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Purifiers - Give Them a Shot


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#1
AnImA8

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So, I was really disappointed when the new codex dropped and Purifiers were still seemingly nerfed into the ground. I played a couple of games with just Strikes/Terminators, and then played a game where my list was built around Purifiers. I gotta say, they surprised the hell out of me and my opponent.

3" was not too difficult to get into with our transport options, and that d6 mortal wounds was well worth the effort. The sheer volume of mortal wounds means that they're not really afraid of anything (helped take down a knight and a DP in 1500 pts). I played a second game with them today where I did not perform as well, but I also know that there were significant missteps on my part as a player. I'm going to continue playtesting them and refining my tactics, and for those who still love the idea of the Purifiers, I would recommend you give them a shot. It's one thing to look at a unit and reckon that they look really bad at a glance, but its another to actually give them a go in a few games of matched play.

I want to encourage people to come and post their experiences here, or present ideas on how to get around their weaknesses. What I don't really want to see is a rehash of the same old arguments that they've been gimped without any actual examples from actual play.


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#2
Godeskian

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Uhm, I've fielded two squads of purifiers and Crowe in a Stormraven as a 1000 screw you to my opponents backfield. The batrep should be somewhere on the board, and it did well.

I essentially used them as back field harassers, where as you noted, getting into 3" is far from impossible. They accounted, if I recall correctly, for two squads of tacticals and a couple of light vehicles between psychic and shooting
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#3
Corvus Fortis

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As I once said, they can be very powerful but very situative too. They must be taken in transport and come near their target, try do destroy it with Flame and... thats it. Due to 3" smite radius they are unlikely to reach any other target, unless it is close enough to initial one. And powerful targets can be easily screened by cultist, coscripts etc. So Purifiers should be used against elite armies like ourselves where every model counts. Another strong point of Purifiers that they will be rarelly considered as priority targets and when they are in 3" of their target, it's too late. Still frustrated that they became just psychic assassins. I'd like to see them with 2 attacks and 2 psychic powers in turn again even at the cost of nerfing PF. 



#4
Seizeman

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A Corvus said, the need to much work. They need a transport and even then is not sure they can get within 3" of your target, specially if the opponent is using screens.

 

But even if all of that works, you are paying 35 points over a strike squad for a one-time 3 wounds on the closest target, which I'm not sure is worth paying anyway.



#5
Danarc

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I used them once. Two 5 men squad on a raven.
The raven is perfect for them because probably you take it anyway.

But at the end they made the same game of strike squad, since d6 mordal wounds killed the PD but make useless their cac. I probably could have had the same results with ss smite and theyr attacks.

I love purifier, but they are too overpriced in 8th. Nevertheless I will try them again. :)

I'm hoping a discount for them in the chapter approved.

#6
Gentlemanloser

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At a minimum they need 2A back.

Until then, nope. Won't use them.

Edit. Our Elite slots have too many other units vying for the place.

Apothecaries, Doomglaives and Paladin.

Edit2.

Purifiers could have been fun. If GW let BC auras stack.

Have a few BC. A few Purifiers with 12"+ smite range. Interesting!

Edited by Gentlemanloser, 12 September 2017 - 12:24 AM.

QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#7
Brother-Captain Aurellian

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I've been having a lot of success with them. I take a LRC with a Brother-Captain, Castellan Crowe, an Ancient with the Banner of Refining Flame, and fill the rest in with 2 squads of Purifiers. You now have three 6" D6 Smites, one 12" D6 Smite, plus whatever you want the Brother-Captain to do, probably Vortex or Sanctuary. That has single handedly won me games before because my opponent thought he was safe behind Invuls. Only FnP might survive the onslaught, but I crushed two Leman Russ tanks in one round (obviously not JUST with Purifying Flame), and they were both at full.

 

Purifiers might be weaker than they were last edition, but they're still a powerhouse if you have the points and the means to transport them. I tend to distract from my Land Raiders by dropping Strikes in and flying around some Paladins in a Stormraven while my Dreadnoughts fire from the back lines. Then he has to choose what he wants to deal with.


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"I am the Warden of the Blade... It is my prisoner. I cannot destroy it, but I will contain it, and I can punish it.
It will seek my suffering, but it will suffer too. The Blade will strike for the Emperor, and never for itself."

- Castellan Garran Crowe


#8
Gentlemanloser

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What point levels are those games?

I couldn't afford a lr, raven, paladin purifiers, strikes and the rest. :(

Apart from his smite, did Crowe do anything for you? I'm super reluctant to even acknowledge he exists anymore.
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#9
Godeskian

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I played a 1k game (before you had to have boots on the ground) with Crowe, the purifiers in a Stormraven.

And for the record, Crowe ended up contributing nothing but smites

#10
Valerian

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I played a 1k game (before you had to have boots on the ground) with Crowe, the purifiers in a Stormraven.


For the record, that restriction doesn't come into play until the end of the second turn. Plenty of time to fly into position before you are forced to disembark any units.
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#11
AnImA8

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I've been having a lot of success with them. I take a LRC with a Brother-Captain, Castellan Crowe, an Ancient with the Banner of Refining Flame, and fill the rest in with 2 squads of Purifiers. You now have three 6" D6 Smites, one 12" D6 Smite, plus whatever you want the Brother-Captain to do, probably Vortex or Sanctuary. That has single handedly won me games before because my opponent thought he was safe behind Invuls. Only FnP might survive the onslaught, but I crushed two Leman Russ tanks in one round (obviously not JUST with Purifying Flame), and they were both at full.

 

Purifiers might be weaker than they were last edition, but they're still a powerhouse if you have the points and the means to transport them. I tend to distract from my Land Raiders by dropping Strikes in and flying around some Paladins in a Stormraven while my Dreadnoughts fire from the back lines. Then he has to choose what he wants to deal with.

That's awesome to hear that you've been having success with them! I've also been doing surprisingly well with them--just won a hard-fought game against World Eaters. But you're absolutely right about the power of essentially uncontested wounds (and casting smite on a 4+ makes them pretty darn reliable).

I've read this before too, that they're weaker than last edition, but I'm curious as to what exactly makes that true? I didn't get to play 7th, but when i played them in 5th and a little in 6th, cleansing flame wasn't anything to write home about. You had to get into assault to use it, and stack as many instances of it on the same unit as possible for it to be effective since it had no AP. It was essentially like using mass bolter fire (or any other mass S4 equivalent to get through armor saves), except you only got one shot for single-target units like vehicles/MC's. The only way in which I know them to be weaker is the lack of 2 attacks in assault (which is certainly dumb imo), but honestly free falchions make that a non-issue to me. After having tried it out, Purifying Flame is better than ever since mechanically it works equally as well against single targets as it does against squads, and it ignores toughness, armor, and invulnerables.

 

I played a 1k game (before you had to have boots on the ground) with Crowe, the purifiers in a Stormraven.

And for the record, Crowe ended up contributing nothing but smites

Godeskian, I've also found that Crowe is practically just a smite on a stick. But once again, I don't mind since when I used him last he was particularly sought after for just being able to tank hits and cast a rending cleansing flame lol. I'll take what is essentially a lascannon on a stick for his points.

I've been having good success with a pair of Godhammer LR's, and a pair of Lasbacks all with Purifiers and Crowe. Being able to put that many lascannon shots down-range has certainly helped, and the LR's are a consistent method of transporting the Purifiers into Purifying Flame range while also screening for the Lasbacks when necessary. I think that Stormravens are also a fantastic option, which can absolutely put out a world of hurt in the AT department too. I've tried mixing in Paladins and didn't find as much success, but I'll definitely try it again for a few games to see what kind of results I get.



#12
Gentlemanloser

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In 5th, Purifiers were used because they had 2A and you could get 2 psycannons with just 5.

And in 5th GK were Psycannons.

In 7th Cleasing Flame was awesome. Auto hit aura out of transports wirth fire ports.

In 8th, they are simply more expensive Strikes in a 'worse' foc slot, with a niche smite.

They have nothing really going for them. You'll probably get the same amount of mortal wounds from regular smite over the course of a game that you will wirth cleansing flame.
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#13
Beams

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Is there somewhere that says you can only do it once? Because in my codex it looks like they can do it every turn.

#14
AnImA8

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In 5th, Purifiers were used because they had 2A and you could get 2 psycannons with just 5.



They have nothing really going for them. You'll probably get the same amount of mortal wounds from regular smite over the course of a game that you will wirth cleansing flame.

 

Yea I don't know how you figure on the same number of mortal wounds. I would have to roll a 1 on every purifier squad every turn that they're casting it for that to be true, and I usually get them in range on turn 2-3. The 12" range is not so important as to net anything more than an extra turn of casting, and a 1 wound smite is pretty meager in comparison.

The Psycannons comment I understand: I do also miss taking a pair of those bad boys. But to be honest, I just dont take Psycannons anymore period, so it really doesnt matter lol.



#15
Rurik the blessed

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Guys. you haven't notice it yet.... Purifiers don't need extra Attacks... because they already have it with improved Smite...

remember that you can cast smite even with an enemy at 1".  units no longer get stucked by close combat, that concept has gone. just a simply restriction to shooting to be away 1" from the enemy. (whose doesn't affect psychic power)

 

so. don't worry about positioning. just charge the enemy, then cast smite the next turn.

 

Purifiers are still amazing!


Edited by Rurik the blessed, 12 September 2017 - 06:28 PM.

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#16
Seizeman

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Is there somewhere that says you can only do it once? Because in my codex it looks like they can do it every turn.

Technically they can every turn, but they should not survive for a second try. If they do, that's great, but you should not count on it when it comes to decide if you are playing them or not.


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#17
Rurik the blessed

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Is there somewhere that says you can only do it once? Because in my codex it looks like they can do it every turn.

Technically they can every turn, but they should not survive for a second try. If they do, that's great, but you should not count on it when it comes to decide if you are playing them or not.

 

 

you just need one man to survive... remember that


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#18
AnImA8

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Is there somewhere that says you can only do it once? Because in my codex it looks like they can do it every turn.

Technically they can every turn, but they should not survive for a second try. If they do, that's great, but you should not count on it when it comes to decide if you are playing them or not.

 

 

you just need one man to survive... remember that

 

Which lets not discount this. I had a Purifier that survived as a solo, did some of the Emperor's work since my opponent felt he had bigger threats to face, and then in the last turn Perils'd and removed the last few wounds off a rhino as he exploded in a shower of glory. The man was legendary lol


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#19
Gentlemanloser

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Becuase i drop strikes turn 1, and they smite every turn they are alive.

Purifiers start from turn 2, and you have to be very lucky for them to get into 3" range with a second squad.

Maybe you guys have better luck with them. Which is great. Strikes don't last that long anyway, but the range gets me more smites off than i would have with purifiers.
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QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#20
Danarc

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At a minimum they need 2A back.

Until then, nope. Won't use them.

Edit. Our Elite slots have too many other units vying for the place.

Apothecaries, Doomglaives and Paladin.

Edit2.

Purifiers could have been fun. If GW let BC auras stack.

Have a few BC. A few Purifiers with 12"+ smite range. Interesting!

Purifiers with a BC have 6" smite range, not 12". Only the ancient with banner and BC have 12". 

 

What point levels are those games?

I couldn't afford a lr, raven, paladin purifiers, strikes and the rest. sad.png

Apart from his smite, did Crowe do anything for you? I'm super reluctant to even acknowledge he exists anymore.

In my first 8th edition match Crowe disembarked from Raven and teleported the LR right to the face of Nurgle's army. Then he keep his objective and I won for 1 point. Not bad. :D

 

Guys. you haven't notice it yet.... Purifiers don't need extra Attacks... because they already have it with improved Smite...

remember that you can cast smite even with an enemy at 1".  units no longer get stucked by close combat, that concept has gone. just a simply restriction to shooting to be away 1" from the enemy. (whose doesn't affect psychic power)

 

so. don't worry about positioning. just charge the enemy, then cast smite the next turn.

 

Purifiers are still amazing if they cost 3 point less the now!

fixed.



#21
Brother-Captain Aurellian

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What point levels are those games?

Apart from his smite, did Crowe do anything for you? I'm super reluctant to even acknowledge he exists anymore.

 

We tend to play about 2000 - 2500ish. Sometimes 2v1s for the couple of our friend starting new armies.

Apart from Smite... not really. He's pretty terrible this edition unless you send him in against a horde. He mulches like half a unit of Gaunts by himself and destroys Guardsmen. Again, take him against blob armies, not against Elite armies, barring for his Smite.

 

For some reason, he's also a nice Distraction Carnifex, at least in my games.

 

 

 


I've read this before too, that they're weaker than last edition, but I'm curious as to what exactly makes that true? I didn't get to play 7th, but when i played them in 5th and a little in 6th, cleansing flame wasn't anything to write home about.

 

That's the problem then. They were GODS last edition. Two attacks each, 9 Ld, Fearless (our only access to that rule outside of taking a Relic, which was normally spent on CoS), Soul Blaze on their melee attacks (who cares lel), and could add +2 Strength via Hammerhand and cast a 9" Nova (which hit every enemy unit automatically within range of it, even fliers) at S5 AP4 Assault 2D6, Ignores Cover, Soul Blaze. As someone already said, chuck 'em in a Rhino and watch them wreck everything. You could also take 2 Psycannons for every 5, which meant you took a 10 slot, Combat Squad'd them and had stronger Purgators in the same slot for only a few more points a model.


"I am the Warden of the Blade... It is my prisoner. I cannot destroy it, but I will contain it, and I can punish it.
It will seek my suffering, but it will suffer too. The Blade will strike for the Emperor, and never for itself."

- Castellan Garran Crowe


#22
Gentlemanloser

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Yeah 6" with a BC.

That's why i said if GW were fun and let BC auras stack.

Would be a different scenario if you had 3 BCs with Purifiers around them dealing d6 smites at 24" range.

Or 48" with a 4th!

Expensive, taking 4 BCs. But fun!
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#23
Rurik the blessed

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So how to use them...

 

simply put a squad full warding staff. then go to battle,. cast sanctuary with the BC or any other unit close to them.  then you'll have an extra chance to survive the next turn.



#24
Danarc

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So how to use them...

 

simply put a squad full warding staff. then go to battle,. cast sanctuary with the BC or any other unit close to them.  then you'll have an extra chance to survive the next turn.

absolutely too expansive and you have also to build the list on purifiers since no sanctuary can be casted on GMDK.


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#25
Reclusiarch Darius

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I'd say the only way to do it is load them up in a Raven (two squads of 5) and get up in the enemy's face Turn 1. Gets around chaff/screening issues, and the Raven itself is superb at cracking open transports/clearing a landing zone with hurricanes and assault cannon. Just hope nothing with Fly or dedicated anti-air knocks your Raven out. 

 

Turn 2 you hop out 3" before the Raven moves, go another 6" into enemy lines, make sure you land a Brother-Captain nearby either with 'Gate' or Teleport Strike (you could even shove him in the Raven itself if you are brave). At that point you're pretty much going to cast onto whatever is 6" from the Purifiers (conga line the squads so you have options, you might BTFO your initial target). Double cast 'Purifying Flame', delete a character or badly injure a superheavy/monster (save your re-roll strategem for the D6 mortal wounds). Throw in a 'Vortex' from the Brother-Captain for good measure, then shoot+charge something nearby. 

 

10x Purifers is 280 points, which is nearly three Strike squads, or a decent sized Paladin unit. I'm still not convinced its entirely worthwhile, but D6 mortal wounds is quite nice (even if you have hit closest target). 


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