Pin Vice drill bits UK

[Buggane]

Hi All

 

Can anyone recommend some decent drill bits for a pin vice in the UK? I see lots on the net and they often have reviews about being blunt or too fragile...so thought it best to get a recommendation from you good folks!

 

Cheers

[Arkhanist]

The cheapest small twist drill bits are usually quite low carbon rolled steel, and blunt quickly. Real high speed steel (HSS) fully ground bits should wear much more slowly, and often come with a coating such as titanium (TiN) or cobalt to improve heat dissipation and toughness further. Note, just because it's labelled HSS doesn't mean it's true - real HSS bits are suitable for use on steel, if the listing says otherwise, avoid. However, they don't usually go below 1mm, and sets usually have a bunch of bits that go up far larger than we need. But if you need some bits in standard sizes you can get them reasonbly priced from screwfix, e.g. 1mm, 1.5mm, 2mm

 

For our uses at < 2mm or so, usually called micro drill bits, tungsten carbide drill bits are probably best and often labelled for PCB use. They are really sharp and will stay that way for a long time; for hand drilling plastic, resin and metal, they're superb. But even more expensive than coated HSS bits.

 

I picked up a 10 bit set of these quite recently, 1.1mm to 2mm which have been great so far. They've also go down as far as 0.3mm if you need.

 

With all micro drill bits though, they can't stand much lateral force as they're so thin - pressure on the pin vice sideways (to try and change the angle of an existing hole for example, or using an archimedes drill too fast) risks snapping anything under 2mm or so. So always use light pressure in line with the bit - if you need to press hard, then your bit is probably blunt. You can get twist drill bit sharpeners, but unless you also do a lot of DIY, it's probably more cost effective to buy new bits.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Arkhanist

[LazyGitWargaming]

These are allegedly HSS and titanium coated, though I can't personally recommend them as I've never bought them. That being said they seem to have decent reviews.

You'd need another set for sizes above 1.6 mm

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Rolson-48304-Micro-HSS-Drill/dp/B005NH6C0M/ref=sr_1_4?rps=1&ie=UTF8&qid=1506858043&sr=8-4&keywords=micro+drill+bits+set&refinements=p_76%3A419158031

Edited October 1, 2017 by LazyGitWargaming

[Major_Gilbear]

From a post I made about this previously:

 

Okay, pin vice drill is what you need. Should cost like $5-7:

 

http://www.newmodellersshop.co.uk/images/expo_tools/750-10.jpg

 

Then buy ground drill bits (ebay is excellent for this) with a carbide or carborundum coating (should cost about $2-4 for a pack of ten all the same size).

 

[...]

 

1) Buy a hand pin vice drill (sometimes a pin vise drill) with a little "rest" at the end like the one I've shown above. Your hands will thank me for it! These normally come with two double-ended collets for holding different-sized drill bits. One is in the end where the bit goes (duh!), and the other is usually stored inside the handle.

 

2) Buy some brass rod for your pinning efforts. It's a little more ductile, won't rust, won't blunt your clippers, and can be filed without too much difficulty.

 

3) Buy "ground" drill bits - not "twisted" or"rolled". The cost more, but are properly-made and won't get stuck and break as easily. This is because the spiral cutting faces are machined onto the bit, rather than the bit being stamped and then twisted or rolled to get the spiral. The swarf (the stuff you drill out of the whole) gets stuck very easily in small bits, and the twisted/rolled bits aren't even enough to let it come out smoothly. Once you know what size brass rod you have, buy drill bits to suit that are 0.25-0.50mm larger to give the rod and glue some clearance in the hole. Avoid a multi-pack of bits, because you will never use at least 2/3s of the sizes!

 

I buy my drill bits from UK Drills on eBay here.

 

The most useful sizes I have are 0.7mm ground HSS and 1.0mm ground Cobalt (both here). This is because the two most common sizes for brass rod are 0.020" (0.51mm) and 0.032" (0.81mm).

 

Whilst I prefer to have ground Titanium-coated or Cobalt drill bits for the 0.7mm (and I have some I bought elsewhere), they are pretty delicate and wear out quite fast anyway - sometimes just using them a few times and then ditching them is a better practice for such small bits. I really only use the Titanium/Cobalt ones in this scale when drilling though metal parts (usually Warmachine, Infinity, and old Malifaux models).

[Arkhanist]

Personally I've switched to a keyless chuck pin vice, with jaws similar to that in an electric drill - like this one. Faffing about with collets when switching drill bit size is too annoying at my age, particularly for larger drill bit sizes. But then I use my pin vice for brass rod pinning (usually 1mm so 1.2mm drill), gun barrels, magnets and all sorts, so anything from 0.5mm up to 3mm. 

[Major_Gilbear]

The main advantage of the collets compared to the chuck is that the overall drill is slimmer, which can be very useful in getting into tight areas on models.

 

And whilst I agree that the chuck is a little less faff than swapping collets, the main collet I use is the same for all sizes up to about 1.5mm diameter anyway, which makes swapping collets over very infrequent to start with.

 

Finally, for the relative cost difference, I could suggest just buying two of the collet-style pin vice; this saves you even swapping drill bits if you need to change between small and larger drill bits very often. ;)

[Buggane]

Thanks guys, will these sizes cover magnets too or do you need a bit bigger for that?

[Major_Gilbear]

You can buy magnets in many sizes - and the same advice of buying a drill bit 0.2mm-0.5mm bigger than the magnet applies. I get mine from E-magnets UK here.

 

Typically, you will want magnets of about 2.0mm-5.0mm in diameter and about 1.5mm-2.0mm thick, as these have enough strength to avoid unwanted rotation movement of magnetised parts, as well as being strong enough to hold a plastic troop model to a metal surface for transport (and you can use a couple of magnets instead of one for bigger models).

 

For magnets of these (or bigger) sizes, you will also need to know that the pin vice drill I indicated above will only hold up to 2.0mm bits. The one Arkhanist linked to will go up to 3.0mm. The drill I use for big bits is this one however, which goes up to 6.5mm comfortably and is ideal for bases or bigger parts, but is rather unwieldy for small tasks (hence the pin vice).

[Stoic Raptor]

Well, will you look at this... I'm in the States, but does this look familiar (at half the cost)?
https://www.amazon.com/EnPointTM-Precision-Diamon-Shape-Woodworking-Countersink/dp/B072R2HXVN/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1506903678&sr=8-7&keywords=Precision+Pin+Vise

[Buggane]

Thanks guys, is the pipe from.ebay too? Why is that better than wire or paper clips? You mentioned it was easier on clippers?

 

Arkhanist - assume the bits that come with that vice are no good if you were recommending an separate set?

[Major_Gilbear]

If by "pipe" you mean brass rod, then this is exactly what it sounds like: link. Brass is softer than steel, and doesn't rust; this makes it better suited to cutting and filing, and is easier to roughen up for a better glue bond. It's also easier to bend neatly, which is helpful if you're pinning joints that aren't straight.

 

As for buying separate bits... The cost outlay of ten high-quality ground bits in one size works out at £0.30-£0.40 per bit, which is hardly expensive. I am fairly sure that the drill sets that come with bits use rolled rather than ground bits.

 

And before you ask what the difference is:

 

[...]

 

3) Buy "ground" drill bits - not "twisted" or"rolled". The cost more, but are properly-made and won't get stuck and break as easily. This is because the spiral cutting faces are machined onto the bit, rather than the bit being stamped and then twisted or rolled to get the spiral. The swarf (the stuff you drill out of the whole) gets stuck very easily in small bits, and the twisted/rolled bits aren't even enough to let it come out smoothly.

 

[...]

 

This quality difference is helpful in preventing getting bits stuck (and then breaking) inside your models.

Edited October 2, 2017 by Major_Gilbear
Additional info

[Arkhanist]

Thanks guys, is the pipe from.ebay too? Why is that better than wire or paper clips? You mentioned it was easier on clippers?

 

Arkhanist - assume the bits that come with that vice are no good if you were recommending an separate set?

 

Yeah, they're cheap bits. They will work ok-ish for a little while, but they'll blunt pretty quickly and are more likely to stick - they all seem to come with rubbish bits alas.

 

The other reason I switched to a chuck pin vice personally is that my 15 year old worn collet pin vice wasn't gripping smaller drill bits such as 0.7mm at all any more even with tape; I could have replaced the collet of course, but it was simpler to buy a new shiny vice than find one that fit! This should be much less of a problem with a fresh collet pin vice which is why I didn't mention it. Also, my knuckles aren't getting any younger so the fatter chuck is an advantage to tighten the thing up properly. Horses for courses etc, they both do the job and it's as much down to personal preference than one type being outright better than the other.

 

For magnets, I can't remember the last time I went above 3mm diameter. For a dreadnought arm, for example, I do a metal washer round the existing slightly sanded pin, then put magnets on the arm.  If I did need to do 5mm etc, I'd crack out my grandad's old pinion hand drill and bench vice, though major_gilbear's is less overkill!

[OnboardG1]

These are allegedly HSS and titanium coated, though I can't personally recommend them as I've never bought them. That being said they seem to have decent reviews.

You'd need another set for sizes above 1.6 mm

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Rolson-48304-Micro-HSS-Drill/dp/B005NH6C0M/ref=sr_1_4?rps=1&ie=UTF8&qid=1506858043&sr=8-4&keywords=micro+drill+bits+set&refinements=p_76%3A419158031

 

I use these in both my vice and my micro-drill. They're pretty decent bits. 

[DaisyDuke]

I bought these recently and they are doing the job,

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B0055APTX8/ref=yo_ii_img?ie=UTF8&psc=1