Kimbo Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 Hi all! How good do you think the new DG tank is? How many will you use? Is the 4+ BS as good as it gets or is There something im missing? Cheers everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plaguecaster Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 I really love the new tank and will be picking up one regardless as id love to assemble it but I doubt I'll use one as it just doesn't fit my playstyle of an all infantry force. It's output looks quite lacklustre as we with only D6 on its main gun combined with BS4 which means you won't be always be causing as much damage most turns and you won't be able it move it at all otherwise it's BS gets even worse . Plaguespitters will be great for dealing with any enemy squad that gets too close and tries assaulting it whilst the Entropy Cannon seems quite good for extra anti tank though it's BS means your are just as likely to miss with it when you need it. The fact it is a Damon engine is huge since it's pretty resident having both an Inv save and Disgustingly Resilent in addition to its normal save, if you were wanting to get the most out of them then you need to take at least 2 or 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloody Legionnaire Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 I really love the new tank and will be picking up one regardless as id love to assemble it but I doubt I'll use one as it just doesn't fit my playstyle of an all infantry force. It's output looks quite lacklustre as we with only D6 on its main gun combined with BS4 which means you won't be always be causing as much damage most turns and you won't be able it move it at all otherwise it's BS gets even worse . Plaguespitters will be great for dealing with any enemy squad that gets too close and tries assaulting it whilst the Entropy Cannon seems quite good for extra anti tank though it's BS means your are just as likely to miss with it when you need it. The fact it is a Damon engine is huge since it's pretty resident having both an Inv save and Disgustingly Resilent in addition to its normal save, if you were wanting to get the most out of them then you need to take at least 2 or 3 Even the infantry need their support! I think it would fit in pretty well with an Infantry list and definitely fits in with the DG fluff of really only using vehicles that support the grunts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdannan Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 I plan on getting at least 2, and perhaps 3. I plan on making a foot sloggin force, and the Plagueburst Crawler fits that anti-tank role well, plus I love the idea of shelling the enemy, while walking up the field with infantry. Most likely will upgrade to entropy cannons as well, as anti-tank was my main weakness in my game with Death Guard so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TURBULENCE Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 Getting one right away for smaller games, the point value if the thing makes it pretty desirable for me, and the predator it's replacing wasn't really working for me anyway so the fact that I can hide this thing behind cover and lob shells all day seems pretty worth it. That and I actually really like the design. Definitely getting two overall, might convert a third into a counts as rhino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seethe Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 What about the Daemonforge Strategem? Is that in the DG codex, or something similar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Loss Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 I love the new tank - I've ordered one, and may consider getting another depending on how it performs for me. It doesn't have masses of firepower, but it is insanely resilient for the cost when you compare it to other tanks, which is what makes it so valuable. What about the Daemonforge Strategem? Is that in the DG codex, or something similar? Unfortunately, it isn't - which is a real pity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted October 1, 2017 Author Share Posted October 1, 2017 I plan on getting at least 2, and perhaps 3. I plan on making a foot sloggin force, and the Plagueburst Crawler fits that anti-tank role well, plus I love the idea of shelling the enemy, while walking up the field with infantry. Most likely will upgrade to entropy cannons as well, as anti-tank was my main weakness in my game with Death Guard so far. Got the same feeling! Starting with 2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seethe Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 OK so, per the new FAQ, it is saying if the only requirement to use a strategem is a battleforged army and a valid target. So if you include a valid CSM detachment with your DG army you get to use CSM strategems on any valid target in the list. Re-reading that, it makes me believe we can use Daemonforge on the PB Crawlers. Although to be fair, I'm probably missing something again FAQ for reference: https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Codex_Death_Guard_ENG.pdf Bloody Legionnaire 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LazyGitWargaming Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 (edited) OK so, per the new FAQ, it is saying if the only requirement to use a strategem is a battleforged army and a valid target. So if you include a valid CSM detachment with your DG army you get to use CSM strategems on any valid target in the list. Re-reading that, it makes me believe we can use Daemonforge on the PB Crawlers. Although to be fair, I'm probably missing something again FAQ for reference: https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Codex_Death_Guard_ENG.pdf I'm assuming so. That being said the Daemonforge stratagem makes mention of the Daemon Vehicle keyword, which doesn't appear anywhere that I can see unless they mean Daemon & Vehicle. I'm assuming therefore that this is supposed to say Daemon Engine and is yet to be FAQ'd. The PBC has the Daemon Engine keyword so I'm guessing it might be fine. The only big sticking point may be that it does say ..'a Chaos Space Marine Daemon Vehicle', which could well mean only a Daemon Engine in a Codex: Chaos Space Marines detachment/army and not anything else like Death Guard. I doubt it simply means Chaos Space marines in an all-encompassing, loose, fluffy way.. :( Edited October 1, 2017 by LazyGitWargaming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhanist Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I'm assuming so. That being said the Daemonforge stratagem makes mention of the Daemon Vehicle keyword, which doesn't appear anywhere that I can see unless they mean Daemon & Vehicle. I'm assuming therefore that this is supposed to say Daemon Engine and is yet to be FAQ'd. The PBC has the Daemon Engine keyword so I'm guessing it might be fine. The only big sticking point may be that it does say ..'a Chaos Space Marine Daemon Vehicle', which could well mean only a Daemon Engine in a Codex: Chaos Space Marines detachment/army and not anything else like Death Guard. I doubt it simply means Chaos Space marines in an all-encompassing, loose, fluffy way.. They covered the 'two keywords' bit at the end of the designers' commentary - with an example of possessed with the mark of khorne: "...his ability to 'add 1 to the Strength characteristic of all Khorne Daemons' would also apply to the unit of Possessed, as they have both the Khorne and Daemon keywords." So keyword wise, the plagueburst crawler is as valid a target as say a forgefiend, with the Daemon and Vehicle keywords. However, as you say, 'Chaos Space Marine' may well disqualify us, as the description of what CSM is short for on pg 156 of the CSM codex specifically excludes Death Guard. Tide of Traitors, which is allowed, only says 'chaos cultists', not 'chaos space marine chaos cultists'. But then I thought that blurb on pg 156 also disqualified us from Tide of Traitors and I was wrong there, so who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oreaper84 Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I believe it to be a case where we can use the strat on our deamon vehicles....which opens a whole new world for my lists. The FAQ stated the strats as unlocks basically so as long as the strat itself is not exclusive i believe it should be fine. I mean i was already bringing a detachment to unlock warptime for Morty...but this seals the deal for me. rerolling fleshmower drone......delicious Given that Deamonforge is a thing....would you rate defilers for DG now? i know i have considered it in the past for the sheer amount of dakka, but now it seems like a close combat capable version of the crawler for more points? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I'd argue you can't use it on DG Daemon Engines since it clearly says Chaos Space Marine Daemon Engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guidebot Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 (edited) I am pretty sold on the Plagueburst Crawler, and I'll explain why. A lot of the time, we want an ablative unit at the front of our advance to draw fire and make use of Cloud of Flies. I was initially going to use poxwalkers for this, but they have some problems, one being that they're actually slower than a lot of the units I'd want to screen. I had 26 poxwalkers in my list, but then I realised for the points I could take a Crawler. The Crawler is faster, has much better shooting, has only half the wounds but much better toughness and saves so is probably about as resilient. With 2x Plaguespitters, your foe basically has to answer it before it gets too close, and if they're shooting this, my plague marines and blightlords are getting less attention than they might. Also, when I'm the defender and not wanting to move across the table (e.g. vs Orks where I'd want to break them down with shooting before they charge), the Crawler is a really decent defensive unit, firing away with the mortar and slugger and then lurching forward to spray them down with the plaguespitters when they're close enough. T8, 3+, 5++, 5++ W12 is plenty tough for (edit) the points. I'll be taking 2 to begin with, probably 3 if they're as good as it seems. Edited October 2, 2017 by Guidebot Thrown Pommel and Eire 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeresyBeliever Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Are they not hitting on a 5+ when they move though? I think the idea is that you site them behind somthing and shell stuff. The flamers are there to protect it from assault. That will be my plan on using them. I have pre ordered one and will get that used before I get another but I really want two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guidebot Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 They hit on a 5+ if you move but I don't care about the mortar damage; that's just a bonus if it does anything. I plan to ram this thing into their lines, so that it draws fire and gets to ignore it's ballistic skill by using the plaguespitters. Then if it makes it in and dies, I'll cast putrid detonation on it. It's my fire magnet, but if the situation dictates, then as you say @Heresey believer, I can sit it more defensively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Will get at least two. Popping a cheap lord near them will really buff the output too with re-rolls. Eire and Guiltysparc 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoGuy Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Looking at the model, the only visual difference between the Entropy Cannons and the Plaguespitters is the nozzle. So I'll build my two w/ ECs. Driving them forward might be okay but the Mortar has a 12" minimum range. Bloatdrones can fill the same roll, are faster and can retreat and shoot in the next phase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guidebot Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 (edited) Looking at the model, the only visual difference between the Entropy Cannons and the Plaguespitters is the nozzle. So I'll build my two w/ ECs. Driving them forward might be okay but the Mortar has a 12" minimum range. Bloatdrones can fill the same roll, are faster and can retreat and shoot in the next phase. True, but unless you're giving em fleshmowers, they're more expensive and less durable too. Since all I want is an ablative wall (that happens to hit pretty hard!), the crawler suits me better. Edited October 2, 2017 by Guidebot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I was recently making a list and realized that a Helbrute with twin lascannon and a Crawler with entropy cannons/rothail volley gun are the same points: 162. With that being the case, which makes for a better anti-tank platform? How big of a difference is the 3+ vs 4+, 8 wounds vs 12, T7 vs 8, 5++/5+++ vs nothing, etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guidebot Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I was recently making a list and realized that a Helbrute with twin lascannon and a Crawler with entropy cannons/rothail volley gun are the same points: 162. With that being the case, which makes for a better anti-tank platform? How big of a difference is the 3+ vs 4+, 8 wounds vs 12, T7 vs 8, 5++/5+++ vs nothing, etc? I think the crawler. The mortar is also pretty ok against most vehicles, and the hellbrute doesn't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eire Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Looking at the model, the only visual difference between the Entropy Cannons and the Plaguespitters is the nozzle. So I'll build my two w/ ECs. Driving them forward might be okay but the Mortar has a 12" minimum range. Bloatdrones can fill the same roll, are faster and can retreat and shoot in the next phase. And the Bloat Drones don't lose BS with losing wounds, only movement, S and A. Don't get me wrong, I love the Plagueburst Crawler model, might end up buying two, but for me the Bloat Drone fills a better role for now. Have to test it though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulwyf Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 If you go with a FW Helbrute you are hitting on 2+ while still moving and can do some wicked damage with grav bombards. You do pay more than 162 points though. Eire 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LazyGitWargaming Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I was recently making a list and realized that a Helbrute with twin lascannon and a Crawler with entropy cannons/rothail volley gun are the same points: 162. With that being the case, which makes for a better anti-tank platform? How big of a difference is the 3+ vs 4+, 8 wounds vs 12, T7 vs 8, 5++/5+++ vs nothing, etc? I think the crawler. The mortar is also pretty ok against most vehicles, and the hellbrute doesn't have one. The Helbrute will hit on a 3+ though, even after moving. When standing still I suspect the crawler might just about edge it, due to the possible extra hits from the mortar. It's also far more resilient. I do like the resilience of the PBC, though I think that BS 4+ really really hurts it especially as its weapons are such a mixed bag. I think drones are over-all better carriers for the plague-spitters, and if you really want something to hang back and shell things out of existence while remaining out of sight, then get a Hellforged Scorpius. As the PBC is fairly slow (compared to other vehicles) it's pity they coudn't have it benefit from the Inexorable Advance rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guiltysparc Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Will get at least two. Popping a cheap lord near them will really buff the output too with re-rolls. Yep, they are nicely priced, 3 in a spearhead with a plain jane lord is a perfect little fire base for advancing DG infantry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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