one additional attack. The owning player removes at his choice, and you have to be within 1" of the enenmy to make attacks.

I expected chainswords to be rend -1 though.

 

It looks like I'll be removing the claws, fists, hammers etc from the Vanguard to give them chainswords.  Seeing as it looks like the +1 A for two weapons, and the +1A for charging are vanishing.

 

Bit of an odd rule though, for a chainsword.  Why not make it AP-1 instead to make it easier.


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#7
Canadian_F_H

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Wow... not knowing the rest of a knight's rules... but their massive chainsword doing a flat 6 damage is amazing... didnt guilliman have 9 wounds?
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#8
Iron Father Ferrum

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I'm glad that chainswords finally got some specific rules back, instead of just being a bog-standard CCW.  I'd have preferred an AP value, but an additional attack when the pistol+CCW bonus attack appears to have been removed?  I'll allow it.


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#9
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@Canadian_F_H, yes although it wont kill many special characters or vehicles in one hit. It will kill them in fight phase.

#10
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Finally power swords will see the light of day again
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#11
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I like the new Reaper Chainsword rules.  It hits like a ton of bricks, but it's not nearly as powerful as Destroyer weapons used to be.  That makes it more likely that I can get games in with my Knight Household without all the complaining.


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#12
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I, for one, welcome our new pistol and chainsword overlords.
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#13
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Why? You make one additional attack. The owning player removes at his choice, and you have to be within 1" of the enenmy to make attacks.

I expected chainswords to be rend -1 though.

 

It looks like I'll be removing the claws, fists, hammers etc from the Vanguard to give them chainswords.  Seeing as it looks like the +1 A for two weapons, and the +1A for charging are vanishing.

 

Bit of an odd rule though, for a chainsword.  Why not make it AP-1 instead to make it easier.

 

 

I like it just for variations sake. If you gave all weapons just varying amounts of +S and -AP, they'd get pretty boring. It's questionable how well this is all balanced, but since they want to make it a living set of rules, things will balance out eventually and additionally keep the fluffy variations. At least that's the hope.



#14
Swarm492

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Why? You make one additional attack. The owning player removes at his choice, and you have to be within 1" of the enenmy to make attacks.

I expected chainswords to be rend -1 though.

 

It looks like I'll be removing the claws, fists, hammers etc from the Vanguard to give them chainswords.  Seeing as it looks like the +1 A for two weapons, and the +1A for charging are vanishing.

 

Bit of an odd rule though, for a chainsword.  Why not make it AP-1 instead to make it easier.

 

 

Where did they say the bonus attacks for charging or for having two CC weapons was going away?



#15
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Power swords look freaken amazing. Just have to find a way to pip the users strength. 
I didn't expect a rend value on the chainswords because bolters don't have one. However I am now expecting a -1 rend when NewMarines get a New marine chainsword.  But they might skip those for something better.


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#16
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Looks like all those powers word armed vet sgts I like to model have become really useful!

gallery_24878_5332_50483.jpggallery_48988_10069_380_zpsntrlhere.png

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#17
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Pretty cool, I like.


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#18
Black Cohort

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Why would vanguard switch out to chainswords? I would much rather have a power weapon than a chainsword. What we will likely see more off is vanguard with special pistols, particularly if gunslinger is still a thing.

And I would much rather have powerfists hit on 4+ than hit last. Though I was hoping for better damage or AP.
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#19
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Well, that's underwhelming for Fists and Reaper Chain Swords, which, rather than destroying lighter vehicles with ease, now needs to attempts, Fists are hitting on 4's or more, so that's a nerf, no AP on a chain sword, but +1 attack...  

 

Look out Vanguard, you are all going to be ripped apart and lose your iconic weapons for Chainswords and pistols.

 

Axe, Maul, and Sword?  Pretty standard.

 

I don't see how you came to any of these conclusions, lol.  A flat 6 damage from the knight weapon is brutal.  A knight is going to be hitting on 3s or 4s, wounding on 2s and 3s, and throwing 6 damage per wound.  Its going to wreck whatever it hits.  Powerfists were already hitting on 4s most of the time and now they don't go last and do multiple damage per hit, its a huge buff.


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#20
Iron Father Ferrum

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Why? You make one additional attack. The owning player removes at his choice, and you have to be within 1" of the enenmy to make attacks.

I expected chainswords to be rend -1 though.

 

It looks like I'll be removing the claws, fists, hammers etc from the Vanguard to give them chainswords.  Seeing as it looks like the +1 A for two weapons, and the +1A for charging are vanishing.

 

Bit of an odd rule though, for a chainsword.  Why not make it AP-1 instead to make it easier.

 

 

Where did they say the bonus attacks for charging or for having two CC weapons was going away?

 

 

They didn't, but they haven't mentioned it in any of these articles.  Plus, the fact that you get to shoot pistols in CC speaks against it. 


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#21
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Cawl pattern chainsword.
Btw will the forum name change to Rifle And chainsword? 😉

Edited by Sete, 19 May 2017 - 02:15 PM.

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#22
CommodusXIII

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With the new Strength versus Toughness balance, power swords aren't at such a disadvantage for wounding as they are currently.  The trade-off of S for AP of the various power weapons is very flavorful, and in the grand scheme of things none seem to be auto-includes and none seem to be garbage.  That's how you encourage fluffy army building.


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Personally, I think they are coming. Like a massive electrified thousand ton ball of barbed wire with hundreds of trapped and frustrated gamers embedded in it, rolling down a hill. "That, Bilbo Baggins, is the sound of inevitability."
 
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#23
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Finally power swords will see the light of day again

 

Yep, i feel like the power sword is a definite winner here for most marines given the new damage table.  The +S weapons maybe seeing more use on higher strength models?


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#24
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#25
Imeran

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Assuming the Imperial Knight has as many attacks as a Morkanaut (ballpark: 4-5 before degrading) it's possible but not guaranteed that he can still one-shot said Morkanaut with 3 hits that go past the save. So, while no longer a D-Weapon, the Reaper remains very scary!


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