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Friendlier 2K Thousand Sons


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#1
Mogsam

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So having played my first game with the 2k Sons, I'm a bit concerned that they might be a bit strong if I play to their strengths too hard - I previously fielded two units of Sekhmet and neither struggled throughout the game, the only casualty was when I forgot they had two wounds. 
 
This is my attempt to build a friendlier list and tone down the psychic might but remain relatively thematic. I'm not opposed to altering the Sekmet down to regular terminators and I'm tempted to remove the Vindicator. The majority of the group hasn't been playing long and losing 10 recently painted guys to a pie plate isn't a great start - particularly when so many people in the army have malestrom available. The only item that has to stay is the punching dread in his drop pod. It's not 30k without him.
 
+ HQ +
 
Praetor, Legion [205pts]: Cataphractii Terminator Armour, Combi-Bolter, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), Mastery Level 2, On Foot, Paragon Blade

+ Elites +
 
Osiron Contemptor Dreadnought [325pts], Legion: Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon, Dreadnought Drop Pod, 
Psykic Pilot ML1: Telekenesis, 
 
Sekhmet Terminator Cabal [335pts]: Cataphractii Terminator Armour, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis):
Additional Wargear: 2 x Power Fists, 5 x Power Axes

+ Troops +
 
Tactical Squad, Legion [170pts]: Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), 
Additional Wargear: Additional Chainswords/Combat Blades, Bolters
Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Melta Bombs
Power Weapon: Power Axe
 
Tactical Squad, Legion [160pts]: Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), 
Additional Wargear: Additional Chainswords/Combat Blades, Bolters
Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Bolter, Power Fist
 
Tactical Squad, Legion [160pts]: Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), 
Additional Wargear: Additional Chainswords/Combat Blades, Bolters
Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Bolter, Power Fist
 
+ Heavy Support +
 
Castellax-Achea Battle Maniple [300pts]
Castellax-Achea: Aether-fire Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Aether-fire Cannon
 
Sicaran Punisher Assault Tank [220pts]: Lascannon Sponsons, Punisher Rotary Cannon
 
Vindicator Siege Tank Squadron, Legion [120pts]
 
Other items available but unpainted:
 
A regular contemptor with double fists.
A regular contemptor with dual autocannons
5 Heavy weapon guys with Volkites
5 Heavy weapon guys with Autocannons
All of the terminators I could possibly want.
A non terminator Prateor/Centurion.
Magnus
 
 
 
 


#2
Laughingman

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What ROW are you intending to use? I assume you intend get off Levitation for the Sekhmet and avoid having to buy a transport... Otherwise they will be Slow...

Be weary of this strategy if you opponent comes "prepared" I.e plasma spam, Medusa Squadrons, etc...

 

In terms of being Friendly... I heard of individuals who play hard Thousand sons list (IE bring magnus), who simply give opponents allied sisters of silence on a game to game bases...



#3
Mogsam

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I hadn't really thought about any ROWs actually. Had forgot about them completely. I had intended originally to go with the Crimson King, but that would involve at least two units of Sekhmet which is precisely what I am trying to avoid. I don't really see any suitable ones on initial look, any ideas? 

 

I haven't got a Spartan, I had intended for all of the teleportation originally. I'm not massively concerned about them being slow, only one person in the group has any real transports for their troops. Plasma spam is a real issue with the armies around - most people have 10 in a unit - but there aren't massive amounts of AP2/1 templates, just a couple of vindicators in bigger games. There is no win at all cost attitude around.

 

The sisters will probably be appearing fairly frequently, I think the last game with Magnus and a stupid amount of power dice really drove that home.



#4
Laughingman

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No idea about the Sekhmet, but at least other terminators in the Age of darkness require specific rites of war to deepstrike....



#5
StayThirstySD

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It’s been a while for this post, but I’d thought I could share. I have been thinking about my next 3k list and debating how powerful a list I was going to run. I agree that the GotCK row seems to push people over the edge. I’m sorta looking at the other one we have. I think you could do that with combining your tac squads. We need two 20 man units and you are good to go. Sit them on an objective and they are fearless. Not OP, and the more tac marines, the more bodies your opponent can kill = more fun. Anyway, just go have fun and don’t take Magnus in small games. You should be fine.

#6
Mogsam

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I have largely dumped the above list. My army now tends to revolve around:

 

Praetor, Level 2 Divination, Paragon Blade and Cataphractii.

 

Cataphractii (x7) Raptora

 

3 x Veteran Squads (x10), Brotherhood of Psychic, Asphix Shells, Power fist/Power weapons, Divination

 

2 x Castellax with Aetherfire Cannon.

Volkite Heavies (x5 or x 10), Divination

Punisher Sicaran.

 

The rest of the army changes depending on how I'm feeling really! It's a really solid elite core.



#7
SickSix

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Are you not running Sekhmet becuase they are too powerful?

Also how do the Castellax fair?

1K sons are going to be my second army for heresy and I really want to feature those awesome models.

Edited by SickSix, 03 May 2018 - 06:19 PM.


#8
Mogsam

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Are you not running Sekhmet becuase they are too powerful?

Also how do the Castellax fair?

1K sons are going to be my second army for heresy and I really want to feature those awesome models.

 

Basically yes. Sekhmet aren't fun for the opponent unless they bring a high tier army. I prefer regular terminators as the 1 wound makes them a bit more palatable. 

 

Castellax are really good. They kill terminators easily and they are generally hard to kill. For 150 points they are much better than dreads for me.



#9
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I don't think Sekhmet are that bad. If you go with a not so great discipline, like pyromancy, roll for powers instead of choosing them, and maybe not use Raptora and they are quite fair for your opponent.

#10
Mogsam

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I always roll for powers. Seems intended.

 

I still use raptora as with 1 wound they aren't that bad.



#11
Mogsam

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Got a 2250 game on Wednesday, so put something together. Another attempt at a different friendlier list!! This is against what is probably going to be a fairly artillery heavy Iron Warrior army, hence all the Raptura! (+1 to Invulnerable to non 2K Sons players!)

 

HQ

Praetor - Raptora, (Telekinesis) Cataphracti Armour, Paragon Blade. Arcane Litanies, Digi-Lazers, Level 2. (230)

 

Elite

Contemptor - Osiron, Pyrae (Pyromancy), Close Combat Weapon, Force Combat Weapon. (225)

2 x Rapier Lazer Destroyer - Corvidae (Divination) (110)

Terminator Squad (6) - Raptora, (Telekinesis) 2 x Powerfist, Chainfist, 3 x Force Axe, (250)

 

Troops 

Breacher Squad (10) - Raptora, (Telekinesis) 2 Meltaguns, Powerfist (245)

Veteran Squad (10) - Raptora, (Telekinesis) Power Fist, Brotherhood of Psykers, (200)

Veteran Squad (10) - Raptora (Telekinesis) Power Fist, Brotherhood of Psykers, (200)

 

Fast Attack

Javelin - Missiles, Multi-Melta (65)

 

Heavies 

Castallax (2) Achea Battle Maniples - Aether-Fire Cannon (300)

Heavy Squad (7) - Corvidae (Divination), Volkite Culverns (225)

Sicaran Punisher (200)

 

I don't think that it is too powerful, certainly only having 6 levels of Psychic shouldn't be overwhelming for anyone. I would prefer to have Divination on the Veteran Squads, but the Praetor is alot better with the bonus invulnerable saves. 

 

Thoughts?



#12
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I love my assault squad with combat shields w/ Chappy/apoth with jump.  5+ vs shooting and 4+ in cc are hidden gems.



#13
Mogsam

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Yeah, I found the Breachers to be really good. So much so that I went out and got another 20 (converted, not made of money!) I realised I have nearly 8000 points now, so lots to choose from. 

 

This evening I'll field a 3000 point army that is based around utilising lots of robots and around a siege theme. This will be the first bigger game that I haven't used Terminators of any kind. The Vindicator has been gathering dust for a while, so it's unusual to have one for me. I purchased a Medusa, but haven't had it arrive yet or that would have been the first choice. 

 

I had thought about running this as a Brethren of Iron, but this seems just as good.

 

++  Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) ++
Pride of the Legion.
 
+ HQ +
 
Praetor, Legion: Arcane Litanies, Artificer Armour, Boarding Shield, Bolt Pistol, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), On Foot, 2x Psychic Mastery Level, Thunder Hammer
 
+ Elites +
 
Apothecarion Detachment: Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Apothecary, Legion: None (Infantry, Power Armour), Power Armour
Chainsword or Combat Blade: Combat Blade
 
Contemptor Dreadnought Talon
Contemptor Dreadnought, Legion: Twin-linked Autocannon, Twin-linked Autocannon
 
Contemptor Dreadnought Talon
Contemptor Dreadnought, Legion: Osiron
Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon: Twin-linked Bolter
 
Rapier Weapons Battery, Legion: Cult Arcana: Corvidae (Divination)
Rapier Weapons Battery, Legion: Laser Destroyer Array
Rapier Weapons Battery, Legion: Laser Destroyer Array
 
+ Troops +
 
Breacher Siege Squad, Legion: 14x Breacher Siege Space Marines, Legion, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Additional Wargear: 3x Meltagun
Breacher Siege Sergeant, Legion: Bolter, Power Fist
 
Breacher Siege Squad, Legion: 14x Breacher Siege Space Marines, Legion, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Additional Wargear: 3x Meltagun
Breacher Siege Sergeant, Legion: Bolter, Power Fist
 
Veteran Tactical Squad, Legion , Compulsory: 9x Bolt Pistol, 9x Bolter, Brotherhood of Psykers, 9x Combat Blade, Cult Arcana: Divination: 9x Veteran Space Marines, Legion
Veteran Sergeant, Legion: Bolt Pistol, Bolter, Power Fist
 
Veteran Tactical Squad, Legion , Compulsory: 9x Bolt Pistol, 9x Bolter, Brotherhood of Psykers, 9x Combat Blade, Cult Arcana: Divination:, 9x Veteran Space Marines, Legion
Veteran Sergeant, Legion: Bolt Pistol, Bolter, Power Fist
 
+ Fast Attack +
 
Javelin Attack Speeder Squadron, Legion
Javelin Attack Speeder, Legion: Hunter-killer Missile, Multi-melta, Twin-linked Cyclone missile launcher
 
+ Heavy Support +
 
Castellax-Achea Battle Maniple
Castellax-Achea: Aether-fire Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Aether-fire Cannon
 
Castellax-Achea Battle Maniple
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
 
Vindicator Siege Tank Squadron, Legion
Vindicator Tank, Legion: Combi-Bolter, Demolisher Cannon


#14
Mogsam

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So I am going to be going to a narrative event in December and need to put a 2000 point list together. In addition I also need to bring a 1250 point Zone Mortallis army as well for a single game. 

 

As it is an event outside of my usual group and I have no idea what people are going to be bringing, I've put together what I think is a reasonable army, not too overpowered, but no likely to be overrun instantly! That said, I have no idea if it is good in the wider meta?! Am I missing something major?

 

I have nearly 8000 points of 2k Sons, so all thoughts are appreciated and I may be able to facilitate changes!

 

++  Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) ++
 
+ HQ +
 
Praetor, Legion: Arcane Litanies, Combi-Bolter, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), On Foot, 2x Psychic Mastery Level
Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour: Terminator Armour
Power Weapon: Force Axe
 
+ Elites +
 
Khenetai Blade Occult Cabal (x10) : Cult Arcana: Pavoni (Biomancy) [Ride in the Anvillus]
 
Sekhmet Terminator Cabal (x6): Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour, Cult Arcana: Raptora, 2 x power fists, 1 x chainfist, 3 x axes (Telekinesis) [Ride in the Spartan]
 
+ Troops +
 
Tactical Squad, Legion: Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis),
Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Power Fist
Rhino
 
Tactical Squad, Legion: Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis),
Tactical Sergeant, Legion: Power Fist
Rhino
 
+ Fast Attack +
 
Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod: Frag Assault Launchers [Khenetai ride in here]
 
+ Heavy Support +
 
Artillery Tank Squadron, Legion
Medusa, Legion: Medusa Siege Gun
 
Castellax-Achea Battle Maniple
Castellax-Achea: Aether-fire Cannon x 2
 
Spartan Assault Tank, Legion: Quad Lascannon Sponsons x2, Twin-linked Heavy Bolter
-----------------------------
 
For the Zone Mortallis section, I went fluffy and didn't actually include any of my 2000 points units. I have gone completely different, with lots of thematic units for a zoid warfare game.
 
++  Zone Mortalis - Combatant (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) ++
 
Centurion: Artificer Armour, Boarding Shield, Bolt Pistol, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), On Foot, Psychic Mastery Level x 1
Consul: Centurion, Legion
Thunder Hammer: Thunder Hammer
 
+ Elites +
 
Contemptor Dreadnought Talon - Osiron
Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon: Twin-linked Bolter
 
 
+ Troops +
 
Breacher Siege Squad, Legion: (x14) Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Additional Wargear: 2x Meltagun
Breacher Siege Sergeant Power Fist
 
Breacher Siege Squad, Legion: (x14) Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Additional Wargear: 2x Meltagun
Breacher Siege Sergeant Power Fist
 
+ Heavy Support +
 
Castellax-Achea Battle Maniple x 2
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
 
Thoughts?
 

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#15
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Love the ZM list !


Smile like Dynat when you're winning !


#16
Apostle of the 30th Host

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Zone Mortalis list looks decent - it is a really good base to work with, but looking at it more closely I would make a few minor edits.

Also, you were 5 points over the 1250 you were aiming for.

To simplify things, I have written an alternate list and explained any changes I have made.

 

Alternate List – Zone Mortalis – 1500

++ Rite of War – Zone Mortalis Assault Force ++

*This Rite of War is amazing! If you keep your Breachers is base contact with each other (and they are not pinned or fleeing), then they gain +1 to their Inv. This DOES stack with the Raptora bonuses - for a total of +2 - meaning your Breachers will have a 4+ Inv to shooting, and 3+ in combat.

HQ: Legion Centurion (135)

+ Delegatus Consul Upgrade

+ Psyker (Mastery Level 1)

+ Artificer Armour

+ Refractor Field

+ Master-Crafted Force Weapon

+ Arcane Litanies

 *To take the Rite of War, you need a Character with Master of the Legion. A Delegatus is only a 15 point upgrade and you get a free Master-Crafted Weapon upgrade.

**Refractor Fields are better than Boarding Shields - as long as he stays in a Breacher unit he will benefit from the Defensive Grenades - and the Inv is more reliable (Shield = 5+ Shooting/4+ Combat with Raptora, whereas Refractor Field = 4+ Shooting and Combat with Raptora)

***I would take a Force Weapon instead of a Thunder Hammer as there is a higher chance of getting Instant Death and it is not a Specialist Weapon, meaning you benefit from the extra attack of having a Pistol. Reduced Vehicle killing potential is made up with a Melta Bomb.

Troops: Legion Breacher Siege Squad (310)

+ 5 Additional Breacher Siege Space Marines

+ 2 Meltaguns

+ Melta Bomb

Troops: Legion Breacher Siege Squad (310)

+ 5 Additional Breacher Siege Space Marines

+ 2 Meltaguns

+ Melta Bomb

*To free up the points to reinvest in the Delegatus and bring you back under the 1250 total, I had to cut the Power Fists. They were the most expendable option in your list (You really want to be shooting anyway). There was enough left over to add Melta Bombs to both Sergeants though.

Elites: Legion Contemptor Dreadnought (225)

+ Osiron Dreadnought Upgrade

+ Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon with Twin-Linked Bolter

Heavy Support: Castellax-Achea Battle-Automata Maniple (270)

+ Additional Castellax-Achea Battle-Automata

 

Will take a look at the larger list in a bit too.

Edit: A brief few things I have noticed about your 2000 points list...

1. It relies on Raptora a lot and, to be honest, Raptora is not that good. +1 Inv to anything that already has one is decent, but the Telekinesis powers aren't great and it has no benefit for your Tactical Squads. I would consider Divination instead as that would benefit your Tactical Squads. Yes, that means that your Praetor doesn't get +1 Inv, however, the Primaris power is better and 5/6 powers are good (Foreboding - gives your Khenetai or Sekhmet Counter Attack if it looks like they will get charged; Forewarning - gives a unit - I would cast this on the Khenetai - a 4+ Inv; Perfect Timing - Ignores Cover is always good (but the Plasma Cannon Castellax-Achea may benefit most as that removes both the Armour and Cover save); Precognition - re-roll hit, wound and saves is better than +1; Misfortune - Rending weapons is always good).

2. I would also suggest Biomancy on the Sekhmet. Better powers that are more useful than +1 Inv (i.e. Eternal Warrior, anything that boosts Attacks, Witchfire that restores wounds etc.)

3. Power Fists are a waste of points on Tactical Squads. They should be shooting, and if you ever get into a situation where they could use them, then things are going so badly that not having them is the least of your problems. Those points could be spent on Pintle Multi-Meltas for the Rhinos.

 

Edit 2: Your 2000 Point army is in fact 2045... So here is a new list that corrects it...

HQ: Legion Praetor – 100

+ Psyker (Mastery Level 2) – 50 / 150

+ Cataphractii Terminator Armour and Combi-Bolter – 35 / 185

+ Force Axe – 5 / 190

+ Arcane Litanies – 10 / 200

 

Troops: Legion Tactical Squad – 125 / 325

+ Rhino – 35 / 360

 

 Troops: Legion Tactical Squad – 125 / 485

+ Rhino – 35 / 520

 

Elites: Khenetai Blade Occult Cabal – 185 / 705

+ 5 Additional Khenetai Blades – 125 / 830

+ Melta Bombs – 5 / 835

 

Elites: Sekhmet Terminator Cabal – 255 / 1090

+ 1 Additional Sekhmet Terminator – 35 / 1125

+ 2 Power Fists – 10 / 1135

+ Chainfist – 10 / 1145

 

Fast Attack: Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod – 115 / 1260

 

Heavy Support: Legion Vindicator Siege Tank – 120 / 1380

+ Laser Destroyer Array – 10 / 1390

+ Extra Armour – 5 / 1395

 

Heavy Support: Castellax-Achea Battle-Automata Maniple – 135 / 1530

+ Additional Castellax-Achea Battle-Automata – 135 / 1665

+ Aether-Flame Cannon – 30 / 1695

 

Heavy Support: Legion Spartan Assault Tank – 305 / 2000

*I cut the pointless Power Fists on the Tactical Squads and swapped the Medusa for a Laser Destroyer Vindicator as you'll probably need a bit more anti-armour. That brought you back under 2000, with the left over points being used to add Melta Bombs and other minor upgrades.

 


Edited by Apostle of the 30th Host, 17 September 2018 - 07:04 PM.

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30k Word Bearers (and soon to be Daemons, Cults and Militia, and Dark Mechanicum) - http://www.bolterand...lth-shall-burn/

 

I have spare 30k Word Bearers Transfers (Pre-Heresy, Unspeaking, Serrated Sun, Graven Star) - http://heresy30k.inv...sale-4x-sheets/

 

 


#17
Mogsam

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Thanks for the feedback! Much appreciated. What are you using the write the lists? Mine aren't coming up over on Battlescribe, something must have a wrong number somewhere.

 

----------

 

Zone Mortallis: - I knew that I wasn't crazy and that I had seen a rule about breacher shields getting buffs in Zone Mortallis. I'd been trying to find out where that rule comes from for ages last night! Definitely want that RoW, 3+ breachers are ideal and fluffy to boot!

 

My concern over losing the breachers power fists is that they will be able to take a charge easy enough - what with losing the extra attacks and the ridiculous combat saves, but they can't deal any damage. I've had them do quite well with the power fists before, holding up much better units and terminators and whittling away at them.

 

I can lose the hammer on the character. He is still unpainted. He has been rule of cool so far, but a force axe would work just as well. I have lots spare from the Sehkmet that I didn't give axes too. He's keeping the shield though. Is it sub optimal? Yes. But he looks awesome and literally everyone else has one!

 

I'm thinking pyromancy on the Osirion?

 

Here's an alternative list based off your feedback:

 

++  Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1250pts] ++
 
+ HQ +
 
Delegatus [140pts]: Arcane Litanies, Artificer Armour, Boarding Shield, Bolt Pistol, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis), Melta Bombs, On Foot, Psychic Mastery Level 1, Consul: Delegatus, Power Weapon: Force Axe
 
+ Elites +
 
Contemptor Dreadnought Talon [225pts]
Contemptor Dreadnought, Legion: Osiron, Dreadnought Close Combat weapon 
 
+ Troops +
 
Breacher Siege Squad, Legion [310pts]: 13x Breacher Siege Space Marines, Legion, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Additional Wargear: 2x Meltagun
Breacher Siege Sergeant, Legion: Bolter, Melta Bombs, Power Fist
 
Breacher Siege Squad, Legion [305pts]: 13x Breacher Siege Space Marines, Legion, Cult Arcana: Raptora (Telekinesis)
Additional Wargear: 2x Meltagun
Breacher Siege Sergeant, Legion: Power Fist
 
+ Heavy Support +
 
Castellax-Achea Battle Maniple [270pts]
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
Castellax-Achea: Maulter Pattern Bolt Cannon
 
+ Allegiance +
 
Legion and Allegiance:   XV: Thousand Sons, Loyalist
 
Rite of War: Zone Mortalis Assault Force
 
I acknowledge the melta bomb on the breacher sarge is pointless, but can't exactly spend it elsewhere!
 
I'll take a look at the 2k list in a bit properly, but I can confirm that Sehkmet can't have Biomancy, it's a tournament nerf to them!


#18
Apostle of the 30th Host

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No worries. I actually write them by hand - really inefficient but I feel like it makes me less reliant on the programmes that build lists for you, and I really don't like how BattleScribe lists look. I still make errors, but I still like to go through and do it myself.

 

Just to answer the main point though, new list looks really good. I think that will do really well.

 

Glad to see you agree on the Rite of War, if I had to pick one thing for you to use from my suggestions, that would have been it. It is really good.

 

Completely agree on the Power Fists, if I had the points I would have kept them too, but they were just the most expendable thing I could find to get points for the Delegatus. I like what you did instead though, cutting a single marine from each squad saves the same amount. 

 

Again, I completely agree on the shield. If that's what you like, keep it. Objectively, the refractor field is better and costs the same, but when I build lists fluff and rule of cool take precedent so do it.

 

Why Pyromancy? I don't want to just shoot your idea down, so curious why you were edging towards that. I would pick Telepathy as Psychic Shriek is great. Plus you get to roll for a power too, and Mind Howl / Shrouding should work well. Divination is also a decent option.

 

 

Melta Bombs are decent to be fair. In most situations you'll use the Power Fist, but it's always handy to have it.

 

Ah, fair enough. They are very good with Biomancy. In that case, I would stick with Raptora on them. 


30k Word Bearers (and soon to be Daemons, Cults and Militia, and Dark Mechanicum) - http://www.bolterand...lth-shall-burn/

 

I have spare 30k Word Bearers Transfers (Pre-Heresy, Unspeaking, Serrated Sun, Graven Star) - http://heresy30k.inv...sale-4x-sheets/

 

 


#19
Mogsam

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  • Faction: Thousand Sons

I lack the ludicrously expensive books to do it all by hand! I was burnt when the two books I do own have become outdated and replaced which seems like a waste of cash! Plus Battlescribe seems to take alot less time when I want to just tinker about, but can see why it's annoying. Like for some reason Centurions are listed above Praetors or Magnus! Gets a bit OCD on me!

 

I had picked Pyromancy as it has a few good witchfires, some templates and can often be cast through the Castallax, which means I can cast through walls on Zone Mortallis, which seems ludicrously helpful. In such small confines it seems like a decent idea to me. 

 

For the 2k list, I'll probably take the fists out and drop the paragon blade. I'm a big fan of the paragon blade, but the fists are only in for rule of cool reasons mainly as all of my sergeants either have a fist of a power axe. I don't have a lazer destroyer vindicator in my collection. I do have 2 x lazer destroyer rapiers though. I don't see the point in the Vindicator when it can be done much cheaper through the elite choices. With my 8 Heavy choices I own already, it isn't likely to be bought! I do have though:

 

Deredeo with Lascannons (for anti air)

10 Heavy Volkites

Vindicator

5 Castallax with bolters

Sicaran Punisher

 

+ What is already in the list. (Spartan, Medusa and 2 Achea Castallax)






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