Decimator or Contemptor?

[Daionosis]

I would say contemptor, they got significant boost with the price decreases. The point changes made dropping dual chainclaw contemptor with Dreadclaw about 100 pts. cheaper than earlier.

 

Example:

Hellforged contemptor

2x Chainclaw

2x Ectoplasma Blaster

Dreadclaw

Grand Total 330 pts

Earlier this was 448 pts

 

I think at 330 pts this is a very good deal and maybe even borderline competitive option. I'm still arguing contemptors should be used as melee monsters because of their lifegain rule.

 

330 points is still an aweful lot for a single model in a transport which isn't very survivable. And although the fists are super cheap atm and certainly a viable option, I'd say you're wasting its precious 2+ BS. I'd even go so far as to say getting two guns might be better since it's still pretty decent in melee in a pinch.

 

Well I am looking for extra LD minusses to see if I can get a NL army to actually work with their Legion Traits so I want the Butcher cannons. But I've sort of fallen in love with Soulburners as well, and even with the points drops a contemptor is still about the same points as a decimator with petards, which is a lot more reliable. 

 

At the moment I'm in a bind. I used to run three maulerfiends but I found out even with their amazing speed and boat loads of attacks, they're too slow to keep up with the rest of my army. So they're our and Heldrakes are in for the turn 1 charge and tying up units. For the support I am leaning towards two contemptors with butchers, fists and soulburners and a unit of obliterators or two leviathans with butcher cannon arrays.. Rest of the amy is raptors, cultists and two heldrakes.  

Edited November 27, 2017 by Daionosis

[Ghorgul]

Agreed, it's not that survivable, I'm looking to either warp time it or the dreadclaw into melee during the deep strike turn.

 

It would be much more survivable if it could use the 'In Midnight Clad' stratagem, like all the new "power creep" codices are allowed to do

This is so very unfair if you ask me.

 

I don't think u are losing on BS 2+ though, ectoplasma blaster is still quite a good weapon, soulburners are nice but their point cost actually increased in CA. Of course Butcher Cannon + Melee weapon is also an option. Going 2 butcher cannons is brutal and much more affordable now, but IMO the Contemptor sucks in melee without proper melee weapons, few attacks without AP means it will struggle to clear even basic infantry units in melee, making it easy target to tie up with almost any unit, transports being the best. Normal 3+ save transport can tie 2x Butcher Cannon (no melee weapon) Contemptor indefinitely unless the Contemptor gets outside help, it doesnt have even theoretical possibility to destroy it unless the transport has only 1-2 wounds remaining.

Edited November 27, 2017 by Ghorgul

[Dallas Drake]

It doesn't have enough attacks for me. 5 attacks at S14 Ap-3/-4 D3/4 is great against monsters and tanks but it's just too easy to tarpit.  An extra attack for giving up shooting options like the butcher cannon or kheres is just not worth it.

[Fhanados]

So I've got a Mhara Gal Contemptor I bought years back (and forgot about) when I was doing Word Bearers that I'm going to run as a Black Legion Contemptor. I love the look of it but the Ectoplasma cannon seems pretty bad. For the points a Kheres Assault Cannon seems like a much better choice.I'd honestly rather it have the Helbrute Plasma Cannon instead. 

 

Anyway this prompted another train of thought - has anyone had much experience with "sub optimal" contemptor builds? Is the Contemptor's statline and abilities enough to carry it as a unit in it's own right without having to use certain weapons as a crutch to make it viable?

[Daionosis]

Agreed, it's not that survivable, I'm looking to either warp time it or the dreadclaw into melee during the deep strike turn.

 

It would be much more survivable if it could use the 'In Midnight Clad' stratagem, like all the new "power creep" codices are allowed to do

This is so very unfair if you ask me.

 

I don't think u are losing on BS 2+ though, ectoplasma blaster is still quite a good weapon, soulburners are nice but their point cost actually increased in CA. Of course Butcher Cannon + Melee weapon is also an option. Going 2 butcher cannons is brutal and much more affordable now, but IMO the Contemptor sucks in melee without proper melee weapons, few attacks without AP means it will struggle to clear even basic infantry units in melee, making it easy target to tie up with almost any unit, transports being the best. Normal 3+ save transport can tie 2x Butcher Cannon (no melee weapon) Contemptor indefinitely unless the Contemptor gets outside help, it doesnt have even theoretical possibility to destroy it unless the transport has only 1-2 wounds remaining.

 

I agree with most of what you're saying, my point earlier was if I had to choose between the all shooty variant or the two fists I'd probably take the shooty one :-) the one extra attack isn't worth it for me instead of the shooting.