Loadouts for Deathwatch

[Irbis]

You can argue that combi is a bolter. Just with an extra profile. But yeah, needs FAQ...

[CrimsonReign]

that's what i'm hoping 

 

on closer reading

 

I would note that the different options are named in the profile  

ie for a combi-melta:

boltgun - etc

meltagun - etc

[shandwen]

Also, as "the models determine the rules" and the current models have the special ammo thingy on out combi's,and we have no access to the combi-grav (we have no part for that on the sprue), I think we are safe to say it uses SIA.

[Lexicanum]

Snip. Nevermind, it was covered. Edited June 15, 2017 by Lexicanum

[Kargrym]

so from reading the section on SIA, I don't think it applies to combi- weapons?

 

when this unit fires a bolt pistol, boltgun, twin boltgun, stalker pattern boltgun or guardian spear, you can choose to fire special issue ammunition

 

no mention of combi :/

Don't be daft. Yes you get SIA on the Deathwatch combi Bolters. Watch the mic drop and use it if people argue with you.

 

Look at your SIA bolter on your deathwatch sprue. See the rectangles jutting out the side? That's where the SIA loader is. The old metal sternguard upgrades had them on the bolters too for denoting SIA.

Now look at a normal bolter. No rectangles.

Now look at the combo part of the Deathwatch sprue. See the rectangles...that's SIA

[Bronze Beast in the Dark]

so from reading the section on SIA, I don't think it applies to combi- weapons?

 

when this unit fires a bolt pistol, boltgun, twin boltgun, stalker pattern boltgun or guardian spear, you can choose to fire special issue ammunition

 

no mention of combi :/

I think you are right, unfortunately. The list is very specific

[Vel'Cona]

 

so from reading the section on SIA, I don't think it applies to combi- weapons?

 

when this unit fires a bolt pistol, boltgun, twin boltgun, stalker pattern boltgun or guardian spear, you can choose to fire special issue ammunition

 

no mention of combi :/

I think you are right, unfortunately. The list is very specific

 

As I've said in other threads, the character/combi-weapon and SIA controversy is likely down to an oversight on GW's part.  There will be week 1 FAQs according to rumours so I wouldn't get too excited (either way) at this point.  :)

[bluntpencil]

Bolt Pistols or Chainswords, folks?

 

Okay, everyone gets a Boltgun, but do I give them a pistol or a chainsword as the backup weapon?

 

With the pistol, they're firing 3 shots at 12" instead of 2, but with chainswords, it's an extra attack in melee. I'm leaning towards the pistols, as it makes them just a bit shootier.

[Moostick]

You can't fire both the pistol and bolter in the shooting phase. You can only fire weapons of a single type during a turn unless the weapon has a special rule that allows it to be used regardless, like Culexus' grenade.

 

For us, bolt pistols are more of a defensive weapon while the chainsword is offensive. If we get charged and we decide to stay in combat, we get one S4 AP2 attack over a S4 AP0 attack, and can potentially kill off the enemy before fight phase occurs. However, if we charged, we get an additional S4 AP0 attack right away with the chainsword. If we charged with pistols, we get nothing on the first turn.

 

I take chainswords because I try not to get charged. And chainswords look cooler.

Edited June 16, 2017 by Moostick

[MagicHat]

Slight correction Moostick.

 

A single model in the unit can trow a single grenade. 

 

You can choose to fire all your pistols, or all your other weapons.

 

Heavy, assault and rapid-fire can all fire together. (Unless you advance of course)

[Moostick]

Yep, I meant a model, not unit, can only fire all weapons of one type (pistol, grenade, rapid fire, etc.), but thanks for clearing up any confusion as I didn't specify the non-pistols together.

 

To clarify Culexis' example, he can throw a grenade on top of firing his other weapon in some cases based on his special rule, so some models can fire multiple types in a turn.

[MagicHat]

A model can fire heavy, assault and rapidfire at the same time though. Only grenades and pistols have a restriction that forbids firing them with other weapons. (And then further exceptions like the Culexsus exists).

[Moostick]

Yes, I'm agreeing with you in that I did not specify non-pistols together for clarity.

 

Edit: I realize I'm just getting more confusing with poor wording (I should work for GW!), so I'll just say. Yes, you are right on that. I have a bad habit of grouping "primaries" and "pistols" together by default now after 8th got released.

Edited June 16, 2017 by Moostick

[bluntpencil]

Thanks guys, chainswords it is!

[Bronze Beast in the Dark]

 

 

so from reading the section on SIA, I don't think it applies to combi- weapons?

 

when this unit fires a bolt pistol, boltgun, twin boltgun, stalker pattern boltgun or guardian spear, you can choose to fire special issue ammunition

 

no mention of combi :/

I think you are right, unfortunately. The list is very specific

 

As I've said in other threads, the character/combi-weapon and SIA controversy is likely down to an oversight on GW's part.  There will be week 1 FAQs according to rumours so I wouldn't get too excited (either way) at this point. 

 

 

 

Having the book in my hands, I reverse my original thought. On page 206, under space marine wargear, it shows the combi-weapons as both a boltgun and the other weapon. I firmly believe that Combi-weapons have SIA. Especially once I read the description of the Hellfire Extremis that belongs to Capt. Artemis.

[shandwen]

 

 

 

 

 

so from reading the section on SIA, I don't think it applies to combi- weapons?

 

when this unit fires a bolt pistol, boltgun, twin boltgun, stalker pattern boltgun or guardian spear, you can choose to fire special issue ammunition

 

no mention of combi :/

I think you are right, unfortunately. The list is very specific

As I've said in other threads, the character/combi-weapon and SIA controversy is likely down to an oversight on GW's part. There will be week 1 FAQs according to rumours so I wouldn't get too excited (either way) at this point.

 

Having the book in my hands, I reverse my original thought. On page 206, under space marine wargear, it shows the combi-weapons as both a boltgun and the other weapon. I firmly believe that Combi-weapons have SIA. Especially once I read the description of the Hellfire Extremis that belongs to Capt. Artemis.

This seems to be backed up by how different stern guard wording.

[Vel'Cona]

The big question is, is it worth the extra 2 points per gun to go for Combi-Weapons (assuming we get SIA on them) or just take the special weapon since we'll be using that most times anyway?  Plasma seems better straight since double-tapping with a Combi is pretty suicidal on Supercharge per the FAQ, but Combi-Grav and Combi-Melta make a way better case for themselves.  Combi-Grav in particular combos well with Vengeance Rounds to torrent down high save opponents, and Combi-Melta could work nicely with Hellfire Rounds to whittle down high Toughness non-vehicles.  Combi-Flamer seems kinda crummy compared to the much deadlier Heavy Flamer (or perhaps IHB?), but maybe I'm missing something, there.

[Kargrym]

The big question is, is it worth the extra 2 points per gun to go for Combi-Weapons (assuming we get SIA on them) or just take the special weapon since we'll be using that most times anyway? Plasma seems better straight since double-tapping with a Combi is pretty suicidal on Supercharge per the FAQ, but Combi-Grav and Combi-Melta make a way better case for themselves. Combi-Grav in particular combos well with Vengeance Rounds to torrent down high save opponents, and Combi-Melta could work nicely with Hellfire Rounds to whittle down high Toughness non-vehicles. Combi-Flamer seems kinda crummy compared to the much deadlier Heavy Flamer (or perhaps IHB?), but maybe I'm missing something, there.

Overwatch becomes hilarious with combi plasma. "Ok 10 bolter shots on 6's, AP -2. Now 10 plasma on 6's...Ya, I can do that. What do you mean you wouldn't have done that if you knew. Whatever. Roll your charge on the 2 guys left. I got 15 chainsword attacks back."

[hammer grimblood]

So are we thinking combis are back with a vengeance? I have a fair number of guys that are armed with just bolters that I may swap out. Also how is everyone feeling about shotguns?

[Macabre Slanneshi Prince]

I've actually liked the shotguns, the double damage at half range is surprisingly useful. Still probably not worth 5 whole points though.

[hammer grimblood]

It's not just 5 though, I have 4 shotgunners who look great but that's 20 points between them that could be spent elsewhere that may be more efficient.

[Irbis]

Yeah, I really have no idea what the writer was thinking. Shotguns should have been free. Arguably it's probably down to the fact they are assault weapon (all assault weapons in 8th seems overpriced) but even if you advance and fire the shotgun still has worse threat range than bolter so dunno why GW thought they are worth jacked up price, SIA on shotguns is not that spectacular to be worth it...

[Moostick]

The big question is, is it worth the extra 2 points per gun to go for Combi-Weapons (assuming we get SIA on them) or just take the special weapon since we'll be using that most times anyway?  Plasma seems better straight since double-tapping with a Combi is pretty suicidal on Supercharge per the FAQ, but Combi-Grav and Combi-Melta make a way better case for themselves.  Combi-Grav in particular combos well with Vengeance Rounds to torrent down high save opponents, and Combi-Melta could work nicely with Hellfire Rounds to whittle down high Toughness non-vehicles.  Combi-Flamer seems kinda crummy compared to the much deadlier Heavy Flamer (or perhaps IHB?), but maybe I'm missing something, there.

 

This is exactly why I wished they're give us Combi-Gravs. With the dangers of overcharging Plasma, Gravs are the most reliable multi-wound weapon now. Combi-meltas are decent, but the D6 makes it unpredictable. Getting footsloggers to 6" to take advantage of double roll will be difficult in some cases, as well as a huge risk. But I had to go with combi-melta since there are no combi-gravs for us.

 

I threw a couple of combi-flamers on my melee unit in case someone decides to counter-charge. Their usefulness is limited to specific situations, but it's more thematic for an assault unit and I had a couple of Artemis' flamers around. With a HF, we lose the bolter while paying for SIA, plus a chainsword/pistol, so I don't like them too much.

[Vel'Cona]

 

This is exactly why I wished they're give us Combi-Gravs. With the dangers of overcharging Plasma, Gravs are the most reliable multi-wound weapon now. Combi-meltas are decent, but the D6 makes it unpredictable. Getting footsloggers to 6" to take advantage of double roll will be difficult in some cases, as well as a huge risk. But I had to go with combi-melta since there are no combi-gravs for us.

 

That is one of the more unfortunate wargear oversights that was kept from 7th edition, and I'm totally inclined to agree that it makes no sense, given we have access to Grav-guns and pistols.  I think the Combi-meltas are a decent workaround but it's definitely a shame.

[Irbis]

Combi-melta is so expensive at this point you're starting to think 'wait, why I am not taking frag instead' though...