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Will Grey Knights be fixed by the March FAQ?


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#76
Gentlemanloser

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Multi meltas effective range is 24".

They get a small average damage boost at 1/2 range, but remain fully effective at 24".

The Psycanno was (from its ward inception, not its original hand gun form) nothing more than an assault cannon with +1S. And a firing mode that allowed it to be useable when moving. At reduced efficiency.

It should retain the assault cannons current stats, with +1S.

All it needs is a firing mode with reduced shots that negates the -1 hit penalty for moving a heavy weapon.

Not 1/2 shots as the bonus is no longer that good. You can move and fire every heavy now anyway.

Maybe

Heavy 6, S7 AP-1 D1 or
Heavy 4, S7 AP-1 D1 no penalty to hit if moved

Heck Just keep it as is and bake in the no hit penalty.

Edited by Gentlemanloser, Yesterday, 10:34 PM.

QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#77
Schlitzaf

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Gentle that was my intention with having Pyscannons become Rapid 3 just for clarity sake. But your way works too.
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#78
Gentlemanloser

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Rapid 3 is ok, but changes the design from static/movement to get in close.

Thinking about it, my suggestion doesn't work either. There would rarely be the time you'd want to choose the 4 shot mode without penalty.

Hmmm.

I think a better solution would be Assault 3 with a special rule to shoot twice if you stand still. Much like nids have.

That would being it back to the 6 shots of an AC, and let you shoot when moving without penalty.

Edited by Gentlemanloser, Yesterday, 10:46 PM.

QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#79
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Isn’t that a rule for their Russ Equivalent?
If we wanted to stick your idea honestly Heavy 5 or Assault 3 if moving likely be the best solution.
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#80
Gentlemanloser

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Yeah Russes also have it for thier main gun.
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#81
Capt. Mytre

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Nothing here solves the lack of ranged anti-tank. You're just killing more MEQ/TEQ.

#82
Gentlemanloser

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The Psycannon wasn't ranged anti tank.

What we should be asking for is psybolt autocannons back.

And access to Mortis Dreads, which GW have denied us.

Edit. As for the Psilencer id rip the old Psycannon rule from the Daemonhunter Codex and let it ignore Invulnerable saves.

It shoots pure mind bullets. And with a low S isn't obnoxious if it ignored I saves.

Edited by Gentlemanloser, Today, 12:17 AM.

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QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#83
Schlitzaf

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Gentle that rule is a rule only given to an army “Battle Tank” (ironically GK version be either Dreadknight or a Dreadnought). Not to a weapon itself.
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#84
Gentlemanloser

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It does the same as the nids weapon beast rule (or whatever it's name is).

Remain stationary, shoot twice.

Easy to add to the weapon itself, instead of a units datasheet.

I feel it's currently the closest way to get back to the old dual profile of the ward dex psycannon.

Doesn't even need a name. Just a property of the weapon.

Edited by Gentlemanloser, Today, 12:38 AM.

QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#85
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Gentle, because the Nid units that have it, Tyrannofex and DakkaFexes are Tyranid “Line Tanks”. I’d need to double check, but I am pretty sure no BS3+ army gets that rule. And it’ll be a dangerous route to go down to give that to a weapon.
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#86
Gentlemanloser

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Why? No different if the psycannon was 48" rapid fire 3.

except That's miles better than what I'm suggesting.
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#87
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I mean I dunno as said I’d prefer 24 Rapid 3 just for simplicity or Assault 3 Heavy 5. The latter so you can advance and shoot.
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#88
Capt. Mytre

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GM, ignore what psycannons used to be. New edition, new rules, new fluff.

They can be whatever we want them to be, your limiting yourself to past editions. You can't fix GK with that thinking, when other armies are getting total rewrites of rules.

#89
Reclusiarch Darius

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Just make psycannons Damage 2. Doesn't need anything else really.

 

Psilencer is fine IMO. It's a horde clearer that still threatens 2-3W infantry like Primaris or Terminators if they fail their save. It's like a ranged force weapon, which was the intention last edition. 'Psychic Onslaught' and 'Psybolt Ammunition' just need to be 1CP instead of 2CP.


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#90
Capt. Mytre

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Just make psycannons Damage 2. Doesn't need anything else really.

Psilencer is fine IMO. It's a horde clearer that still threatens 2-3W infantry like Primaris or Terminators if they fail their save. It's like a ranged force weapon, which was the intention last edition. 'Psychic Onslaught' and 'Psybolt Ammunition' just need to be 1CP instead of 2CP.


Again, this is the issue. 2 dmg makes the psycannon the go to choice for anti-TEQ over the psilencer. It still leaves us with no ranged anti-tank that isn't vehicle mounted.

Both weapons need distinct roles with minimal overlap.

#91
Reclusiarch Darius

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As it should be, psycannon was always for killing tougher infantry and for light vehicle killing.

 

Psilencer will still be taken because D3 has the potential to blow out to 3 damage, it has two more shots and its cheaper.

 

We always had that issue in every edition, even 5th. Daemons aren't vehicles, they require overwhelming brute force and magick to destroy. Our infantry warfare doctrines represent this. Incinerator is for burning down swarms, psilencer is for tearing down tough infantry, psycannon for bringing down larger daemons. Anti-tank has always been either allied-in or brought on our vehicle pool. 


"Already, you exalt me for my triumphs, when I ask only that you remember me for my treacheries.
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Let them be my legacy to the galaxy I conquered. And my final gift to the species I failed."

Inscription upon the Arcus Daemonica, attributed to the Emperor of Mankind


#92
Gentlemanloser

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Except for they daemon engines. They're daemon vehicles. ;)
QUOTE (Seahawk @ Jul 30 2011, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We all feel different ways about different rules, but if you're traveling between different gaming groups or to tournaments, the only commonality is the rules as they are written. If you can get your opponent to agree with you on house-ruling something then that changes things, but until then all we can do is go by how things are written.

#93
Waking Dreamer

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As it should be, psycannon was always for killing tougher infantry and for light vehicle killing.

 

Psilencer will still be taken because D3 has the potential to blow out to 3 damage, it has two more shots and its cheaper.

 

We always had that issue in every edition, even 5th. Daemons aren't vehicles, they require overwhelming brute force and magick to destroy. Our infantry warfare doctrines represent this. Incinerator is for burning down swarms, psilencer is for tearing down tough infantry, psycannon for bringing down larger daemons. Anti-tank has always been either allied-in or brought on our vehicle pool. 

 

I'm hoping they change the Psycannon to D2 just like the Heavy Psycannon. If they do that I would believe that their new feedback system CAN work.

 

I agree that this slight (but hope fulfilling) change, would make all the Infantry models equipped with a psycannon (and that's a lot of models) have some actual potential on the tabletop! The Psilencer definitely has it's place against the (hopefully) new D2 Psycannon because the former's D1d3 STILL averages the same Damage per shot, but has 2 extra shots while it is 50%-83% cheaper. 

 

As mentioned, I will definitely be smiling if the Psycannon becomes D2 but personally, I would love for them to tweak it to AP-2 as well. Not in lascannon territory, but keeping with its traditional S7 and having multiple shots (4 shots and 6 shots for the H.Psyc), AP-2 is alright. It forces most vehicles to make 5+ armour save without having to burn 2CPs, and for 24" range c'mon its fair...


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