T'au 8th Ed. Wishlisting

[Commander Dawnstar]

I think tanks that have only one gun needs to have a gun that borders on making the opponent scream OP to be able to compete with things like Predators/Razorbacks, double shooting T8 Leman Russes & Co.

 

Yeah, the actual physical design of some Tau vehicles and suits seems to have massively undercut their firepower in this edition. Having your damage output heavily focused on a single primary weapon, especially those with either a low volume of fire or that previously used templates, seems like a fast track to poor efficiency and returns, especially when your weapons' profiles barely even stand out. It's absolutely baffling that the Riptide can't even match the damage output of a Leman Russ.

 

What makes it even worse is how expensive some of our stuff is. A Heavy Rail Rifle/Smart Missiles Broadside is 23 points more expensive than a Twin Lascannon Predator with Heavy Bolter sponsons despite bringing very similar firepower on a far less resilient platform and at a worse baseline BS. It just seems totally off.

[Panzer]

Pathfinder Rail weapons are actually okay. Slightly too expensive but stat-wise they don't require any change.

The HRR is not too terrible as well due to being Heavy 2 but the Broadside itself is too expensive as most things in the Index. Something that's most likely going to change with the Codex anyway.

 

It's really just the Railgun that suffers since it's a single shot weapon on an expensive tank. S12 Heavy4 would certainly buff it a great deal and make it more reliable.

[Triszin]

Pathfinder Rail weapons are actually okay. Slightly too expensive but stat-wise they don't require any change.

The HRR is not too terrible as well due to being Heavy 2 but the Broadside itself is too expensive as most things in the Codex. Something that's most likely going to change with the Codex anyway.

 

It's really just the Railgun that suffers since it's a single shot weapon on an expensive tank. S12 Heavy4 would certainly buff it a great deal and make it more reliable.

Im just imagining the New Rail guns on hammerheads as the FTL combat seen in the new Star wars movie.

 

A giant light hitting objects.

 

except this is 40k, so sometimes those objects arent even bothered by something travel at/near the speed of light and colliding

[Skaorn]

Ignore cover is just a situational buff on the AP. Do Railguns really need AP-5 tho? They usually target stuff that doesn't get as easily cover anyway.

I was thinking of the old cover saves, not the new ones. I think straight 2d6 damage might get people bent out of shape, but maybe giving them a bonus just against large targets? Give the extra d6 to the Rail Gun and d3s to both Rail Rifles. The submunitions hits can increase against unit size.

[Triszin]

 

Ignore cover is just a situational buff on the AP. Do Railguns really need AP-5 tho? They usually target stuff that doesn't get as easily cover anyway.

I was thinking of the old cover saves, not the new ones. I think straight 2d6 damage might get people bent out of shape, but maybe giving them a bonus just against large targets? Give the extra d6 to the Rail Gun and d3s to both Rail Rifles. The submunitions hits can increase against unit size.

 

or, Path finder Rail on a successful wound, per wound ad an extra 1 mortal wound

Broadside D3 mortal wounds

Hammerhead D6 mortal wounds?

[Trevak Dal]

Missile Pods with Assault 3 would be nice just for the fact that the bit has 3 missiles already. ^^

 

 

Yeah that's exactly why I want it that way

[Sanul]

Or just give the railguns the same damage rules some other weapons already have: any roll for damage below 3 is 3 damage. But we will find out soon enough what GW thought to make "better", not?

[Waking Dreamer]

 

Missile Pods with Assault 3 would be nice just for the fact that the bit has 3 missiles already. ^^

Yeah that's exactly why I want it that way

Hmm...would that mean you'd be okay with six shots per SMS (2 missile pods stuck together)?

[Panzer]

6 shot SMS sounds great. At least it wouldn't be the same as a Burst Cannon ++ then. ^^

[Triszin]

Could leave SMS as they are

 

but then add a SMS defense system that anything in base contact/1" from the model equipped with SMS take D3 wounds?

[Panzer]

D3 auto-wounds in melee? Interesting thought for sure but maybe a bit much for a mere Devilfish. That'd would make the Devilfish one of the strongest tanks in melee (~4 auto-wounds = ~1-2 dead marines just for being there). ^^

[Triszin]

D3 auto-wounds in melee? Interesting thought for sure but maybe a bit much for a mere Devilfish. That'd would make the Devilfish one of the strongest tanks in melee (~4 auto-wounds = ~1-2 dead marines just for being there). ^^

considering how easy the tanks are to take down I wouldnt mind it, Maybe have the SMS defense system only work when its being charged? essentially giving SMS overwatch capabilites?

 

I've managed to charge a devil fish with a 5 man squad of wulfen, 1 Great axe, 1 naked, 2 THSS, 1 frost claws and they destroyed the tank in one turn, then chewed through the breachers only losing 1 wulfen

[Panzer]

Well d'uh Wulfen aren't exactly known for being weak in melee. Especially with something like Thunderhammers equipped lol

[Walter Payton]

I've been thinking about this.

 

Personally, my number 1 wish is for the units that make Tau unique are strengthened and made more viable.  I don't really care if Hammerheads, for example, get nerfed or are unviable because at the end of the day its just a tank.  What I do want to be good are aspects of the Tau's background that no other faction really has:

 

- Multi-species army: Vespid are already good, but Kroot badly need an update in terms of rules (and hopefully models, but that will surely wait).  A stratagem allowing the army to take an IG unit with the TAU faction keyword would be a cool way of representing Gue'vesa.

- Drones: Buff buff buff.  More plastic drone kits would be cool - plastic Remora in particular.  It would be cool to see the DoW Drone Harbinger get rules or a model, but this probably won't happen.

- Battlesuits: Fix the Nova Reactor.  

- Air cav: we're told that the Tau use the Devilfish as a workhorse APC.  For an army which thrives at medium-range, a cheap transport is a must to be competitive.

[Panzer]

Plastic Remora would be my dream. It's the perfect addition to my army and I'm trying really hard to resist getting some since I really don't like resin models. Tho I don't think Drones in particular need to get buffed at all. Gun Drones and Shield Drones already are extremely good and Marker Drones are okay. The Pathfinder Drones would need something to protect them tho I guess.

 

Imo the Nova Reactor is fine the way it works. Way better than in 7th. At least it's reliable now.

[Waking Dreamer]

 

Imo the Nova Reactor is fine the way it works. Way better than in 7th. At least it's reliable now.

 

Do you think it's worth loosing a Wound every time you use the Nova Reactor? I thought that was one of the main reasons Riptides are currently not usable?

 

Lorewise, it states there is a possibility that the pilot can suffer radiation or that there is a risk in using the Nova reactor, not guaranteed damage. It should be similar rules to when the Redemptor Dread overcharges its plasma, only the possibility of a mortal wound.

 

Since Its hard to believe Tau would willingly use technology less stable than Space Marines.

[Skaorn]

So how would people go about making the long range shooting option a good choice for those wanting to play that way?

[Panzer]

 

 

Imo the Nova Reactor is fine the way it works. Way better than in 7th. At least it's reliable now.

 

Do you think it's worth loosing a Wound every time you use the Nova Reactor? I thought that was one of the main reasons Riptides are currently not usable?

 

Lorewise, it states there is a possibility that the pilot can suffer radiation or that there is a risk in using the Nova reactor, not guaranteed damage. It should be similar rules to when the Redemptor Dread overcharges its plasma, only the possibility of a mortal wound.

 

Since Its hard to believe Tau would willingly use technology less stable than Space Marines.

 

Yes I do mechanically. The return is what could be adjusted depending on how much a Riptide will cost and how it performs but mechanically losing a wound to acticate it is perfectly fine. The Riptide is already durable as hell with its Sv2+, invul, Drones due being a Battlesuit and potential FnP stuff.

The main reason why Riptides currently aren't useable is the same reason why reason why most of the Codex isn't ... because it's ridiculously overcosted for what it does.

[Skaorn]

 

Imo the Nova Reactor is fine the way it works. Way better than in 7th. At least it's reliable now.

 

 

Do you think it's worth loosing a Wound every time you use the Nova Reactor? I thought that was one of the main reasons Riptides are currently not usable?

 

Lorewise, it states there is a possibility that the pilot can suffer radiation or that there is a risk in using the Nova reactor, not guaranteed damage. It should be similar rules to when the Redemptor Dread overcharges its plasma, only the possibility of a mortal wound.

 

Since Its hard to believe Tau would willingly use technology less stable than Space Marines.

I've always hated the nova reactor since the Tau were always against using unstable technology that was unsafe until GW added all the new ion weapons and that reactor. With the new Tau they might as well put nova reactors in hammerheads and stormsurges while removing The safeties from all plasma based weapons. Wouldn't you like the option of pulse rifles at Str 6 AP -2?

[Commander Dawnstar]

 

I've always hated the nova reactor since the Tau were always against using unstable technology that was unsafe until GW added all the new ion weapons and that reactor.

 

That simply isn't true though. As has already been covered in the rumors thread, we've had all manner of examples across the years like the original Rail Rifles having neural targeting systems that potentially directed fatal feedback at their wielders or the V-series of Battlesuits first being put into the field in a state that saw them expose their pilots to dangerous levels of radiation. The nature of the Tau philosophy is such that they absolutely justify individuals taking risks with unstable or unreliable technology in the name of progress or out of absolute necessity. To knowingly give one's own life for the Greater Good and the betterment of the Empire is a noble thing indeed.

 

Where the Tau differ from the Imperium is that they'll look at a plasma weapon that risks fatally overheating and agree that something needs to be done about the problem rather than just being satisfied that it has the Omnissiah's rubber-stamp and tends to kill its targets more than its wielders. The Riptide fills its role satisfactorily for now, but you can absolutely sure that the Earth Caste is working tirelessly to improve it and iron out those problems ...  not that GW is likely to ever change its rules to that effect. The nature of the war they face means that sometimes they simply have to put things into the field when they're not quite perfect and accept that lives will be lost that might not have been if they had only had more time.

 

The Tau despise unnecessary loss of life but that does not mean they are utterly risk-adverse.

[Panzer]

 

 

I've always hated the nova reactor since the Tau were always against using unstable technology that was unsafe until GW added all the new ion weapons and that reactor.

 

That simply isn't true though. As has already been covered in the rumors thread, we've had all manner of examples across the years like the original Rail Rifles having neural targeting systems that potentially directed fatal feedback at their wielders or the V-series of Battlesuits first being put into the field in a state that saw them expose their pilots to dangerous levels of radiation. The nature of the Tau philosophy is such that they absolutely justify individuals taking risks with unstable or unreliable technology in the name of progress or out of absolute necessity. To knowingly give one's own life for the Greater Good and the betterment of the Empire is a noble thing indeed.

 

Where the Tau differ from the Imperium is that they'll look at a plasma weapon that risks fatally overheating and agree that something needs to be done about the problem rather than just being satisfied that it has the Omnissiah's rubber-stamp and tends to kill its targets more than its wielders. The Riptide fills its role satisfactorily for now, but you can absolutely sure that the Earth Caste is working tirelessly to improve it and iron out those problems ...  not that GW is likely to ever change its rules to that effect. The nature of the war they face means that sometimes they simply have to put things into the field when they're not quite perfect and accept that lives will be lost that might not have been if they had only had more time.

 

The Tau despise unnecessary loss of life but that does not mean they are utterly risk-adverse.

 

QFT

[Skaorn]

No, it is true but it's changed because GW wanted to put new things in that didn't fit with how the Tau had previously described. Aside from plasma rifles, the Tau were presented as even not treating or seeing Kroot or Drones as cannon fodder for example. When rules for rail rifles were released in a WD, they were described as prototypes being field tested and only got the gets hot rule if they fired at multiple different units. Once the next codex was released, this trait was lost. So the Tau were willing to risk their weapon testers but by the time it was openly fielded the rail rifles weren't going to cook anyone's brain. As for the V series, I don't recall it being mentioned before the 6th ed codex so it strikes me as backwards justification for Riptides and new ion weapons (ion cannons and cyclic ion blasters weren't dangerous to use before). This is why I do not like Riptides or what was done with ion weapons.

 

Of course with plasma and ion weapons being safer to use now in 8th and the Tau's new mindset on safety it makes me wonder why not give everything the option to overcharge? Obviously I'm not serious on that, but I do think Tau weaponry needs to be redone from the ground due to the hanged in 8th but I doubt that'll be done this codex.

[Triszin]

A bit late for this but, maybe for the next codex...

 

I wnat onager guantlets as stndard equipment, both left and right.

 

I want to be able to make a

Broadside

equip it with double onager guantlets

SMS

Seeker

 

And i'll call it the destroyer. A tau dreadnaught, takes hits keeps on moving, smashes everything before it.

[Marshal van Trapp]

I'd actually love to see the ability to make an all battlesuit army without needing the 1cp detachments. Something like making stealth suits troops (let's be honest they really are not so op as to not be troops) and maybe making coldstar battlesuits into fast attack squads (make them piloted by shas'vre with bs 3+/4+ and less wounds and able to take 1-3 per squad like broadsides)

 

I would also be down for commanders able to choose between regular xv8 xv84 and xv86 suits as well as the ghostkeel and riptide, though I don't see that happening anytime soon!

[Panzer]

I hope they won't do something like that to be honest.

The Troop/Elite/Fast Attack/Heavy support represents the regular arrangement of that factions army. If you want to field a force focussing on just Battlesuits its something out of the norm and means you're sacrificing something else.

I know FSE used to have Troop Crisis Suits and BA used to have Troop Assault Marines, however those things were never supported by the fluff. Even FSE isn't all Battlesuits and while having a thing for close assault tactics they deploy plenty of Firewarrior just like any other T'au Sept.

Just like BA also deploy plenty Tacticals, Scouts, Devastators etc. even tho they have a thing for Jump Pack assault tactics.

 

It's not about what's op and what not, it's about how the army works. Otherwise we wouldn't need any detachments at all.

 

With Forgeworld you already can choose between xv84 and xv86 suits for the Commander. Just the basic xv8 is missing but we have a rumour saying something like that will be in the Codex so there's hope. A Ghostkeel or Riptide Commander would be pretty awesome tho, I agree! However from what I've heard it's not a thing in the Codex unfortunately.