=][= Unit(s) of the week: Command Squads =][=

[duz_]

It has come to the Commissariat's attention that some of you have not being keeping up with your regular training requirements. As such we intend to rectify this immediately by commencing an intensive re-education of the command corps. Failure will not be tolerated!

 

This will be a weekly series of threads aimed at discussing the units available to the Astra Miliatrum in 8th edition. This can become a resource for those finding their feet in 8th and our brothers in arms who have joined the fight in the glorious Imperial Guard.

 

No self respecting officer would ever make it into battle without his retinue! 
In this lesson we focus on the importance C&C support provided by Command Squads.

 

These units are one of the first that drew a lot of peoples attention at the drop of 8th. So much so that GW felt it necessary to clarify that only 1 of these could be taken per commander. Given they could be taken a cheap, yet super effective special weapons team thanks to their BS3+ its easy to see why.

I have not run these guys yet in this edition, although I think in my up coming games I will. Although most will see their benefit as a special weapons squad, I think I will be using mine more as a traditional support squad for my Commanders.

One thing I have noticed when deploying is even though I use vox casters in my gunline squads, rarely do I want to place my commander close enough to where their ideal set up location is. As such I have rescued my Praetorian standard bearer and bugler and will be including them in a squad with a Lascannon. The goal of this squad will be to sit near enough to my Commander so he can use the vox caster ability (bugler ;) ) to send commands to the gun line infantry that have taken better firing positions further along the line. 

Admittedly there it is unlikely the standard bearer will buff many units with how I want to set them up, but I think thematic it will look great :) I may also change my mind from a Lascannon to Heavy Bolter to make them less of a high priority target.

Another option could be run a medic team near my Bullgryns / Ogryns just to really annoy my opponent :D

 

I can certainly see the utility in having them as a special weapons team, although I think I prefer Scions for that role, given they can deep strike into where they need to be. 

 

Whats everyone else's thoughts? Have you run them since the FAQ? Do you prefer a more static thematic squad, or are you off maximising their WS3+ and 4 special weapon options. Whats your experience with Medics in 8th? They certainly seem like a more viable option than in past editions.

[Canadian_F_H]

Ive not kept up with them as much yet. Did they take the knife to them like they did SM comand squads? How big are they now?

 

No I haven't bought any indexes. Just had a son, so...

[Kuro_Ryu]

Medics certainly seem more attractive than they used to be. The heal is a 4+ though so you'll only be healing 2/3 wounds on average in a game. I see it as a nice bonus rather than something to pin a strategy around.

[Halfpint100]

The 3+ bs is so useful! I only use one squad with 2 meltas (to keep it cheap) just to be annoying to my opponent

[Withershadow]

Medics certainly seem more attractive than they used to be. The heal is a 4+ though so you'll only be healing 2/3 wounds on average in a game. I see it as a nice bonus rather than something to pin a strategy around.

It's not so much about healing wounds, but being able to bring back a model from a unit.  It doesn't specify that model can't have upgrades, so you can bring back deceased special weapon dudes.  The only issue is how fragile command squads are, after playing with Krieg Quartermasters, I want command squads to become one unit with the platoon/company commanders again.

[Tirak]

I hope that command squads don't get rerolled back into being attached to commanders. Right now our Platoon and Company commanders are incredibly cheap. Having to tack on another 24 points of fluff I don't want on them would be awful.

[Withershadow]

That's fair, but honestly I think command squads could be super useful if they weren't so fragile.  For example, mortar, banner, vox.  You can park your command and the command squad somewhere safe, while buffing morale of nearby heavy weapon teams or artillery crews and having the capability to issue orders to more distant units.  Or 3 special weapons and a medic.  This command squad can go right in the middle of your SWSs or whatever, providing additional special weapons that cannot be targeted unless they are the closest unit, and recovering nearby casualties.

 

How about a compromise?  You can buy the Company Commanders or whoever individually, but then can attach a command squad to them ala Genestealer Patriarch.  Or just leave company commanders solo and just roll in the Platoon Commanders.  And of course you'll always have the option to take an incomplete unit as a separate detachment at the cost of a command point.

[duz_]

A look out sir mechanic for them wouldn't be bad

[Tirak]

I wouldn't be opposed to having them attachable, so long as I can keep my super cheap Commands filler. I wouldn't be in favor of having to lose an entire Command Point for cheap commanders I can already get, especially with our Codex hopefully on the way with our additional CP spending options.

[Kuro_Ryu]

 

 

Medics certainly seem more attractive than they used to be. The heal is a 4+ though so you'll only be healing 2/3 wounds on average in a game. I see it as a nice bonus rather than something to pin a strategy around.

It's not so much about healing wounds, but being able to bring back a model from a unit. It doesn't specify that model can't have upgrades, so you can bring back deceased special weapon dudes. The only issue is how fragile command squads are, after playing with Krieg Quartermasters, I want command squads to become one unit with the platoon/company commanders again.

My point was the 50% success rate. You could spend half the game trying to bring back that special weapons guy.

 

I think rolling the commander into a squad to give them the character immunity bonus kind of goes against the spirit of this edition. If you were to be able to place a character in a unit I think that unit should take away character immunity not gain it.

 

"For example, mortar, banner, vox. You can park your command and the command squad somewhere safe, while buffing morale of nearby heavy weapon teams or artillery crews and having the capability to issue orders to more distant units."

You can do that anyway.

Edited August 9, 2017 by Kuro_Ryu

[Withershadow]

Per the rules, a character in a unit of non-characters gain character defense. If it works for genestealer patriarchs and Krieg Quartermasters, why not Commanders.

[Kuro_Ryu]

I wasn't aware of those units. Personally I don't think it should work that way for them either but if that's the precedent then my opinion doesn't mean much any more.

[Stylian_StHugh]

Command Squads are good in IG lists. Put 3 in a Valkyrie and go annoy the backfield.

[Galron]

I use four in my 2250 list. Two with all melta, two with all plasma, each  group of two squads led by a commander.I also play Elysians so my use is a bit different than standard guard. I typically use them as trouble shooters and drop them in to take out important targets. My last game my plasma teams on top of a non-climbable tower dropped a Kytan down to 2 wounds in two rounds of fire, note one squad had disappeared by the second round to a pair of soulburners that looked at them from a neighboring Devastator engine. I was totally outgunned that game though overall.

[Otto von Bludd]

I saw someone else suggest using Command Squads as an alternative to HWTs and I really liked the idea.  A single Lascannon in a Command Squad costs 44 points and comes with BS3+. 

[Tirak]

Yeah, but 3 lascannons will run you 72pts. Accuracy you're hitting 1.5 shots vs .66 shots. More than double the accuracy for less than double the cost.

[Beams]

Or you know, the chance (12.5%) to hit with all three.

[Halfpint100]

I will be trying a command squad with 4 snipers tomorrow. Lets see how that goes, 32 points seems cheap enough 

[Stylian_StHugh]

I will be trying a command squad with 4 snipers tomorrow. Lets see how that goes, 32 points seems cheap enough 

If you're gonna do that, always use Elysian Sniper Teams - 21pts for 3 BS3+ Snipers with additional lasguns and 2W

[Halfpint100]

 

I will be trying a command squad with 4 snipers tomorrow. Lets see how that goes, 32 points seems cheap enough 

If you're gonna do that, always use Elysian Sniper Teams - 21pts for 3 BS3+ Snipers with additional lasguns and 2W

 

I would, but i dont have the models.

 

They performed ok, didn't really do much, but were out of range (strangely) for most of the game

Edited August 18, 2017 by Halfpint100

[mertbl]

I've thought about using a squad with 2 sniper rifles, medic, vox. Creed would be the warlord and hanging out near by obviously. Medic tries to keep Creed alive. snipers reach out for targets of opportunity. Or swap the snipers for heavy flamer, flamer to keep things away. The flamers make it costly though.

 

I like this squad as the guys trying to keep Creed alive at the end of the fall of cadia. Seems thematic.

[Withershadow]

Medic is kind of wasted there if his goal is to "keep Creed alive", since Creed can't be targeted until the command squad is gone anyway.  May as well just take another sniper rifle.

[duz_]

Medic isn't bad insurance he could potentially revive one of the sniper rifles too or a nearby squad member

[mertbl]

He has other utility like duz said. Plus Creed could get hit with an orbital bombardment or sniper rounds etc.

 

Medic is kind of wasted there if his goal is to "keep Creed alive", since Creed can't be targeted until the command squad is gone anyway. May as well just take another sniper rifle.

[Feral_80]

I think the only way to go with Command Squads is all or nothing. You either use them as (suicidal-)(counter-)heavy hitters with 4x plasma or 4x melta, embarked and ready to strike. Or, you go pure support and give them any combination of vox, medic, and/or banner, keeping them on foot and out of sight (like their officer, ideally). The latter version is cheap, but sadly not very effective as none of these items of equipment work particularly well in my opinion. Which is a shame, because I love the idea of flags waving around my army. The former is very expensive, but also very good.

 

Anything else seems a complete waste of points. Flamers are nonsense in a squad for which you pay for BS 3+, take sws instead. Snipers, we have far better choices. Any heavy weapons, they are too fragile and won't last if you give them one, so do not bother at all.

 

My hope is that the codex will make medic, vox, and banners more attractive, because that's by far the coolest version of a command squad we can (and should) field.

Edited August 18, 2017 by Feral_80