Talk me into/out of buying a Spartan Assault Tank

[Syrakul]

Hi there! Ive been on the fence lately about this vehicle. I have a Sons of Horus/Black Legion army and tons of troops, but aside from things like GD of Khorne or AoS have never had a 'Large' LoW type model.

 

Always wanted a Spartan, and I've heard about the new FW moulds making the kit much easier to work with, and now want to go in for one.

question is gamewise is it worth sinking the points in?

 

I typically play 1000-1250 games which seems like a joke to take the following, though lately 8th is blowing up and I'm getting new opponents, so might buff to 1500 point games.

 

An example I'd like to run:

Vanguard Detachment

Abaddon [custom build]

5 Khorne Terminators w/ Icon (2 with LCs, one chainfist, two PFs) [Justerin models w/ non-justerin FW weapon options]

10 Berserkers w/ Icon, PF, rest have axe/sword) [Reaver models]

Spartan Assault Tank.

1149 pts

 

I could break the zerkers in 5/5 to make a proper vanguard, with backfield cultist units with flamers to surround it to stop meltabomb alpha strikes.  Or reduce to 5 zerkers and also take a Multimelta Contemptor or AC/2HB Hellforged Predator.

 

Those of you reading, at what points level would you consider taking a vehicle like this? 1500, 2000, or more?

 

In 1500 I'd keep the Spartan bomb at 1149 with the Dread or Pred, then spend the extra 300 on second Vanguard of Renegades (Malefic Lord, Earthshaker batteries, Disciples and sniper Marauders)

 

Is any of this viable? or will this simply be a nice paperwei... display piece?

[Commissar K.]

I don't have the Spartan, I will get it later this year. I believe that it's worth the points, effort and generally think it looks awesome as a brick on wheels.

From my perspective it's one of the best Transports available together with the Storm Eagle. I think it's a great centerpiece for 1500+ points, the same really applies to Abaddon aswell so you can really transport your boss man with some melee cats and make something cool out of it. The biggest pro for me is the double quad Lascannon and general survivability it has, the fact that it can drive out of melee makes it all the better and keeps it relevant throughout the game. 

Now having said that a Spartan isn't a guaranteed win or ticket to it. It's very easy to overextend points into it and it as a transport. While it's awesome that it can house 20 dudes I wouldn't say you should always put it full with that, in many cases a single large unit plus character is more than enough and that just doesn't fit into a Land Raider.

The biggest selling point to me for it remains double quad Lascannon that can fire as long as it's around and transport. It's a win/win deal. 

 

[Khornestar]

Not only can the Spartan transport 20 dudes, it can transport 25 dudes; so room enough for 1-4 units of Berzerkers plus characters to support them. I'm not a big fan of how it looks, but it seems pretty dang good.

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

I love mine, it's been clutch in every 8th edition game I've played so far between its massive transport capacity and 8 lascannons.

[Commissar K.]

It will be straight up hilarious if FW will decide to make one with tripple quad Lascannon and 30 transport spots and call it a Leonidas Assault Land Raider though 

Edited August 22, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Syrakul]

It will be straight up hilarious if FW will decide to make one with tripple quad Lascannon and 30 transport spots and call it a Leonidas Assault Land Raider though

"So im having trouble fitting my 300 berserkers (5100 points with chainsword/axe) and 10 Leonidas Assault Land Raiders (5500 pts) into a 10000 point list... Should i keep some Berserkers on foot to make points for characters?"

 

Seriously though, now I've gotta go out and buy a damn 109 quid Spartan, thanks guys :)

[Slave to Darkness]

Reason for a spartan. They are awesome minis.

 

Reason against. Gonna cost you a fair bit of cash.

 

Go for the spartan. ;)

[Sception]

They expensive as heck in dollas and pints, and iirc ours don't even get machine spirit, which is kinda an important rule for them, sooo...??? Find em sorta shrugworthy miself.

[the jeske]

question is gamewise is it worth sinking the points in?

 

you will never use the full transport capacity it has. there are much better chaos FW units that are cheaper[points and money]. It is a huge target and chaos doesn't really have cheap efficient tanks or assasins to protect it from being shot at. it lacks crucial rules the loyalist version has for little to no gain as mali said.

Because of it size it actually may have problems with moving on some boards, unless your house rules errated terrain rules.

 

And on a more light, I don't have it rules, side, I think it is still a tank and not a warmachine. So anything in melee range will stop it from shoting. For simiular points you could get a raptor, which flies.

[Ishagu]

It's a great unit. Expensive but actually worth it. Firepower of two Landraiders and enough transport capacity to bring a small horde into the enemy lines.

 

It can drive out of combat and shoot, btw :-D

Edited August 23, 2017 by Ishagu

[Syrakul]

Jeske, some valid points. I hadn't seen the loyalist one yet but yes, Hellforged one can leave combat, can shoot when within 1" of enemies and charge again after falling back no problem, same rule as Loyalists.

I get what your saying about Loyalist vs. Chaos, Loyalist one does look better. Better attacks and damage in CC, though stuck at WS 5. Move and fire at full BS (and can take Multimelta or another Heavy Bolter, compared to Havoc/combis). Loyalist is 20 points more, but if it is helping 8 Lascannon/6HB shots a turn I'd pay in a heatbeat.

[Commissar K.]

I think it's easy to miss out on what the Spartan actually does. As a result I'm just going to write out some pro's for the con that is it's cost. I feel that in terms of land-transport it's amazing. At the same time I don't exactly know what the Loyalist variant does but frankly speaking I cannot care enough either because I feel that most Loyalist units arn't the same melee power point for point. Offcourse Guilliman and Thunderhammers are scary but not having that option doesn't mean your screwed either ;)

Hellforged Spartan Assault Tank
- Comes in at 300 points
- Quad Lascanons come in at 80 points, which is a nice deal right there for anti-tank
- Can upgrade the twin Heavy Bolters to twin Heavy Flamers, which is great for anti-man
- Thougher as a Land Raider is very useful, in addition it gets to fight better the moment it gets more damaged, sounds silly but can matter a lot to keep other Vechicles stuck with it
- Can potentially heal if it goes into melee (5+)
- Can eat one guy if you roll a 1 but then heals a wound (which with non-terminator, non-character load outs doesn't matter too much, just don't load it up with 30+ points guys only)
- Containment Breach is a nice anti-Psyker tool
- Steel Behemoth is the prime reason as to why it's so darned effective in any turn of the game
 

 

This model may Fall Back in the Movement phase and still shoot and/or Charge during the controlling player’s turn. It may fire its weapons if enemy units are within 1" of it. In addition, this model only gains a bonus to its save in cover if at least half of the model is obscured from the bearer.

So in conclusion I think it's always worth it. I have hear some hobby horror stories on it but even then I'd say it's still worth it. 

The thing in itself is extremely "world eatery" in design which is why I probably love it so much but in reality the thing lives up to it's points. It's relevant in it's own way throughout the battle until it's last wound is removed. More importantly because it's a great transport also you get your units where they need to be on top of it being very sturdy and anti-everything.

Cheers,

[techsoldaten]

I have a Spartan and rarely use it in 8th edition. It's nice, but expensive for what it does.

 

I usually take the Kharbdis Assault Claw instead. Here's the logic for why:

 

- The points cost is just over half of that of the Spartan.

 

- Nearly the same transport capability.

 

- Deep strike means you are right in the action and (with the right combination of units) it's not hard to pull off a first turn assault. 

 

- It's incredible in close combat against vehicles, monsters and titanic things. It has a better chance to do more damage against these types of units than 4 lascannons.

 

- People seem to think of it as a drop pod. It's not a fire magnet the way the Spartan is. Plus it's on a big base, it's not very hard to keep the thing in close combat once it drops.

 

Most of my games are at 2,000 points. With the exception of Magnus, I don't see much value in taking a model that consumes ~25% of the available points in 8th edition. There are too many ways to inflict multiple wounds against vehicles.

 

Some people have made note of the fact the Imperial version is better on paper. The times I have run the Spartan it was effective, being able to fall back, shoot, and assault again is very useful. The size of the model means it's not hard to get within a inch of multiple units on a charge, which can be very useful against shooty armies. I think this overcomes any disadvantages based on the differences in the ruleset.

[Ishagu]

If you're running Magnus I wouldn't invest in a Spartan, no. That's two Lord of War choices that drain your points.

 

The truth is it doesn't cost much more than a Landraider but is far better than one.

[Syrakul]

Compared to the landraider, which pays 50 points per 2 lascannons (so 2x2 -> 4x4 by that logic is another 100... Though really 60 points for extra guns)

Then 4 more wounds, healing ability, steel behemoth and 10->25 capacity, but loses move or fire weapons (bah), after guns the rest is valued at 60 points or so?

 

Im not taking magus no. Assault claw is back to 9" charge range, so why bother? If I wanted that I would just teleport abaddon/terminators, then take the berserkers in a standard landraider, then drop together on the clutch turn. What I want is to guarantee they all make the charge.

[Ishagu]

I think that with prescience readily available, That movement penalty isn't really an issue.

 

Especially as Chaos have access to fast moving characters with re roll auras

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

I think that with prescience readily available, That movement penalty isn't really an issue.

 

Especially as Chaos have access to fast moving characters with re roll auras

There's also the strategem that lets vehicles move and fire heavy weapons without penalty. That's how I've been using mine.

[Ishagu]

Yeah, combine that with prescience from a DP behind the Spartan and you have 8 Lascannons hitting on 2 re-rolling 1.

 

Devastating firepower

[Bloody Legionnaire]

Other than in game performance and cost of the model itself you need to consider the Spartan will possibly require a lot more model hobby skill from you than any other model you've built so far (assuming you are not used to working with resin models/large resin models). Yes, the new tracks help quite a bit but there's a lot of work that still has to be done and you'll probably need to do a little research before you build it to make sure you don't ruin a very expensive kit. Duncan from GW has a pretty good video on the warhammer TV channel on youtube covering the Spartan and working with resin kits. 

I really love my Spartan and I am a very experience modeler (both for 40k and military kits) and I ran into a bit of trouble with it. Resin is a lot more brittle than regular plastic kits especially for smaller components to you'll need to be on the look out to make sure you don't damage those details. The tracks themselves and the cables for the quad lascannons are the big ones. 

Good luck deciding!

[Syrakul]

Other than in game performance and cost of the model itself you need to consider the Spartan will possibly require a lot more model hobby skill from you than any other model you've built so far (assuming you are not used to working with resin models/large resin models). Yes, the new tracks help quite a bit but there's a lot of work that still has to be done and you'll probably need to do a little research before you build it to make sure you don't ruin a very expensive kit. Duncan from GW has a pretty good video on the warhammer TV channel on youtube covering the Spartan and working with resin kits. 

I really love my Spartan and I am a very experience modeler (both for 40k and military kits) and I ran into a bit of trouble with it. Resin is a lot more brittle than regular plastic kits especially for smaller components to you'll need to be on the look out to make sure you don't damage those details. The tracks themselves and the cables for the quad lascannons are the big ones. 

Good luck deciding!

Thanks for the info, some unboxing/assembly vids also are available for this kit on youtube. Ive got plenty of other resin kits, Thanatar, most of my SoH and some dreads so I know what im getting into, hell I cast all my own bases!