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How would Sanguinius's return be explained?


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#51
The Blood Raven

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Sanguinius, primarch and scientist, searches for a way to tap into the hidden strengths that all primarchs have. Then an accidental overdose of gamma radiation alters his body chemistry. Now whenever Sanguinius becomes angry or outraged a startling metamorphosis occurs. An accidental explosion near the stasis chamber takes the life of a mechanicus tender. The primarch is driven by rage and pursued by an investigative reporter inquisitor. 

The primarch is wanted for a murder he didn’t commit. Sanguinius Is believed to be dead. And he must let the imperium think that he is dead, until he can find a way to control the raging spirit that dwells within him.

That’s how it should be explained.

 

Edit: for the young'uns.


Edited by The Blood Raven, 05 December 2017 - 11:02 AM.

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#52
Chaplain ChonkE

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Once living Lord of Vampires returns from the dead as an undead Lord of Vampires?

 

Seems like low hanging fruit to me.

 

That being said, I hope they dont strap/use a bunch of NecronTek on his body to achieve this resurrection leading to Sanguinius' eventual rise to become head of the new Lords of Undeath faction. *shudders at some of the similarities in that statement and Justice League movie plot*

 

*snaps out of it* Uh yeah. I think it could be done and quite easily (as could any character to be honest; super Techno-sorcery-psychic magic!) and probably should be done. Might as well get fully naked at this point with Papa G and the Daemon Primarchs running around. Bring back the PrimOrks, Eldar Heroes/Gods/New Aspects, make a Tau Emperor Equivalent with equivalent Greater Good Crusade, all Primarchs etc.

 

A return of dead Primarchs could be handled quite easily with the resources available in the Warhammerverse. Will those returns be handled well? So far GW is doing pretty good



 

Am I the only one who didn't see Prospero Burns as some quantum leap paradigm shift in Space Wolf lore?

Because aside from them swigging ale instead of mjod and of course the fact that they growl like canines instead of soggy cheetahs I am not seeing how Sven, Ragnar, and of course Mighty Haegr would be at all out of place in the VI Legion of M31.


#53
ronin_cse

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Well I think that if/when he comes back it will be via the Sanguninor and/or Mepheston somehow. As I mentioned those two have some kind of connection to Sanguinius has been foreshadowed for at least a decade now


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#54
b1soul

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I like the idea that the Sanguinor is a portion of Sang's soul capable of manifesting in realspace.

If Sang returns, it should be in an incomplete, "different" form...him but not truly him. That difference should be much more fundamental than the difference between pre-Heresy Guilliman and Amour-of-Fate Guilliman.

EDIT: It should at least be as fundamental a difference as the difference between Callistarius and Mephiston...or Arvida and Janus.

Edited by b1soul, 04 December 2017 - 11:37 PM.


#55
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The Lamenters return, explaining their absence from the defense of Baal. They found Sanguinius' body in a secret stasis crypt and quested to resurrect him, but Sanguinius has returned as a Monkey's Paw horrorshow. The Lamenters are sent on another penitent crusade, and the Blood Angels and their lineage wage a secret campaign to hide the atrocities committed by their insane, undead primarch while they desperately attempt to discover how to fix him. Several chapters go mad and join him in his super charged black rage, and an entire sector of the Imperium Nihilus becomes a kingdom of death that the rest of the Blood Angels and their successors quarantine from the galaxy.

Edited by Warsmith Aznable, 05 December 2017 - 02:48 AM.

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#56
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Once living Lord of Vampires returns from the dead as an undead Lord of Vampires?

 

Seems like low hanging fruit to me.

 

That being said, I hope they dont strap/use a bunch of NecronTek on his body to achieve this resurrection leading to Sanguinius' eventual rise to become head of the new Lords of Undeath faction. *shudders at some of the similarities in that statement and Justice League movie plot*

 

*snaps out of it* Uh yeah. I think it could be done and quite easily (as could any character to be honest; super Techno-sorcery-psychic magic!) and probably should be done. Might as well get fully naked at this point with Papa G and the Daemon Primarchs running around. Bring back the PrimOrks, Eldar Heroes/Gods/New Aspects, make a Tau Emperor Equivalent with equivalent Greater Good Crusade, all Primarchs etc.

 

A return of dead Primarchs could be handled quite easily with the resources available in the Warhammerverse. Will those returns be handled well? So far GW is doing pretty good (say what?!)

 

lol I was with you right till the end.


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#57
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Best explanation? "We're taking a dump on our backstory and the idea of sacrifice for the sake of raking in more temporary money." 

 

Seriously, there's no good way to bring Sanguinius back at all. His martyrdom meant something to the entire setting of the game. Now if they want to confirm that the Sanguinor is a shard of Sanguinus' soul or something and stat / model him out as such that's fine. But Sanguinius' death (along with Ferrus, Curze & Horus) should be final. 


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#58
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They killed of astartes and undid all the flaws of the geneseed for a first founding legion chapter (not their quirks, just their flaws), and replaced their fighting body with Primaris

They brought back 3 primarchs

They're not above defecating on past lore for the sake of sales

Edited by D3L, 05 December 2017 - 06:15 AM.

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#59
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I know you guys love your Martyrs in your silly Imperium but... I do hope you know by the end GW will resurrect the Emperor for the last conflict of the universe. That's why there was foreshadowing with the "Come the Apocalypse" allies system of 6th edition. The emperor will grant full pardons to the heretics which may include Sanguinius (Praise Khorne! Blood for the blood God!). Imperium, Chaos Marine, Eldar, Tau, Ork, and Necron will probably be holding hands in the end as the Great Devourer finally enters the galaxy for the final conflict.


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#60
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To be honest as soon as GW released Gulliman I was very much like "Ok....yeah I'm out."

 

Its weird...the presence of the Chaos led Primarchs doesn't actually annoy me. I think its because they weren't killed off as such, just ascended to a different realm etc. Them return of them "made sense" if you see what I mean? They hadn't died or been placed in stasis etc, they merely continued living but out of reach.

 

Explaining how Sanguinius survived being ripped apart by Horus and being found dead by the Emperor (which lead to him knowing that this was truly Horus' point of no return) is a flipping hard sell o be honest.

 

But GW aren't above such hamfisted mockery of existing lore/canon...your honour I give you exhibit A) The death of Warhammer Fantasy Battle. ;)

 

BCC


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#61
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There is also the possibility that all primarchs are Perpetual.
Just like all primarchs in different degrees are psykers.

It seems that some Perpetuals need a external source to come back to live.
While other have the rebirth function set to full auto.

Perhaps it the same with primarchs?
And only Vulkan was a strong enough Perpetual to auto rezz.

If that the case, then only Horus is truly gone as the got his "soul" destroyed.

But I really really hope this is NOT the case.
I prefer death to have some kind of meaning is stories.


At this rate, GW is reaching Disney level of saying death is meaningless!
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#62
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I would rather have the Angel than the Furry or the Troll (er, Lion).

What i would really want is a badass GW made Khan on some crazy ass jetbike decapitating some poor schmuck. Sadly, about as likely to happen as the Angel or Ferrus Manus.

#63
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They killed of astartes and undid all the flaws of the geneseed for a first founding legion chapter (not their quirks, just their flaws), and replaced their fighting body with Primaris

They brought back 3 primarchs

They're not above defecating on past lore for the sake of sales

 

I dont know man, i think that's unfair. 

The whole purpose of a well constructed, game-based, paused in time narrative is to leave ends open for engagement. Leave them open so that players can create their own worlds, their own stories, or leave them open so that writers can pick on those threads. 

The Primarchs that were brought back were never dead.  

Sanguinius is still an odd rumour, and I dont see him being brought back. That would be serious, hardcore lore retcon- or lore rework. 

 

There's a list of which primarchs are alive and which are dead. Bringing back the ones that were lost, or injured is absolutely genius and is honouring fluff and history by moving the narrative forward - its definitely not denigrating it  


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#64
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Let's face it... This has only spawned from a single member of GW saying on stream that he is in a stasis coffin.

 

Which his body could well be (and probably has been described to have been in the past...)


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#65
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It has been. The earliest fluff said his body was recovered. Then it was recovered and returned to Baal. The Deus series (Red Fury where Fabius Bile was impersonating an Adeptus Biologis priest) described his stasis coffin, surrounded by the skulls of past chapter masters/heroes.

 

Basically the earliest stuff was simply not specific as to the exact method of storage of his remains, and the more recent sources have been more specific but not invalidated the earlier sources. 


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#66
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Pretty simple. 
Yvraine does a little dance. 
Sanguinius "rises" from the dead. 


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#67
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The Primarchs that were brought back were never dead.

This isn't completely true - Guilliman was originally quite dead, and his body was placed in stasis so it didn't rot. There was a "claim" that his wounds were slowly healing, but that's somewhat different.


Edited by Lexington, 06 December 2017 - 03:27 PM.

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#68
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That isnt completely true either... he was placed in stasis on the point of death, which could mean just after or just before. Heck, it could even mean when they realised he couldnt be saved normally but might live another few hours under normal circumstances. Either could be a valid interpretation.
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#69
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@ Leonaides


Aye, it wasn't that cut and dry. Indeed, it was deliberately vague.

I mean...the Emperor is called corpse god, but he's not entirely a dead corpse.

#70
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According to Imperial propaganda...


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#71
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According to Imperial propaganda...


Except the Astronomican is still going, the shattered webway portal under terrain is still closed, and we have an honest to Emperor Saint running around.
Ergo, The Emperor is still very much "alive" as in still active in some form or fashion.

"For the Emperor and Sanguinius! Death! DEATH!"

 

 


#72
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Or the Golden Throne is what's powering the Astronomicon and keeping the Portal closed and the mummified corpse is just a facade.


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#73
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Or the Golden Throne is what's powering the Astronomicon and keeping the Portal closed and the mummified corpse is just a facade.

Yeah no.
Throne doesn't work if no one is on it controlling it.
Unless you think the Emperor didn't take an active hand in the Heresy till the very end because he felt like it, and Malcador killed himself sitting on it for no reason at all?

You chaos players can think whatever you like, and in universe you can even justify them calling Him a corpse Emperor, but we all have actual outside the universe info that says he's still alive, somehow, in some way.

Back on topic, Sanguinius should stay dead, just like ferrus, curze, and horus, and big E should stay on the throne.
Them showing up as Warp Ghosts or apparations, or visions is fine, it has a lot of in universe justification built in, but physically their dead.
Or else 40k as a setting is actually dead, and it'll be Emperor Daddy and the Little Primarch Tykes for all eternity. *shudders*

Edited by The Unseen, 07 December 2017 - 07:36 AM.

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"For the Emperor and Sanguinius! Death! DEATH!"

 

 


#74
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Yeah... yeah.

 

There's been theories since the dawn of time in this setting that the Emperor isn't really alive. If anything, he's a figurehead for the High Lords and Inquisition. Who's to say the Throne at this point really does need a host to function? Who says it did after the Emperor died and the Mechanicum needed to figure a way to keep it all working? What you base it on is Imperial propaganda and often times it contradicts itself. Even the information we have from an outsider's point of view is skewed or non-existent. 


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#75
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Dark Imperium categorically states that the Emperor is still alive on the Throne, and his psychic might is far greater than it was during the Heresy. Guilliman was subjected to the Emperor "communicating" with him and it nearly killed him.

This isn't up for debate. He's still powering the Astronomicon.

Edited by Ishagu, 07 December 2017 - 09:57 AM.

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