DogWelder Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 (edited) Never understood the appeal of Titus. He is SUCH a boring character. No personality, flaws, quirks, ambitions, secrets etc. Just bland action hero #1442551 Cato is arrogant and prideful but gets results Galenus is dour and cold but has a great mind for strategy and logistics Fabian has a fiery and confrontational personality but inspires his men in combat Now these are actually interesting characters. Edited July 20, 2017 by Captain Idaho Removal of quoted post due to Mod edit. shandwen and roryokane 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valdur Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Never understood the appeal of Titus. He is SUCH a boring character. No personality, flaws, quirks, ambitions, secrets etc. Just bland action here #1442551 It MIGHT be due to the fact that Space Marine was quite short when put in comparison with the outstanding amount of fiction available for canon characters. However Titus does show up far more personality than what you are posting. Shows his acknowledgement of his own weakness at the end of the game, recognizing that Space Marines are more human than what many would like to admit. He also recognizes that the Codex is just a guideline, as noted by the Primarch during the novels, not the Bible to follow it ad literem. This is why Titus is such an amazing character, but also a terrible Ultramarine (at least for the M41 standards, prior to the resurrection of Bob) since he's willing to deviate from the Codex when the situation demands it. And, in case you were not aware, there were further plans for the good ol' captain. You saw a disciplined Ultramarine in the first game; the sequel was about an unhinged and raging Titus delving further in the personality of the character. And yes, one of the most memorable parts of the character was that he showed compassion and acknowledgement of the deeds to the average joe; something the Ultramarines are known for unlike the Iron Hands or Imperial Fists. Cato is arrogant and prideful but gets results "Might makes right" Certainly we have a clash of opinions here, but that's okay. I would like to point that, despite reading the Ultramarines novels I find it really hard to justify the character through skill at arms and arrogance alone; down to the core the character boils into a cocky murder machine with a severe lack of respect towards his captain peers with maybe the exception of Idaeus. A leader needs to be something more than just a paragon of martial prowess; and this is something that many writers of 40k tend to forget. Even in a war-torn galaxy you need visionaries, otherwise you will end stuck up in a battle with only one outcome: defeat. Galenus is dour and cold but has a great mind for strategy and logistics Nothing against the Captain Medic. His mere name makes me fuzzy inside. Fabian has a fiery and confrontational personality but inspires his men in combat Yes, hot bloded characters have guided legions of troops in the past; yet their lives usually were quite short as the temper usually made them fell to a trap set for more level-headed opponents. The challenging personality is actually a positive asset for the strategic machinery of the chapter as it tests the ideas of others to make them flounder or emerge stronger. Theoretical and Practical well executed. Now these are actually interesting characters. Frater Cornelius 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roryokane Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I do not think Titus is canon, simply because he is too awesome for the Ultramarines. Why? He is an actual human being who has compassion and is not subject to GW writing. Seriously, how come the best characters and arguably Chapters in 40k come from outside GW (FFG, Relic, etc.)? Oo My opinion anyway, but I still consider Blood Ravens my favourites. UM are definitely a great Chapter (especially if you remove the Ware fanwank), don't get me wrong, but by GW standards it is like saying they are the most beautiful person in a leper colony Blood Ravens appear in the War Machines of the Adeptus Astartes Forgeworld books from the last edition. They are most definitely canon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I do not think Titus is canon, simply because he is too awesome for the Ultramarines. Why? He is an actual human being who has compassion and is not subject to GW writing. Seriously, how come the best characters and arguably Chapters in 40k come from outside GW (FFG, Relic, etc.)? Oo My opinion anyway, but I still consider Blood Ravens my favourites. UM are definitely a great Chapter (especially if you remove the Ware fanwank), don't get me wrong, but by GW standards it is like saying they are the most beautiful person in a leper colony Blood Ravens appear in the War Machines of the Adeptus Astartes Forgeworld books from the last edition. They are most definitely canon. Not originally made by GW is what I meant. They are not responsible for their fluff. Well, the Black Library books are, but those are :cuss, which keeps with the theme quite nicely :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 (edited) Fabian has a fiery and confrontational personality but inspires his men in combat Now these are actually interesting characters. Captain Fabian is dead, killed when a tactical nuke was detonated on Macragge, causing his Thunderhawk to lose power and crash in the ocean at speed, blowing apart on impact. Crappy way to go, really. McNeill killed him off in a short story. Edited June 25, 2017 by Seahawk roryokane 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogWelder Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Fabian has a fiery and confrontational personality but inspires his men in combat Now these are actually interesting characters. Captain Fabian is dead, killed when a tactical nuke was detonated on Macragge, causing his Thunderhawk to lose power and crash in the ocean at speed, blowing apart on impact. Crappy way to go, really. McNeill killed him off in a short story. Was it confirmed that he died? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 It was referenced in another short story: "no-one wanted a repeat of what happened to Fabian of the Third". While it's not specific, I'd say it's pretty damning. roryokane 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhorneHunter57x Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 It does look like Galenus is no longer with us, as the Firth Company Captain is now Phelian (Dark Imperium p. 130). 'Phelian'...is his last name Kell? He is one of my least liked characters, along with Ragnar Blackmane. Bad boys, that are to young and dynamic for rules, plot armour being the only reason they still live and are part of their Chapters. I really dislike it when rebellious, anti-authoritarian people are shown as successfull. It is simply not true. In fact, it is a great way to get you killed in 40k. In a war, you live and die by competent leadership, teamwork and discipline. Both of them have proven that they lack all of those traits, with ample amount of arrogance to boot. And I would say that should be doubly so for an Ultramarine. Frater Cornelius 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roryokane Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 (edited) Fabian has a fiery and confrontational personality but inspires his men in combat Now these are actually interesting characters. Captain Fabian is dead, killed when a tactical nuke was detonated on Macragge, causing his Thunderhawk to lose power and crash in the ocean at speed, blowing apart on impact. Crappy way to go, really. McNeill killed him off in a short story. Fabian has a fiery and confrontational personality but inspires his men in combat Now these are actually interesting characters. Captain Fabian is dead, killed when a tactical nuke was detonated on Macragge, causing his Thunderhawk to lose power and crash in the ocean at speed, blowing apart on impact. Crappy way to go, really. McNeill killed him off in a short story. Was it confirmed that he died? It was referenced in another short story: "no-one wanted a repeat of what happened to Fabian of the Third". While it's not specific, I'd say it's pretty damning. And now that Ventris is canon (as of Dark Imperium), all the stuff portrayed in the Ventris novels and their attendant short stories are canon too. Edited June 27, 2017 by roryokane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus Arias Posted June 27, 2017 Share Posted June 27, 2017 I have yet to read Dark Imperium, (its loaded on my e-reader for next weeks holiday break) but the tidbits of info here are great! As much as I liked Cato, I never really got on with his model. It was too static a pose for such a dynamic character. Whereas the new Captain Acheon is quite a good pose, I am looking forward to reading some information about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 How did cato get a promotion when Guilliman doesn't like him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 It's more of a lateral move, not a promotion. Yes he's made the champion of the Ultramarines, but he loses his company and leadership position. To some, that's a big hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhorneHunter57x Posted July 2, 2017 Share Posted July 2, 2017 I see it as an "I don't trust you, so I'm going to make you my immediate subordinate who is with me everywhere while Calgar and Aggeman run the show back home" sort of deal. roryokane and Canadian_F_H 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix01 Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Yet it is Calgar who thinks that Guilliman doesn't approve of his leadership abilities... Perhaps Guilliman should have had Calgar rooming with Sicarius in the Victrix Guard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogWelder Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 I think its way more complex than Guilliman "liking" him or not. Firstly, Guilliman is not a person who would let personal feelings dictate his actions when it comes to promotions/advancements for his men. He would only care if they were able to do their job properly. Secondly, I believe he has mixed feelings about Cato. He definitely sees an hint of Aeonid Thiel from 30k (Cato is known for the dangerous, risky and unorthodox maneuvers he uses to win fights and his passion to succeed, same as Thiel). However, he also sees a large amount of pride and arrogance. In Dark Imperium, it states that Guilliman took Cato under his wing to teach him to be diplomatic and a brilliant statesman in addition to his prowess in combat. He probably sees Cato as a very interesting project for him to develop. Sort of like an apprentice. roryokane 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morovir Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 I'm not sure that Fabian is dead, as in the most recent Ventris short 'Do Eagles Still Circle the Mountain', which lead directly into the next Ventris novel, Fabian is still alive, albeit in full retreat. roryokane 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kallas Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 How have folks been finding Sicarius on the table so far? I'm liking the look of him, as he's essentially a Captain with a better Power Sword, better save and an extra Tactical Squad rule (good for me as Tacticals are my backbone!) Just wondering if anyone's had any experience with him and would care to share? roryokane 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 How have folks been finding Sicarius on the table so far? I'm liking the look of him, as he's essentially a Captain with a better Power Sword, better save and an extra Tactical Squad rule (good for me as Tacticals are my backbone!) So, exactly what he was since he was created then? roryokane 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Ed Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 How have folks been finding Sicarius on the table so far? I'm liking the look of him, as he's essentially a Captain with a better Power Sword, better save and an extra Tactical Squad rule (good for me as Tacticals are my backbone!) So, exactly what he was since he was created then? Not even remotely. He was previously overpriced and not really better at anything. Now his tactical squad rule is ecen better, his sword is actually good, and you cannot buy his save. Furthermore, his cost is competitive with any captain you build to do the same thing. He's not at all like he was before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian_F_H Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 (edited) This thread title gets my hopes up everytime it pops up... Further many hopes and dreams where born when guilliman could lookoutsir wounds onto Cato. Apparently he was his meat shield for the trip to terra. Tho perhaps guilliman being so impressed by the black templars saving his life he decided to emulate the initiate/neophyte training structure of the eternal crusaders and took Cato sicarius as his neophyte... All in jest my friends. In all seriousness, the titular question has been answered. Cato Sicarius is not dead. Further it is pretty interesting to see GW move him to a different position and promote a new captain to take his place in the 2nd company. Not the kind of thing I expected from them just a year or so ago... Edited July 7, 2017 by Canadian_F_H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogWelder Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 I find Cato and Guilliman's relationship to be a mentor/student thing as well. Though it reminds me more of Caeser and Crassus from the Spartacus: Blood and Sand TV series Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacques Corbin Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 So will Sicarius be made into a Primaris? Baluc 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunder_god Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 So will Sicarius be made into a Primaris? He had not been by the time of the Dark Imperium novel, but that doesn't mean it won't happen, if they stick w/that concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxichobbit Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 Update on Sicarius. Spoilers from C:SM 8th ed. He's been lost in the warp since the start of the Indomitus Crusade. He lead a fleet of Ultramarines and Successors back to Ultramar while the Crusade was mustered. They were split up by Warp Storms and Sicarius ship was still in the Warp when the Astronomicon failed. His last transmission was "They have breached the hull. They are here." Only half of the original fleet made it to Ultramar and Sicarius ship was not among them. There's also a quote from Calgar praising Sicarius and refusing to believe that he is dead. Source: Codex SM 8th ed, p98. From the preview on a blog posted in News and Rumours - larger images here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogWelder Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 (edited) Update on Sicarius. Spoilers from C:SM 8th ed. He's been lost in the warp since the start of the Indomitus Crusade. He lead a fleet of Ultramarines and Successors back to Ultramar while the Crusade was mustered. They were split up by Warp Storms and Sicarius ship was still in the Warp when the Astronomicon failed. His last transmission was "They have breached the hull. They are here." Only half of the original fleet made it to Ultramar and Sicarius ship was not among them. There's also a quote from Calgar praising Sicarius and refusing to believe that he is dead. Source: Codex SM 8th ed, p98. From the preview on a blog posted in News and Rumours - larger images here Wait, so this is at the start of the Indomitus Crusade? Because we know he's accompanying Guilliman in Dark Imperium which is at the end of the Indomitus Crusade, 100 years later. Why do I get a feeling that Cato is going to get an Uriel-style "escape from the war" novel now lol. Also, very clever GW. Now he doesn't have to have aged a bit since he was in the warp. Edited July 22, 2017 by Caius Tadius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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