Xwingt65 Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I still think the Lion would make the most sense, and also be the most interesting loyalst primarch to return. There is a lot of story potential to mine with his return, and his take on the 41st millennium would be an interesting read. Release him, the DA codex and some Primaris Bikers, landspeeders, jet bikes, or whatever light fast vehicle Cawl has cooked up. Maybe even some Primaris Veterans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Marshal Bohemond Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Again I disagree, after Imperium secundus they both swore to never fight alongside each other and what Guilliman did to the Legions and The Imperium even if for sound reasons, the Lion would NOT have agreed to if he was not "knocked out". That what have caused their already existing rift to grow. They may not directly fight each other but the Lion would definately "take his toys and go home" and not "work for" Guilliman, hence him taking the Imerium Nihlus and the Co-consul issue. Mind you not a DA or Lion fan boy, just looking at what has been written this is the likeliest story arc for someone "running and guarding" Imperium Nihlus. Most of the remaining Loyalist brothers if they return would find following Guilliman to be a very hard pill to Swallow. Corax and Vulcan would likely fall in-line for the greater good, Russ and Lion would remain loyal to the Emperor but definately not follow Guilliman, and as much as I would love Dorn to smack Girlyman and say I told you so....he would like for the good of the Empire and his father make a begrudging peace. But just dont see Lion and russ "towing Guillimans party line." “You suppose too much… I too received Guillman's summons. I do not concur with his plans, and I would no more trust him with this engine than any servant of Horus. I consider Ultramar no safer a place for this device than Perditus, and even if Guilliman does not use it for his own purposes, I cannot allow it to fall into the hands of the Emperor’s enemies… Tell my brothers that there is nothing for them here.”“Tell Guilliman I have a reply for him… tell him to wait for me. I am coming.”“Guilliman is a misguided fool at best, and a traitorous dog at worst… I would no sooner bend my knee to him than to Horus. Curze has the truth of it, but I was blinded by my anger. It has fallen to me to be the scale upon which history will be balanced. Every event has its counter, every brother his equal. Curze seeks to sap my morale and the strength of my Legion with unending war. Such shall be the duty of the Dark Angels. Yes, they will be ready for the task. There will be no new Emperor, only a lifetime of war. My brothers will bleed each other dry, contesting for eternity until there can be no victor. No, not even him. There is only the Emperor, none is worthy of inheriting that mantle. I will ensure the Legiones Astartes destroy themselves before another matches the power upon Terra. That is true. Faced with the prospect of mutually annihilation, my brothers may come to terms. Horus will be forced to acknowledge the Emperor again, and Guilliman and the others will not usurp their true master.”“No, it is too important… even if what you say is true, I cannot return to Caliban yet. Come what may, I have to stop Horus and Guilliman.”… The Lion did the same, his whisper full of sorrow. “Yes, even if it costs me my Legion.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Marshal Bohemond Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Khan....well it would depend on what effect the Dark Eldar and the web has had on him but I think he would stay with Guilliman or just head out on his own again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbienw Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Bohemond, i think you need to have a read of Ruinstorm. They did not swear not to fight alongside each other.. There could of course be some disagreement over the codex and the dissoloution of the legions, but that happened after the Lion disappeared so what he would think of it remains to be seen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 There's no doubt that the Lion would be peeved. Ignoring the codex itself, he'll be upset that he isn't the Imperial Regent/Lord Commander. He wouldn't fight Guilliman however, or refuse cooperation when the situation call for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Marshal Bohemond Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I never said he would fight guilliman but he would definately not "bend the Knee" he would not refuse to help but I do see him moving to Imperium Nihlus and setting himself up as Guillimans equal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zodd1888 Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I don't think Russ will wake and go straight to war with G-man, but I do think Russ will attempt to prostrate Bobby for allowing the empire to be divided. Russ could take the Cicatrix Maledictum as a reason for independence from any type of plans Bobby may have had and will travel to assert imperial command of the other side. Once Russ has this level of control I can see the two having a disagreement to what are the next steps and therefore cement the split of the empire. Very HRE (Holy Roman Empire) and we may see a Byzantinian survival of one, and rather than ruin of another kingdom maybe see novus traitoris. Traitors not for the sake of the Chaos Gods, but for the pursuit of the crusade or Emperor as a God (ie. Robute supporting the church to maintain "order" and Russ calling Robute greedy for not enforcing the Emperors truth). All in all this will be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Russ is loyal to the Emperor, no? Guilliman is working on DIRECT orders from and with the blessing of the Emperor himself. If you read Dark Imperium you'll see that the Emperor did indeed communicate with RG. Declaration of Rebellion against RG is Heresy against the Emperor himself. Just thought I'd remind people of that technicality :-P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Caldersson Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 That is a good point. RG does tolerate the culture in order to cement his control. I think Lion and Russ would flip a table if they heard of this. As I said before I see Cicatrix Malediction as the division. It looks like SW control an area where it is weak allowing them access to the BA and the DA are right there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomMarine Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Meanwhile the Ironhands are just :cussing up chaos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Of War Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I completely disagree that the loyalist Primarchs would not "fight". I think if you go back and look at the interactions of the loyalist with each other during the HH it would break down like this: Lion returns first. He and Guilliman have too much History and the Lion essentially Hates Guilliman, add to that the Lions extremely high self pride, he already believed he should have been the Warmaster and also believed he should have led Emperium Secundus. Had he not already been asleep I garuntee he would have caused a second Civil War over the Codex. Plus the first time Guilliman became the Emperors Steward he essentially stole the position from Dorn. The Emperor appointed Dorn and gave him tasks to carry out before placeing him on the Golden throne, Guilliman seized the opportunity to "Empire Build" as even Malcador the Sigilite distrusted Guilliman's interest prior to and during the Heresy. Lion will take his toys and any that will follow him and take Imperium Nihlus. The Wolves would follow, there is a rivalry there but it is out of respect and honor rites not hatred. Russ returns and see's what has happend and also Joins the Lion seeing Guilliman as the unintentional architect of what has happened to the Empire. Guilliman starts to struggle (to many fronts to fight) and looks for assistance, finds Dorn and Dorn begrudgingly joins him to save the Imperium. Dorn also bitchslaps the Black Templars for their beliefs much like he did to Sigismund and gets them more in line with the original Imperial Truth and also re-enacts the Last Wall Protocol to help Guilliman secure the Imperium We end up with essentially the Holy Roman Empire, an Empire divided in 2 ruled by "co-consuls" Where the other primarchs still serve as equals, just the principal of Guilliman and the Lion being "first" amongst equals kind of thing. If the Lion didn't go against Rob during the Heresy, when there was virtually no one beside Sanguinius to stop him, and the Imperium was only facing internal strife, i very much doubt he would do so now, when there are hundreds of Chapters that would go against him, and humanity is facing imminent extinction from multiple outside threats. The Lion was a bit of an arse, but he cared about the Imperium and humanity. I'm also not sure where the idea he hates Rob has come from. He's disagreed on his methods and goals sure, but hate is far too strong a word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_son_of_Dorn Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 The lion was a mini emperor. Just more.....blonde. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corswain Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Russ is loyal to the Emperor, no? Guilliman is working on DIRECT orders from and with the blessing of the Emperor himself. Or so he says.... “Just had a conversation with the Emperor and he said do what I say. Oh, but there was nobody else there so don’t worry about confirming that.” ;) Getting sidetracked. I really hope Angron is just a big bloodthirster with cable dreadlocks like the art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betrayer41 Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Russ is loyal to the Emperor, no? Guilliman is working on DIRECT orders from and with the blessing of the Emperor himself. Or so he says.... “Just had a conversation with the Emperor and he said do what I say. Oh, but there was nobody else there so don’t worry about confirming that.” Getting sidetracked. I really hope Angron is just a big bloodthirster with cable dreadlocks like the art. You and me both. I just hope he is on the ground and not some goofy about to fly or about to land pose. I just want a big bloodthirster with both feet on the ground.....and sword and an axe...and zerkers....and termies and and and Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluntblade Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Hence why i want Krauty's version made canon. He based his scratchbuild entirely on that old artwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinstryfe Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 How I envision Guilliman and The Lion meeting again: Brother! You're alive! Roboute, what happened? All the Primarchs were gone for like 9000 years and these idiots ruined everything. Thank Father you're here, I need help. Wow, you're right. They messed up everything. I need my Legion again. The High Lords won't like that. And it would take years. Do you think I care about the High Lords? And I've already got like 15,000 waiting for me. But how? I restricted all chapters to 1000 Astartes... LOL We made Sanguinius the one in charge, remember? My children didn't care what you said. Oh yeah, well, good luck. I'm gonna take a nap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thousand Eyes Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 *Checks site stats* Wow I have a lot of traffic coming from B&C lately, normally people don't click on my signature... *Check were the traffic is coming from exactly* I get it now. For my two cents I really want to see what they do with Perturabo as a Demon Primarch. I haven't even heard descriptions of what he looks like when he ascends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Strike Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I wouldn't mind Angron as the big bloodthirster with the cable dreadlocks, but make the remains of his armor looks like his armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corswain Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I wouldn't mind Angron as the big bloodthirster with the cable dreadlocks, but make the remains of his armor looks like his armor. Yeah, keep the shoulders and chest based on the FW model an I will be stoked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I like Angron, but he's kinda... Predictable. He's literally an angry, slashy guy. Fulgrim and Lorgar would certainly be more exciting, and would have more interesting rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betrayer41 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I like Angron, but he's kinda... Predictable. He's literally an angry, slashy guy. Fulgrim and Lorgar would certainly be more exciting, and would have more interesting rules. Eh as long as Angron has some of the characteristic traits he had in Betrayer i think he could be a great character to come back. An angry slashy guy but with a true purpose would be great. Other than angron i would really like to see Perty that would be so out of nowhere and awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Caldersson Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I like Angron, but he's kinda... Predictable. He's literally an angry, slashy guy. Fulgrim and Lorgar would certainly be more exciting, and would have more interesting rules. Guilliman is almost just as predictable. We had people almost guess exactly how Guilliman would act Dark Imperium. Plus sometimes you just need a hack and slash rampager to mix things up, kind of like the orks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Company Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Plus sometimes you just need a hack and slash rampager to mix things up, kind of like the orks. And on that note, I could see Da Orkz seeing Angron as an avatar of Gork or Mork.... This could lead to the integration of the Blood Axe Klan to the Imperium... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinstryfe Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I like Angron, but he's kinda... Predictable. He's literally an angry, slashy guy. Fulgrim and Lorgar would certainly be more exciting, and would have more interesting rules. Guilliman is almost just as predictable. We had people almost guess exactly how Guilliman would act Dark Imperium. Plus sometimes you just need a hack and slash rampager to mix things up, kind of like the orks. Well, it's not hard to guess that the first loyalist Primarch, whomever it was, would take a look at the Imperium and go "What the tinykitty...", then try to fix things. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graysparrow Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Hey now, we don't need any green beans added to our Imperial soup. There's already enough high lord vegetables at the top of it. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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